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Kuhnhenn Fourth Dementia (4D) | Kuhnhenn Brewing Company

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BA SCORE
95
world-class
449 Reviews
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BEER STATS
Reviews:
449
Ratings:
1,032
Avg:
4.26
pDev:
8.92%
 
 
Wants:
609
Gots:
215
For Trade:
24
Kuhnhenn Fourth Dementia (4D)Kuhnhenn Fourth Dementia (4D)
BEER INFO

Brewed by:
Kuhnhenn Brewing Company
Michigan, United States | website

Style: Old Ale

Alcohol by volume (ABV): 13.50%

Availability: Rotating

Notes / Commercial Description:
Previously Fourth Dementia

2009 11.8%
2010 13.5%
2011 13.5%

Added by marburg on 05-06-2003

User Reviews
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Reviews: 449 | Ratings: 1,032
Photo of MuddyFeet
3.28/5  rDev -23%
look: 3.5 | smell: 3 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3

This beer is so lifeless it reminds me of death and graveyards. Absolutely flat but it does not really take away from the appearance or mouthfeel. Brown with a bit of red in that there glass. No head, no bubbles. Could not get much from the nose even though I dug my nose way down in the glass.

Nice and sweet with lots of raisins going on. Malts are very mellow and earthy. Alcohol comes out at the end a bit--but not overly. Honestly, this beer is a bit one dimensional and kind of drab. Kind of like when you realize after the paint has dried that you picked out the wrong color for the walls. Fine and drinkable but just kind of boring and uninteresting.

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Photo of russwbeck
3.32/5  rDev -22.1%
look: 4 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 3 | feel: 2 | overall: 3

2010 Vintage

A: Pours out of the bottle a hazy brown, and sits in my glass deep brown, almost glowing, with a finger or so of light brown head. A decent amount of head remains after a while, and lacing sticks to the glass in spots. A nice amount of bubbles are noted through the muck, gathering happily beneath the head.

S: The aroma of 4D is really nice. Deep caramel and roasted malts, dark fruits, and molasses contribute to a sweet yet mellowed aroma. Some booze is noted, but not enough for me to garner it's 13.5% ABV.

T: The taste isn't quite as nice. The caramel malts and dark fruits are present as is the booze, but amazingly the taste just drops off into nowhere. The booze is offensive, but the sweetness curbs it quickly and leaves not much on the palate after the beer is gone. It's very one dimensional and just not all that impressive.

MF: I can't believe I'm going to say this, but 4D seemed to be too thin. Also, the booze is too offensive and the carbonation too low. Not much of a finish.

O: I was ready for this to be a huge beer, and it just wasn't. The ABV, I believe, was too high and took away from the Old Ale characteristics. Loved the aroma, wish the taste and feel was better.

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Photo of bobsy
3.35/5  rDev -21.4%
look: 4 | smell: 4 | taste: 3 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3

Eric's bottle from Eric. Cheers, Eric!

Pleasing appearance, as the liquid reveals itself to be a deep and luxurious mahogany with a large tan head which gradually fades, leaving clumps of foam floating in the glass. No lace though. Malt heavy aroma of caramel and sweet dark fruit. The flavour is decent, but too sugar heavy to advance beyond that. Lots of rich dark fruit (particularly raisin), and sweet malt by the bucketload. Caramel and toasty brown sugar. Just way too much sweetness, and it becomes cloying after a while. The alcohol, on the other hand, is hardly noticable. Heavy sweet and sticky mouthfeel just adds to the cloying feeling.

I'm glad to try this, but its not of the same caliber as a Thomas Hardy's or Old Stock. The sweetness is just way out of line and torpedoes some of the finer flavours lurking underneath. Perhaps time would fix this one?

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Photo of brystmar
3.37/5  rDev -20.9%
look: 3 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 3.5

2011 vintage, shared 3 ways.

Deep brown pour, super viscous, zero head. Looks like motor oil. Gives off the unmistakeably dark scent of black licorice. Also tobacco, burnt malts, booze.

Dark, burnt taste. Tons of licorice. Mild notes of ashtrays. Hints of sweet malts in there, but get quickly shushed by everything else around them. Thick, viscous body. Flavor balance here isn't particularly appealing to me, though, and I'm unconvinced that age would help in this regard.

A deeper, darker take on the Old Ale style. Glad I tried it but won't seek this out again.

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Photo of homebrew311
3.42/5  rDev -19.7%
look: 3.5 | smell: 4 | taste: 3 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3.5

A: appearance is a purpleish red, decent amount of clarity, no head, no lacing

S: bold waves of molasses, licorice, maple, and oak. This is a definite malt bomb. Notes of fruit come through, mainly raisins.

T: just like the nose suggested, this one is all about that malts. This one is skewed way towards the sweet side and features bits of earthiness and pepper, not seeming very balanced and the ABV is very present of the finish.

MF: thick body, a bit syrupy, light carbonation

O: well this beer definitely doesn't lack flavor, perhaps my palate just isn't prepared for the overload of sweet malts that this one delivered... I found it to be too sweet.

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Photo of jegross2
3.45/5  rDev -19%
look: 3.5 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 3 | overall: 3.5

Reviewing the Fourth Dementia (4D) from Kuhnhenn Brewing Company out of Michigan.
Score: 84

2011 vintage bottle served in a stemmed Hill Farmstead snifter glass and enjoyed on 05/20/12. Review is from notes.

Appearance: Pours a deep caramel color; almost like black mud. A thin layer of creamy dark khaki head settles to a thin foggy film. Poor lacing, with good retention/cling. 3.5/5

Smell: Primarily musty caramel malt with complementary notes of toffee and marshmallows. Swirling the beer reveals a little fig and brown sugar in the aroma. Modest booziness. The aroma is a bit harsh and caramel forward, but swirling before smelling seems to balance it out and make it more appealing. 3.75/5

Taste: Like the aroma, the palate is dominated by a musty and malty caramel flavor. The finish is toffee-ish. Just tons of boozy caramel/toffee/brown sugar malt here. Some fig flavor on the side of the tongue. Decent booziness to boot. 3.5/5

Mouthfeel: I am not sure if this is a bottling issue or how the beer was intended to be made, but my 4D is absolutely flat and lifeless. There is quite literally no carbonation here. Medium bodied. Super malty and just a little sugary. Syrupy-like mouthfeel. 3/5

Overall: Not a bad beer, but this brew is a far from balanced, slightly boozy sipper. I am not a fan of overly malty beers, so maybe, like Mother Of All Storms and Y2K, this just isn't my type beer. Personally, I do not understand the hype behind this one.

Recommendation: Worth trying at some point in your craft beer journey, if only to say that you've had it, but this beer is not worth seeking out unless you like boozy malt bombs (beers like Mother Of All Storms).

Pairings: Packets of Laughing Cow creamy Swiss cheese.

Cost: $8 for a 12 oz bottle.

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Photo of tayner
3.46/5  rDev -18.8%
look: 4 | smell: 3 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4 | overall: 3.5

this is my 100th beer review although i have tried many more than that! i think this one will give me my mug too..

anyway, It pours a deep brown with red highlights when back lit. small head that turned into a small ring that stayed around and laced some, not bad for a beer of 9.5%.

Smell was of a medicinal cherry flavor, one that is not too pleasing to me as well as a woody, earthy flavor. was this a barrel beer?

taste was sweet and sugary with alot of dark cherry, dark fig, and grapes.

It was thick and coating, not much hops to speak of to dry the palate. warming alcohol on the way down, and after the swallow.

I could barely finish this one with the vineous grape and cherry flavors. i wont seek this one out again, just not my thing, but very complex.

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Photo of semibaked
3.47/5  rDev -18.5%
look: 3.5 | smell: 4 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4 | overall: 2.5

Poured from a bottle to a tulip glass.

A - Pours a very dark brown with some ruby highlights, next to no carbonation bubbles, some head but goes away quickly.

S - Nice smell of raisins, tons of malt and syrupy sweetness.

T - Wow, very very sweet, kinda like alcoholic raisin syrup. I like it but a little goes a long way.

M - The consistency of syrup (spotting a trend here? :)

D - This may be too much sweetness for me, hard to get down more than a few ounces.

Glad to try it though.

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Photo of cbutova
3.5/5  rDev -17.8%
look: 3.5 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3.5

12oz 2010 vintage shared by Chico1985.

A- Red brown ale with a small silky white head. It forms and dies out fairly quickly. Spotty lace on the glass from a cloud and ring atop the beer.

S- Big caramel dark fruit with a tiny stale feel. Raisins, spice, brown sugar, toasted nuts and slight buttery notes also come to mind.

T- Fruit forward old ale with a nice caramel backdrop. Raisin, molasses and brown sugar as well.

MF- Lower end carbonation with a moderately thick and oily feel. Some alcohol warmth.

Very well hidden 13% ABV but the overall feel and flavor didn't really do it for me. Kind of light feel for the style.

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Photo of CanuckRover
3.53/5  rDev -17.1%
look: 4.5 | smell: 4 | taste: 3 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 3.25

Deep brown. Surprisingly nice head for the style, a couple fingers. Settles to a respectable film.

Big dark fruit on the nose, nice undercurrent of toffee and a bit of chocolate.

Holy sweetness. A little bit of odd, but kind of welcome, tartness to start things off, but then it's just a rush of sweet sweet fruit. There are some chocolate flavours that I really like and the slight alcohol heat near the finish is really nice, but it really needs a touch more zing to balance things out.

Mouthfeel on the other hand is just terrific. Full bodied with perfect amount of carbonation, an area where many old ales fall flat on their faces.

Some will (and obviously do) enjoy this, but too sweet for my tastes.

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Photo of nickd717
3.55/5  rDev -16.7%
look: 4 | smell: 4 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3

I reviewed this on tap and gave it an A, but this one is not going to be as pretty. bring was nice enough to share two vintages of 12oz bottles of this - the 2008 and 2009. Apparently (from the reviews and my experience) the tap and bottled versions can differ substantially. I like the tap version better.

Pours hazy reddish-orangish-amber color with a one-finger off-white head and nice lacing.

Aroma is very good, but you can sense a lot of sweetness. Super-sweet caramel and brown sugar, mild toastiness, and candied fruits.

On the flavor, this is a massive sugar bomb. Absolutely brutal. Still though, it's very tasty, in the same way candy is. Fruits abound - candied plums, figs, dates, and cherries - along with caramel, toffee, burnt brown sugar, and alcohol. The 2009 vintage is sweeter than the 2008, which has mellowed out a bit.

Palate is nice and smooth with medium-full body, but you can feel the cloying sweetness. This is almost akin to drinking syrup like they did in "Super Troopers." Very moderate booziness.

The drinkability on this one is really average at best. It's just tough to take down too much of, and I have a high sweet tolerance (although it's not as high as it used to be). Still, I wouldn't turn this beer down if you offered it to me again.

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Photo of Chico1985
3.55/5  rDev -16.7%
look: 3.5 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4 | overall: 3.5

Bottle traded by FourKicks, had right after a '99 Thomas Hardy's, old school and new school old ales back to back...

Pours dark red, mostly translucent. Beige head sticks around for a bit but succumbs to a ring, not much in the way of lace left behind.

Smell/taste - Nice but compared to the Thomas Hardy's this felt really tame. Mostly dark fruits noticeable (cherry and figs come to mind), caramel and toffee malt, slight vanilla. Mouthfeel was probably the highlight, the 13.5% is extremely well-hidden.

Good overall but nothing blew me away about it. I have another bottle to age, we'll see where that one goes.

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Photo of DoubleSimcoe
3.56/5  rDev -16.4%
look: 3 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 2 | overall: 3.5

4th D Olde Ale, bottle bought at Whole Foods Tribeca for $6.99.

Appearance: Poured into my Lost Abbey chalice, 4D pours flat like a motherfucker. No head, no carbonation, no lacing, no retention. You know the drill. This is 4D for you.

Smell: As in the bourbon-barrel version, the nose is the winner here. Intense aromas all around! Chocolate, booze, port wine. Raisins, some nuts, cola-flavored chewing gum.

Taste: Follows nose, but the flatness kind of ruins the experience. A ton of chocolate, stickiness, heavy sweetness. Pedro Ximenez. Some musty hops around. Dark fruit, caramel. Vinous qualities. Overwhelming after a while.

Mouthfeel: Pretty bad, as in the BB version. Flat, hot, sticky, unbalanced. Zero carbonation. Burning booze.

Overall: I like the BB 4D, but regular 4D really doesn't have it. It is a sweet-and-booze bomb that is begging for some balance and complexity. I love old ales (Old Stock!!) but really can't deal with this on a regular basis and probably won't buy again.

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Photo of ritzkiss
3.58/5  rDev -16%
look: 4.5 | smell: 4 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3

12oz bottle in a trade from Viggo - thanks a bunch man! 2008 vintage.

Pours a dark amber with a pillowy caramel head, actually quite a solid foam buildup for a barleywine/old ale. Doesn't leave any lacing though.

Nose is heavy, sweet caramel, bready malts, just a hint of fruit.

This is one sweet brew. As others have mentioned, this beer tastes a little more in line with an English barleywine than an old ale. Thick, syrupy caramel, brown sugar, bread, toast, flowery, a hint of alcohol in the finish (but for 12% it is remarkably well hidden), just the faintest hop bittering in the finish.

This one is too sweet for me; you can almost feel the sugar moving between your teeth. That said, it hides the alcohol really well and if you dig the really sweet brews this one would be sneaky dangerous. I found it all a little messy, not enough room for the individual flavors to shine through - just too sweet. Thanks again for the chance to try this one, Eric!

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Photo of cooncat
3.58/5  rDev -16%
look: 4 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4 | overall: 3.5

Serving was on tap at the Brew Kettle's 2008 Ogre Fest (Strongsville, OH.)

Appearance is a deep garnet color of good clarity. Minimal head and lacing, which is to be expected for a beer of this strength.

Unfortunately, this was not served in the proper glassware to extract a good sense of the true nose. What I got was light, but decidedly fruity with faint notes of alcohol. The taste is of dark fruits; raisins and plums come to mind. Supposedly, this has a 30 IBU rating, but those hops are completely hidden by the full bodied fruitiness of the sweet malts. The sweetness is almost to the point of being cloying, but doesn't cross the line ... but only by the closest margin. The sweet fruity flavor last to the end, at which time the alcohol makes a showing in some warmth. This is hard to make out as an Old ale, when it is so close to a Strong Ale and/or a barleywine. The sweetness would make for a fine after dinner drink, but I don't think you could do more than one.

An interesting offering, and Kuhnhenn certainly has produced yet another 'extreme' beer in the 4th Dimentia. Worth seeking out and trying.

Cheers

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Photo of darklordlager
3.6/5  rDev -15.5%
look: 3.5 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 2.5 | overall: 3.5

Kuhnhenn Fourth Dementia (Olde Ale 2008 Brewery Aged)
Received in a trade with Randalld quite a while ago--thanks Randall!

A: Pours with a very small amount of carbonation, a light brown with garnet hints. I think a bit of yeast may have slipped by, as I was not aware it was bottle conditioned.
3.5

S: Rich figs, dark fruit, caramel, bread pudding, alcohol. Licorice notes, and a small amount of oxidation. Maple, as it warms.
3.5

T: Layered caramel, cake-y, bready, soy sauce, salty, licorice. Butterscotch/maple syrup emerges as it warms.
3.5

M: Very thin, with very low carbonation. I would have like to see a bit more of each.
2.5

D: Hides the alcohol like a dream, but the lack of body and carbonation make it less than it could be in my opinion.
3.5

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Photo of oregone
3.63/5  rDev -14.8%
look: 4 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 3.5

A: Dark amber. Good, prodigious (surprisingly so) light cream head with solid retention.
S: Traecle, molasses and alcohol. Good, but little beyond the sweet caramelized flavors, and the booze was aparent.
T:Smell specific. Boozy in a not subtle way, though somewhat expected. Lots of dark caramel and molasses. Some caramelized orange peel and more brandy dessert flavors.
M: Best part of the brew. Carbonaion kept the huge viscocity fresh. Thick and rich but not tiresome. Sticky on the lips, but fresh on the palate.
O: Good. Would drink again, albeit not search it out. A dessert beer for sure and perhaps the size wasn't matched with enough complexity or balance for me. I love big brew, but this wasn't exciting.

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Photo of bret27
3.63/5  rDev -14.8%
look: 4 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 3.5

2007, 2+ yr old bottle.

A: Brown/amber, minimal light brown head.

S: Heavy malt sweetness

T: Bready, malty, sweet, vanilla, citrus notes, alcohol.

M: Fairly thick + full bodied.

D: Pretty thick w/alcohol presence pretty strong. So not so great.

O: Pretty good solid beer, but not mind-blowing, or something to drink all the time. Not sure if the age helps or hurts this beer. There just wasn't a whole lot of flavor coming out of it for me.

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Photo of Gmann
3.64/5  rDev -14.6%
look: 3 | smell: 4 | taste: 4 | feel: 2 | overall: 3.5

Pours a dirty cola brown color with little to no head, meh.

The aroma has an intense raisin aroma with notes of caramel and toffee. Quite sweet. Some honey and booze soaked cherries; rum cake.

The taste starts off sweet like the aroma but does have somewhat of an earthy balance. Sweet caramel, honey, and prune juice kick things off and are expected in an old ale. Then comes a wave of burnt caramel that adds some needed bitterness and a strong tea like flavor that you find in amber ales. And just as the label suggests, I get the toasted marshmellow flavor. They really nailed that one, never tasted roasted marshmellow in a beer before. Some boozy cherry sweetness as well.

The feel is a bit of a mess. It is sticky, syrupy and yet some how dry?!? Significant amount of earthy bitterness balances out the crazy sweetness but it some how really drys the beer out. Bizarre. The lingering effects not entirely pleasant. I'm really not digg'n the feel.

I dunno, the beer has some big bold flavors but they seem to contrast each other. The beer needs a bitter offset but I find that they went too dry with an acrid bitterness. Doesn't blend as an old ale should. Perhaps it needs some major aging.

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Photo of dragonWhale
3.64/5  rDev -14.6%
look: 4 | smell: 5 | taste: 3 | feel: 3 | overall: 3.5

An angry pop..like Huck Finn's father, and the glass fills.
Dark brown, a low film of carb that fades but clings to hope and moves out to the edge of the snifter.
Style says low aromatics, but this beer is anything but. A very sexy barleywinish caramel and oxidized malt characteristic. Complimentary booze aroma is exhausting in my brain. Figs dance like drunk assholes in my mouth. Why does this smell so amazing? Heard some peoples talkin some shit bout this beer, but it smells amazing.
Hard phenolics, strong booze. Sharpness, needs some more time but has the potential to amaze and bewilder even the most complicated of women (or men). Time will certainly tell the tale on this bottled contraption. The sharpness of the characteristics that may make this a fantastic beverage are the only things holding it back. Give this vintage 3 years, it should be amazing. My needs involve picking up another bottle or 3.
2010 vintage..

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Photo of EnemyWithin
3.65/5  rDev -14.3%
look: 3 | smell: 3 | taste: 4 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 4

2010 4D Olde Ale into Duvel tulip.

Appearance - 3

Red amber with very small creamy golden head, just forming a thin rim around the circumference.

Smell – 3.5

Very malty. Molasses, brown sugar, sticky sweet malt with notes candy sugar. Spicy aroma with booze notes.

Taste - 4

Starts with a caramel, toffee body with a presence of alcohol. Near the end, a spike of brown sugar and spice, with just a mild bitterness at the end. Get a fair amount of warmth from the alcohol, but not overly powerful. Flavours improves as beer warms and opns – flavours soften up and become much improved.

Mouthfeel – 3.5

Moderate thickness, a littly sticky, not really creamy. Wondering if the little carbonation is typical. A bit of astringency from the hops.

Overall - 4

A sipper, for sure! A nice beer that shows significant improvement as it warms up. Not a style that I've had before, but in many ways it reminds me of a barley wine. At first, put off but as I tasted it more, began to enjoy it. Would have again, especially during winter. Recommend.

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Photo of CaseyK
3.66/5  rDev -14.1%
look: 4.5 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 3.5 | overall: 3

Thanks to mbrasi for the extra. 2009 version.
A: A reddish brown color, pours a slightly brown creamy head. A nice looking beer, looks dark and delicious.

S: Dark fruits and a sweet taste, caramel. Smells like this is going to taste boozy.

T: Taste starts out sweet, malt and caramel dominate. Then the flavor moves on to a strong dark fruit flavor, I'd say raisins. Dark fruit taste lingers on the tongue long after your sip. This beer is too sweet in my opinion but the flavors are interesting.

M: Full bodied and a bit sticky from the sweetness.

D: I'm really enjoying this beer, but the ABV is very obvious and I couldn't see myself drinking more than one at a time.

O: Overall I'm glad I got to try this beer, I'd been interested in it for a while now.

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Photo of kkipple
3.67/5  rDev -13.8%
look: 3.5 | smell: 4 | taste: 4 | feel: 3 | overall: 3

My buddy snagged a bottle of this at DLD 2008 and was kind enough to break it out near the end of a recent tasting. From notes:

A. Dingy, not quite clear brown. Soupy. Lingering 2cm tan head. Not much active carbonation.

S. Hmm, classic Kuhnhenn over-the-top nose. Lucious and sweet with loads of sugar from all different colors. Pine-like and bitter from a large amounts of hops that haven't died out yet. Some chocolate and plums are lurking in there too... oh yeah, and a distinct boozy, barleywine like aroma. Complex, but a little hot and doesn't come together *quite* as well as it could.

T. How unusual... this is very aggressive and flavorful. Bitter hops, sweet syrupy caramel and some nearly sour, tart fruit (or fermentation character) all are on stage here. Surprisingly hoppy and bold for an old ale, perhaps this is a young bottle? A little oxidized and sherry like too. Cherries are hidden under the pile of other flavors, oddly. Overall it's brash and eye opening. Sweetness is a bit over the top (like a lot of Kuhnhenn's brews), but ok for the style. This is good, but young and rough.

M. Warm, boozy, sticky and generally dense. Finishes bittersweet and sugary / hoppy.

D. Not so great. Too much going on that doesn't mesh well. Fourth Dementia is likely a decent sipper for a cold night, but I also bet it improves greatly with a couple years.

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Photo of Retail1LO
3.68/5  rDev -13.6%
look: 4 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4 | overall: 4

From notes on 4/4/12

Pours a garnet/ruddy reddish brown with a 1 finger head via a vigorous pour. Rich plum scent w/ other dark fruits. Brown sugar. Also some caramel and vanilla. Pretty underwhelming, really. Taste is sweet and boozy, slightly astringent. More dark fruits and brown sugars. Tasty indeed. The mouth is smooth with an odd sweet/tart thing going on. Some mild heat and a touch of bitterness. Solid beer that goes down way too easily for being 13.5%

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Photo of Pencible
3.68/5  rDev -13.6%
look: 4 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 4 | overall: 3

2008 vintage. This poured a hazy reddish mahogany with lots of light tan head. It smelled like earthy cocoa and musty roasted barley, with some coffee and cream and molasses. It tasted like super sweet prunes and molasses and raisins, with some honey wheat and rich brown sugar. This is the definition of cloying sweetness. It was somewhat thick with a bit of carbonation, and had a lasting bittersweet aftertaste. Overall this had a strange scent for an old ale, with a powerful taste that wasn't very complex but instead just a barrage of sweet dark fruits. It had good body, and hid the alcohol fairly well. But this really needs to be sipped due to all the sugar. A decent beer, but not really one of my favorite old ales.

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Kuhnhenn Fourth Dementia (4D) from Kuhnhenn Brewing Company
95 out of 100 based on 449 ratings.