El Cedro - Jester King Brewery

Not Rated.
El CedroEl Cedro

Educational use only; do not reuse.
BA SCORE
91
outstanding

485 Ratings
THE BROS
-
no score

(send 'em beer!)
Ratings: 485
Reviews: 66
rAvg: 4.06
pDev: 10.84%
Wants: 57
Gots: 85 | FT: 7
Brewed by:
Jester King Brewery visit their website
Texas, United States

Style | ABV
Saison / Farmhouse Ale |  8.00% ABV

Availability: Rotating

Notes & Commercial Description:
Beer added by: lokieman on 01-11-2013

Farmhouse ale hopped with piney, citrusy American hops, aged on Spanish Cedar spirals, and bottle conditioned with Brettanomyces yeast. Unfiltered, unpasteurized and naturally conditioned.
Beer: Ratings & Reviews
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Ratings: 485 | Reviews: 66
Reviews by jlindros:
Photo of jlindros
3.95/5  rDev -2.7%
look: 4 | smell: 4 | taste: 4 | feel: 4 | overall: 3.75

From my notes at one of the big beer share events.

Light fizzy fluffy head, hazy golden pilsner color.

Nose brings Brett, funk but not too crazy, lemon peel, lemongrass, citrus, piney earthy hop note, little cedar like wood as well.

Taste cedar wood again but thankfully not too sharp, more brett funk, little bready and doughy, some toasty malt like notes and lemongrassy flavors, grassy and doughy, into lemon peel, mild citrus, almost a grapefruit pith but not quite. Finish is dry, fairly bitter, grainy bready, little more Brett funk and cedar chips.

Mouth is med bod, lots of carb, hint warming booze.

Overall interesting but not as great as some of the other JK beers.

More User Reviews:
Photo of dcmchew
4.52/5  rDev +11.3%
look: 4.75 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 4.5 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 4.5

Looks beautiful in the glass, a nice hazy shiny pure golden colour, with a hug, fluffy white head. Nice retention and tons of lacing.
Smells just like it looks, a rich enchanting fruity hoppiness, with lots of tangerine, apricot, pineapple, mango, pomelo, with some nice tart cider apples and yellow cherries. The Brett yeasts (+cedar) really hit if you let it settle a bit, with a rather unique kind of funk, lots of white and pink pepper, old white wine barrel stave, twigs, with a rich herbal-floral note, mostly lavender and lemongrass.
As complex as the smell was, the taste is even more. This is just stupid! The start is a big blossomed hop cone punch, piney, floral, bitter, on top of which the farmhouse yeasts bring their own show, with moldy wood, lots of pepper, dried grass and green hay, big crunchy herbal notes, hinting at moth balls (just to sum it up). There's also some lactic acidity, with a light tartness. The cedar spirals bring a different type of woody finish than the usual oak, with a stronger, somewhat fresher stave note, more tannic and i think it also pumped up the bitterness.
There's lots of bitter citrus peel in the taste, but some nice sweet (!) tropical notes show up only in the aftertaste. Bitterness, cedar and a mellow Brett feel also, slowly fading away. Medium body, smooth carbonation, a chewy kind of beer.
This was something else. I can definitely understand why the farmhouse/wild ales are on such a roll. Big complex monster, but not too rough, hugely refreshing. And i'm sure there are plenty more out there for me this summer.

Photo of Beerandraiderfan
4.13/5  rDev +1.7%
look: 3.75 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4

Thanks to koufax21 for bringing this beer to March Madness 2013. Marquette Elite 8 baby!

Pours out a copper, golden and light orangey type of liquid. Small head on it, 1/3". Aromatics really hit you with the cedar and brett. Pretty nice right there. But wait, there's more! Hops. The hop bouquet seems primarily Cascade. Nice mix going on right there.

Its not quite Bitter Monk territory, but the taste function of the hops, cedar and brett really are enjoyable. Lacks the tartness and overall hoppy nouveau of the Monk, but this one is quite good in and of itself, even if it lacks the aggressiveness of style leader here. This one is more like an ipa than a saison in my opinion.

Mouthfeel had just the right carbonation to let three distinct tastes exist in harmony, nobody muscling the other out. Bitterness just right, plenty of wood, good very dry finish. The mix of cedar wood and pine hop flavor is pretty cool. A peppery edge to it as well.

Pretty complex and enjoyable beer. Screw David Hurley at the El Dorado for flip flopping over their committal to support out bottle share the entire week. I won't be recommending anyone have anything to do with the El Dorado ever again if we're gonna play that way. I give you money, you give me your word, you lie and go back on your word, I'm never going to give you money again.

Support craft beer. Respect craft beer. El Dorado Casino in Reno supports neither. But we did get this beer drank before the dishonesty took hold in a guy in a cheap $79 suit who manages a crappy bar.

Photo of Sammy
3.79/5  rDev -6.7%
look: 3.75 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 3.75 | overall: 3.75

Refreshing and integrated ideas. A bit much wood, it impedes drinkability somewhat. maybe that would mellow, but I’m afraid the hops would to and I wanted something hoppy. Brett and farmhouse nicely in the aroma and finish. Enormous lasting foamy head and thick lace. Thanks Beerenberger.

Photo of thagr81us
3.75/5  rDev -7.6%
look: 3.75 | smell: 3.75 | taste: 3.75 | feel: 3.75 | overall: 3.75

Served from bottle into a Jester King goblet (proper). Poured a slightly hazy yellow-orange with a three finger off-white head that grew and eventually subsided to one finger after sitting for quite some time. Maintained phenomenal lacing throughout the glass. The aroma was comprised of sweet malt, cedar, citrus, funk, and earth. The flavor was of sweet malt, citrus, fruit, wood, earth, and big funk. It had a light feel on the palate with high carbonation. Overall this was a pretty decent brew. The combination of the cedar and funk was a definite new one on me to this degree especially when mixed with the saison aspect. This made for a quite refreshing brew that was very easy to drink on a nice day of weather in my area. Definitely worth your time.

Photo of dvmin98
3.8/5  rDev -6.4%
look: 4 | smell: 4 | taste: 3.5 | feel: 4 | overall: 4

This held true to the description. So much cedar. It was like I was in our cedar closet that we had when I was a kid. Should rename is No Moths. One of those beers that I'm glad I tried, but 4 oz was more than plenty.

Photo of Rutager
4.08/5  rDev +0.5%
look: 4.25 | smell: 4.25 | taste: 4 | feel: 4 | overall: 4

Thanks willandperry! Love me some Jester King. Batch #2.

Appearance. Pours a hazy gold with 4, yes 4 fingers of white head that lasts a good while and leaves some nice lace behind.

Smell. Cedar, Tropical fruits (mango and papaya mainly), pine and yellow grapefruit rind. Very aromatic and complex.

Taste. Sweet yellow grapefruits and cedar, a bit of melon and tropical fruit. Really not getting much else, but not much else is needed.

Mouthfeel. Medium body, medium carbonation.

Overall. Very interesting and again, very aromatic.

Photo of Phyl21ca
4.75/5  rDev +17%
look: 4.75 | smell: 4.75 | taste: 4.75 | feel: 4.75 | overall: 4.75

Bottle: Poured a light dirty beige color ale with a giant white foamy head with good retention and some lacing. Aroma of fruity hops with light mango notes with dry Brett notes and some light spicy notes form the cedar. Taste is also dominated by light mango fruity notes with some spicy notes from the cedar and the dry aftertaste and funky notes from the yeast. Body is full with limited filtration and good carbonation and no apparent alcohol. Incredible amount of complexity can be found in this beer but it also retains an extremely high level of drinkability.

Photo of EgadBananas
4.18/5  rDev +3%
look: 4.25 | smell: 4.25 | taste: 4.25 | feel: 4 | overall: 4

Dark orange, hazy, white head, two fingers, plenty lace. Brett funk aroma, with a spicy wood note, floral notes. Citrus tones too. Spice notes on the taste, some herbal, spicy wood notes, Bretty hay notes, mild lactic note, biscuits, light colored fruits, citrus zest. Not really crisp, medium body.

Overall, nice funk a delic brew!

Photo of smakawhat
4.62/5  rDev +13.8%
look: 4.5 | smell: 5 | taste: 4.5 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 4.5

Poured from the bottle into a tulip glass.

A bit of a dull lemon body color, but opaque and even throughout, with just the mild appearance of some columnar middle rising carbonation. Big thick and fluffy to creamy rocking head. Clumped out like shampoo and a big mountain capped range. Thick and clingy lots of staying power, and nicely following up with a few white streams coming up the sides. Great looking saison.

Fantastic aroma. Huge fruit notes of tropical pineaplle with a cedar wood box like action. Juiced front with big notes of fresh fruit quality, cigar box aromas, white pepper mild heat and softness, and leafy mild pipe tobacco. Bouquet is just really pleasing, a wonderful combination that seems to bounce of each other and balance nicely, with neither one dominating but you can easily move between to enjoy.

Palate brings the goods, but just a taste of the unexpected. Much more pepper hot front, that really get amplified with this great cedar dusty flavor in the mid palate. The pineapple and tropical juices flow next, big and expressive and coat all over. A bit more heat and hot like yeast comes out more which the cedar really seems to amplify. Big funk notes and tones, with lots of farmhouse expression and tingly carbonation. Moderate hop bitterness, but definitely more farmhouse control, and lovely tropical accents that finish on the swallow.

A real fascinating brew, delicious and full of flavor. It goes a little off to extreme just slightly but manages to pull back itself to terra firma while drinking. Minor improvements, but comes to splitting hairs. Real fun too. Such a sucker for good use of cedar in a beer.

Photo of GreesyFizeek
3.87/5  rDev -4.7%

Bottle shared by Justin last night.

Pours incredibly foamy, with a huuuuuge head, that only settles about half an hour later. There's a good amount of lacing.

It smells incredibly cedar-y (duh), with lots of Bretty funk, and citrus.

The cedar aspect of this beer is, as the name implies, the big ticket item here. It's overwhelming, but ultimately works. The Brett is a secondary player, but clearly noticeable, funky and leathery. As the beer warms, the cedar becomes even more overpowering, sort of tasting like playground wood chips. Not good. Drink this one a bit colder for best results.

This one is medium bodied, with a slightly creamy mouthfeel, and a low amount of carbonation.

One of the more unique saisons I've had, the cedar is slightly too forward for me, though.

Photo of Immortale25
3.83/5  rDev -5.7%
look: 4 | smell: 4 | taste: 3.75 | feel: 3.75 | overall: 3.75

Much respect to Cvescalante for giving me my first Jester King. Poured into a Dogfish Spiegelau glass.

A- And foam fills up the glass from a soft pour. The body that's visible is a semi-hazy medium golden. As the head descends, a large, flat nipple protrudes and there are cobwebs of lacing surrounding. Eventually, the head settles at an 1/8 inch with various bumps among the surface foam.

S- Delightful cedar aroma wafts out of the bouquet with full force. Upon further sniffs, the Brett is detected and is a beautiful compliment to the cedar...at first. Soon the Brett/cedar combo dive into this odd soapy smell that clashes together. Then comes the alcohol and degrades things even more. Everything combined gives it a very bright aroma but I'm not sure if I enjoy it. The hops lay over all elements in the profile to provide some sort of template for what's going on but it's still not quite balanced. Every sniff tells a different story, so I give it extra points for complexity.

T- Strange. First there's cedar and immediately after comes the Brett funk, then it turns to a tart aftertaste before just cutting off. The hops provide a decent bitterness but the cedar is pretty overpowering and the lingering flavor of the Brett just confuses my palate even further. Alcohol and hops begin to dominate as the beer warms.

M- Dry, with a lasting hop bite. Body's on the lighter side with medium-high carbonation.

O- I don't find it unenjoyable to drink, but it's also not my idea of what a beer aged on cedar should be like. Although it is a creative hybrid of flavors, there's too much going on at once and makes for a frenetic drinking experience. The blurb on the side label had me cracking up though.

Photo of angrybabboon
3.93/5  rDev -3.2%
look: 4.5 | smell: 4 | taste: 3.75 | feel: 4 | overall: 4

Consumed 4/7/13

Cheers to Goblinmunkey7 for sharing this beer

Appearance: Somewhere between medium amber and orange - hazy and cloudy - quite a gigantic head, fades to a (still big), fluffy white cap, leaves blobs of lacing

Smell: Rich cedar and some funk, a rather interesting combination - the cedar is quite obvious and quite interesting - some citrusy and piney hops on top of that - some funky Brett, tart, yeasty - fruity, earthy, with some wet horse

Taste: So much going on, in a good way - woody, chewy, distinctly weird cedar flavor - quite potent, but doesn't totally overwhelm the flavor - some earthy, yeasty funkiness - some hay, some dry, tart Brett - some spiciness - hops appear mostly in the aftertaste (post cedar), with some nice citrus and some pine

Mouthfeel: On the heavy side of medium, excellently carbonated, smooth, with somewhat of a dry, earthy finish

Overall: Weird, weird, weird... and good

This is quite strange. Anything with cedar reminds me of a cedar chest that my parents use to store sweaters, so my usual response to the smell is "this is not drinkable." But after I get over that, it's quite intriguing. Aside from the cedar, there's so much going on here. Funky, earthy, citrusy, piney, and interesting.

Photo of twiggamortis420
4.22/5  rDev +3.9%
look: 4.25 | smell: 4 | taste: 4.25 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 4.25

750 mL bottle pours a heavily hazed gold color with a plentiful cap of white head. Nice retention and lacing, pretty damn good looking beer here.

Nose is stronger on the brett than I anticipated and the cedar wood plays along quite well with it. Lemony, tart, slight funk and cedar planks. Hops are strangely tropical and fruity...one would probably have expected something piney. It all works nicely though, impressed so far.

Taste is an excellent blend of hop flavor and brett. The citra hops stand out to me and I probably would have guessed Sorachi with the mad lemon flavors I am getting, though I see that is not one of the hops used. The wood is subdued, which is surprising with the combination of cedar and brett. The brett is lighter on the flavor than it was on the nose, but still imparts both funk and dry tartness. Yeast does more than it appears, I think, with lots of traditional saison flavors oozing out of the brett and wood facade. Mouthfeel is light and airy due to the light malt bill, but the fine carbonation gives it a smooth, buttery feel that is very nice. I have not been this impressed by a JK beer in awhile...I did not expect to like this beer as much as I do...I really dont have a single bad thing to say about it. An excellent example of a saison, well done JK...well done indeed.

Photo of brewtus
4.71/5  rDev +16%
look: 4.5 | smell: 4.75 | taste: 4.75 | feel: 4.5 | overall: 4.75

Poured into wine glass. Pours hazy orange with a huge white frothy head. Smell is peppery, citrusy hops, oak, some orange, some lavander, very funky. Tastes is very earthy, lots of Saison funk, plenty of juicy west coast hops, tons of cedar flavor, some subtle citrus fruit, again I bet lavander, some rosemary. Perfect amount of carbonation. This beer is certainly very complex, hoppy but funky, the cedar comes through very nicely but doesn't over power the farmhouse flavors. The hops are also perfectly balanced. S glad I got to try this. A unique brew that exceeded my expectations .

Photo of MNishCT77
4.38/5  rDev +7.9%
look: 4.5 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 4.25 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4.5

4 oz. on tap in the brewery's outdoor tasting station on Sat., 12/27/2014, unknown brewing/packaging dates, poured into a small bottom wine glass, drank over ~30 minutes

Photo of Nagorg
4.19/5  rDev +3.2%
look: 3.5 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 4 | overall: 4.5

The first few bottles I enjoyed had this beer as one of my favorites. It was a delicious IPA with very interesting character imparted from the cedar. This cedar character gave a beautiful nose and the flavor really blended nicely with the hops. This beer also has brett added and the related sourness was barely noticeable.
However, a couple that I've recently acquired have a much higher degree of sourness from the brett and it really seems like a different beer. I suppose this type of inconsistency might be expected from Jester King given the small and unique batches they brew as well as the use of naturally occurring resources from the area.
I do appreciate this recent bottling but I would much like to have that first experience again. Guess I'll have to keep buying this beer in hopes that day will come again!

Photo of zac16125
4.1/5  rDev +1%
look: 4.25 | smell: 4.25 | taste: 4 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4

750mL bottle into a tulip
Batch 1- Bottled Nov 2012

A: Pours a slightly hazy, golden, dark straw color with a huge 3plus fingers width of dense sea foam white colored head. Leaves tons of thick lacing down the sides of the glass.

S: Aromas of lemon, brett funk like barnyard and wet hay. Im surprised by the amount of lemon-lime citrus. One I get past that, the cedar notes do come out, although not as prominent as I anticipated. Very nice aroma though.

T: Cedar is much more prevalent in the taste, and is the first flavor I get. This is followed by some herbaceous and light citrus hoppy notes, and some piney bitterness on the finish. Initially I get little to no brett notes in the flavor, but as it warms some barnyard, manure-like characters come out.

M/D: Medium body, moderately heavy carbonation, crisp. No hint of the ABV. Drinkability is good.

O: Overall, a good beer but it didnt blow me away. Interesting combination of hoppy and heavy cedar notes, with a touch of brett funkiness. Im glad I tried this one, but its not something Ill add to the regular rotation.

Photo of titty_mcbitty
4.17/5  rDev +2.7%
look: 4.75 | smell: 4 | taste: 4.25 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4

A: foggy dirty golden yellow. Huge white creamy head. Lacing is very prominent.

S: Cedar definitely. Hops, brett, And bread.

T: Cedar wood is prominent. It's a nice touch. Hops, wheat, lemon juice, seedy bread, toast, caramel, and malt.

M: medium. Not very light either.

O: this was lovely. Not as great as the Mad Meg but a very nice brew. The flavor is insane and unique. Overall, an awesome beer.

Photo of JohnCassillo
3.94/5  rDev -3%
look: 4 | smell: 4.25 | taste: 3.75 | feel: 3.75 | overall: 4

Received 750 ml bottle in trade (thanks again, Tim!). Poured into large tulip glass.

A - Very frothy head layers over a dark golden body. Mostly opaque, with plenty of visible carbonation.

S - Orange, grapefruit and a touch of sugar. Got a bit of woodchip from the cedar aging as well.

T - A lot of citrus notes, with a cedar bitterness; matches the smell completely.

M - Crisp, carbonated and even a bit earthy.

O - Very drinkable Saison with an ABV that isn't necessarily obvious at the first few sips. In terms of style, it's a unique take, while also keeping to its standard principles. More cedar would have made it more unique, but in this case, that doesn't take away from quality.

Photo of champ103
3.31/5  rDev -18.5%
look: 4 | smell: 3.5 | taste: 3 | feel: 3.25 | overall: 3.5

On tap at Hay Merchant.

A: Pours a cloudy, deep hazed orange color. A two finger white head rises and sticks around for a minute. Good lace is left behind.
S: At first, I think I get a burst of Citrus hops, though that fades and is over come by the barrel. Just cedar and wood from here on out. Even Thompson Water Seal.
T: Nothing but fresh cedar wood. That water seal character in the nose is here in spades as well. Nothing else.
M/D: A light to moderate body. Fairly thin overall, though on par with many of Jester Kings other offerings. Not hard to drink if I wanted to. Though it took me a while to get through this.

There is not much here. All I get is basically cedar wood, along with an irritating Thompson Water Seal character.

Photo of HuskyinPDX
4.1/5  rDev +1%
look: 4.25 | smell: 4.25 | taste: 4 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4

Bottle opened on 5.19.13
Batch #2 Jan 2013
Thanks John

A - Pours a hazy medium orange with a huge light tan, foamy head with good retention.

S - Brett, hoppy citrus, pine, and some cedar.

T - Lots of Brett, tons of cedar, pine and some citrus. The Cedar really comes out as it warms.

D - Tons of carbonation with a light body.

O - Lots of Brett, more cedar as it warms. Pine Citrus finishes it out.

Photo of avalon07
4.4/5  rDev +8.4%
look: 4.25 | smell: 4.25 | taste: 4.5 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4.5

A: Poured from a bottle to a pint glass. Had a yellow-brown color and a cloudy consistency. There was a two inch head, long-lasting head. Very good lacing.

S: A surprisingly sweet, fruity aroma, with some traces of hops as well.

T: Like the aroma, there was a good amount of fruit (mango especially). A fair shot of hops, along with the advertised brettanomyces and slight funkiness make for an interesting combination. A light, vibrant, complex flavor.

M: A good amount of carbonation with a smooth, prickly finish. Light-bodied.

O: Not your typical saison, but certainly an interesting take on it. Very drinkable.

Photo of dar482
4.63/5  rDev +14%
look: 4.5 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 4.75 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4.75

The beer comes in a dark orange color.

The aroma is tons of citrus hops and cedar. A breadiness, some yeast, Brett funk.

The flavor is just fantastic. The flavor hits in the front of citrus and tropical notes. Then it moves onto Brett and funk. Then onto that drying aggressive cedar note. Huge complexity as this beer moves on throughout its multiple flavors and transitions very well.

A very dry beer as the cedar and wood attacks on the finish.

An absolutely gorgeous beer in the sense that it is so different. It combines each element extremely well.

Photo of kojevergas
3.01/5  rDev -25.9%
look: 3 | smell: 3.25 | taste: 3 | feel: 3 | overall: 2.75

Batch #4. - bottled July 23rd, 2013. 8.0% ABV confirmed per the label. OG: 1.062. FG: 1.002. IBU: 42. Brewed with Millenium, Cascade, Columbus, Citra, and Simcoe hops. Refrigerated since I purchased it last week at me local HEB Grocery. 1 pint 9.4 fl oz brown glass bottle with interesting label art and branded pressure cap served into a Spaten stangenglas in me gaff in low altitude Austin, Texas. Reviewed live. Expectations are high given the brewery's reputation. Reviewed as a farmhouse ale because it identifies as a "farmhouse table beer" on the label.

I really do love the creative art on the actual cap; there's a lot of attention to detail there and it's fun.

Served cold - straight from me fridge. Side-poured with standard vigor as no carbonation issues are anticipated.

A: No bubble show forms as I pour.

Pours a five finger wide head of supple white colour. Nice creaminess and thickness. Good even lacing as the head recedes. Head retention is good - about 7 minutes. Body colour is a somewhat cloudy clear yellow-pale copper. Average vibrance. No yeast particles are visible.

Overall, I'm a bit surprised by its clarity. How is Jester King getting their farmhouse ales so clear if they're truly not filtering them?

Sm: Clove, pilsner malt, clean barley, straw, cedar wood, and a light funkiness from the brettanomyces yeast. Peach fruit. Some white pepper. Honey. Allspice. Pine and floral notes from the hops. Bursts of subdued citrusy fruit. and accompanying rinds. The cedar aging does seem to complement whatever the base was nicely here; it's a refreshing take on the style.

A pleasant aroma of moderate strength, featuring some nice subtlety.

No alcohol or off-notes are detectable.

T: Plenty of cedar wood and biting piney hop character throughout, creating a clash of sweetness and bitterness that is never satisfactorily resolved. Honey, cream, funky brettanomyces yeast character, floral hop character, grassiness, clean barley, straw, light white pepper, and assorted citrusy notes including a touch of lemon, peach, and assorted citrusy rinds. Pilsner malts, lightly oniony simcoe hops. Wheat. The core imbalance throws off the whole flavour profile, but I can find individual elements I enjoy. The cedar in particular is interesting, but I can't decide whether or not I actually like it. In any case, I'm surprised by how prominent that flavour is given only spirals (not an actual barrel) were used. As it warms, I get some grapeskin and sour apple. Estery and phenolic.

Depth of flavour is average for the style. Duration and intensity of flavour are above average, but the best beers in the style emphasize complexity and subtlety, not intensity or extremity. Overhopped for the style. Some alcohol is noticeable.

Overall, I do like it for what it is.

Mf: Smooth and wet. Sticky and a bit nectary. Just a biteen overcarbonated. Suits the flavour profile generally well, but doesn't come off custom-tailored to it. Decent presence on the palate. Decent body. Powdery

Not oily, hot, gushed, or harsh.

Dr: A downable beer that could hide its ABV better. Far from a paragon for the farmhouse style, but I applaud the experimentation with cedar. I'm unimpressed with it and wouldn't buy it again or recommend it to friends, but I'll easily kill the bottle by myself. A middling offering from Jester King, a brewery which I am increasingly viewing as more famous for its marketing than the quality of its beers.

High C

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El Cedro from Jester King Brewery
91 out of 100 based on 485 ratings.