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Report bad trader for botched IP trade?

Discussion in 'Beer Trading Talk & Help' started by jsboots21, Jul 31, 2014.

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  1. cavedave

    cavedave Champion (940) New York Mar 12, 2009

    Those ten seconds tragically never appear when someone blows someone else off for a trade, and magically always appear when their user name appears in a thread on this forum.

    Glad to hear this is on the way to being settled.
     
  2. bruindre

    bruindre Savant (495) Massachusetts Jun 20, 2009

    Add me to the list of @IPAFan521 supporters. Traded with him before - dude was prompt and generous. Would give him benefit of the doubt here.
     
  3. CTJman

    CTJman Advocate (705) Connecticut Jan 14, 2013

    Magically appear assuming by the time they log into BA they are prob free. As stated he hadn't even been on BA .

    And not arguing. Just saying

     
    Indytruks138, IPAFan521 and Houser like this.
  4. tommyz

    tommyz Advocate (510) Michigan May 28, 2007

    That does not matter as he KNEW he was supposed to trade, regardless of being on here or not.....With all that said, Im glad this is getting taken care of...We ALL need to remember that if we set up a trade to keep communication going...That is all...And it seems @IPAFan521 is a stand up guy....
     
    JavaNoire and cavedave like this.
  5. cavedave

    cavedave Champion (940) New York Mar 12, 2009

    Also not arguing, but if you don't have ten seconds to text someone you def should not be trading.
     
  6. CTJman

    CTJman Advocate (705) Connecticut Jan 14, 2013

    @cavedave No I know. But trading aside there's been work trips where my wife texted and called and I forgot to respond til I was back in the hotel BC work. Just life. And yes I'm also partial to @IPAFan521 bc I know what a great dude he is and know he will resolve it

    Cheers, good morning and have a beer
     
    miketd likes this.
  7. While I am glad @IPAFan521 replied and that many people vouched for him, and I'm sure he's been awesome to all of you, but this whole thing is just unsettling for me and my confident in ever trading with him. If he were to post a thread saying that he'll come to the Philly area and interested in a trade, I would unlikely contact him even I had the beer.

    If I lugged a bunch of beer to a different state for a trade, expecting a trade, knowing that my trade partner is expecting a trade from me...and I know I can't come through, I absolutely don't care how busy I am, I'm going to go absolutely out of my way to ensure that my trading partner know well before or (very unlikely) immediately after. From Sunday to Thursday when the OP made the post, that's 4 nights and 5 days that you're staring at the beers you brought for the trade (at the hotel or back at home, whatever) so I just find it utterly unbelievable that anyone can be "too busy" until his reputation is at risk by a bad trader thread. I will always wonder how many more days it would take for a trader to unbusy himself had a thread not come up? (Not talking specifically at IPAFan521, but in general for any trader)

    Communication is everything and that takes priority over everything, short of life-altering/stopping events. I don't know, maybe I'm just a hard ass, but that's my personal feeling.
     
  8. jsboots21

    jsboots21 Savant (280) Tennessee Jan 19, 2009

    Apparently quite a bit has happened since I went to bed last night...

    First of all, I'm glad you're alive and well @IPAFan521. When someone goes dark, I tend to assume the worst and in this case I became legitimately concerned that something might have happened to you.

    Regarding this trade, I will not be leaving bad feedback. More than anything at this point I was searching for the reason that this happened. The reason was provided and is understandable. While I believe he should have contacted me as a courtesy to say he would not be available the night we planned to meet, he didn't and that is that. No one was really hurt, so there's no no need to drag this out further.

    I will not be seeking free beer from him or anyone. Definitely was not looking to use this thread to seek charity; just wanted to see how the community treats these kinds of mishaps.

    @F2brewers I hope this satisfies what you were looking for. Cheers to everyone who contributed helpful thoughts and advice!
     
    billhelm, mythaeus and Dicers like this.
  9. IPAFan521

    IPAFan521 Savant (460) Illinois Jan 20, 2013

    That would require having the time to also log into here and retrieve the number. I do not have the ability to pull my log in report on here, but honestly, from the time I flew out of Chicago, to the time I landed in Nashville I believe I logged in one time and that was to tell him I was in Nashville and wanted to see (if by chance) he was available on the fly before I expected trade day.

    I don't believe he had my number, so texting me directly would not be a possibility for him.

    see above

    He has still not sent me his address...should a new bad trader thread be started???









    not srs

    see above and thanks for calling me a dick...









    also not srs

    BOOM

    I am

    Did not...ask my wife. Forgot to text her 10-15 times throughout the trip. Including Tuesday night after teardown (phone screenshot of text message from wife calling me out for not letting her know I was back at the room available if needed as well) also have the one right after that with her calling me out a second time for not calling her up until I was already in the cab headed back to the airport.






    SRS


    BOOM


    This one bothers me as I see you in these threads all the time and you appeared to be an intelligent man.

    The "victim" did not travel with beer. I did. Don't you think it was in my best interest to get rid of the 4 bottles I brought with and get the one bottle from him? (Yes, I traveled with extras and a bottle for his bottle share) I could have bought another coffee mug or something else for a family member.

    Keep you beer though...




    @jsboots21 - still waiting on that address

    Cheers and S&T
     
    Houser, miketd and ufmj like this.
  10. Mag00n

    Mag00n Savant (380) New York Nov 21, 2008

    Thank you. All the 'vouches' are ridiculous. So he came through in the past, thats nice. Mikesgroove was once a top and well respected trader here, really means nothing to the current situation. OP set up a tasting just for this guy and he no called no showed, that is quite rude at the very least. Not to mention the trade. Glad its resolved though.
     
    JavaNoire likes this.
  11. Mag00n

    Mag00n Savant (380) New York Nov 21, 2008

    I think his point was since you were travelling with the beer you had a constant reminder of the deal whenever you were in the hotel room. Whatever.

    I get emails anytime I get a BM on here and I can even read the content of the BM through my email on my phone. No logging into BA. I thought that was the norm/default. Its pretty convenient.
     
    JavaNoire and mythaeus like this.
  12. IPAFan521

    IPAFan521 Savant (460) Illinois Jan 20, 2013


    Remember what happens when you assume...

    I still want to send you beer because that is the only reason this was posted to begin with otherwise the title would have been: Has anyone seen or heard from IPAFan521? In that case you would have received great feedback in regards to how I roll, but you didn't. you wanted your beer which I get so just BM me you address. You will get what you want.

    Like I said, after I sent you a message and didn't hear back right away, I did not even log into BA until I returned home from work late last night to the IPAFan bashing thread you started.

    @F2brewers ...I think we can close this down once I have his address. It's a wrap...

    Luckily for me I was able to hop on here right before I went to bed tonight so everyone knew I was ok.

    It's just beer...

    Cheers!
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2014
    Houser and ufmj like this.
  13. ufmj

    ufmj Savant (395) Florida Feb 15, 2013

    The OP and his group still got together to share/enjoy good beer.
     
  14. @Mag00n got it. That's what boggled me. Even for an intelligent man like myself, this did not compute for me with regard to failed communication. Sorry.
     
  15. cavedave

    cavedave Champion (940) New York Mar 12, 2009

    Well looks like IPA whatever has all the excuses lined up nicely. Excuses are like opinions, every one has one, and they all stink. so you did this and had an excuse why you didn't do that. Here are the facts. He screwed up. He didn't get in touch with partner at the time, nor afterwards, in fact didn't get i touch with him until this post.

    The rest is great, I am sure you are a wonderful guy, great trader normally, but so busy you really just don't have time to do what you promise, and all who know you know that is true etc. etc. . My point is that folks this busy to call trade partner ought not to take trades.

    That said, I consider it total bullshit that someone doesn't have ten seconds to text someone a simple courtesy message unless you are
    1. Dead
    2. In jail
    3. In hospital
    the rest is just crappy excuse making for poor behavior. I know this because I had four trades going during the snowicane when we had no power, no internet, no heat in home, and couldn't leave because the plows refused to hit our town because the snow was too deep for them to get through. We were busy with survival of my family of four, survival of our house which was threatening to collapse under snow weight, and digging out by hand our 250 foot long driveway, but somehow I found the time and ability to contact all my partners.
     
  16. IPAFan521

    IPAFan521 Savant (460) Illinois Jan 20, 2013

    If the beer is tucked into a suitcase on the floor next to a desk, you don't realize it until it is 3:45 in the morning and you have a plane to catch, but you still need to pack. Not saying that I am not partially responsible for all of this, but I believe it was just handled very poorly.

    Also, like I said, beer is not my life. I have way more important things that will always come before beer.
     
    ufmj likes this.
  17. This whole thing had very little to do with beer. It's about fulfilling commitments and communication. That is way more than many important things in life.
     
    JavaNoire, jrnyc and cavedave like this.
  18. IPAFan521

    IPAFan521 Savant (460) Illinois Jan 20, 2013

    I don't know what I did to you but I will apologize to you as well. Too many people have too much free time on their hands.

    sorry that I did not die, get arrested, or seriously injured. I could have told that story, but that would be a lie. Long story short, life got in the way of beer. Without life, there is no beer. My family and work come well before any of you and that will never change. Unexpected things happen and people need to deal with it accordingly. Some rise to the occasion and other cry to mommy.

    Still waiting for his address.
     
    TheBeerAlmanac likes this.
  19. IPAFan521

    IPAFan521 Savant (460) Illinois Jan 20, 2013

    I guess this needs to be rephrased:

    I have way more important things to do that to communicate about trading 1 bottle of beer.

    I always laugh at these threads because 99% of them are a joke and it is usually 1 party jumping the gun and throwing another member under the bus. The funnier part is that this is allowed to go on. I will stick to my group of friends as this member has left a very bad taste in my mouth when it comes to how untrusting people are in this community. Yes, sorry I did not run up to my hotel room and log on my laptop to message him back or to retrieve a cell phone number I had no idea was there. Also sorry I did not bring a second suitcase with me to bring more beer for him. Also sorry that he still has not sent me his address, and I am sorry that y'all don't have better things to do!

    Cheers!
     
    ufmj and jpsboom like this.
  20. cavedave

    cavedave Champion (940) New York Mar 12, 2009

    Save the passive aggressive crap. You wanna apologize to OP, all well and good, you don't owe me an apology, nor I you.

    I don't know you you don't know me, this is the internet, funny that is how this internet has been for the 20 years I have been on it conv. ing with folks I don't know.

    Glad this is straightened out. Too many bad trader threads lately.

    And yes I am one of those annoying folks who says what everyone else is thinking but are too nice to say.
     
    riemster, JavaNoire, Vivified and 2 others like this.
  21. It's really interesting to me how people change through a thread like this. Your initial reply was respectful and somewhat respectable. Your subsequent responses became less and less so and now just outright disdainful. Now you just showed that you didn't really care about the trade and belittle the fact that the trade was just for 1 bottle so it meant nothing to you. The longer the thread runs, the more someone's real attitude and behavior are revealed. And this last response really shows what you really are and how you really felt about your action, not the least of which is that you're truly sorry.
     
  22. tommyz

    tommyz Advocate (510) Michigan May 28, 2007

    wow, actually no...threads like this have actually had people getting their beer, that is why they are allowed....Case in point, here....You have not been on here for a month, then this thread happened and you magically appear....Just a coincidence right?

    OP was being very generous by setting up a tasting with his group FOR YOU...Yeah, they got to drink the beer...But what he showed was generosity toward you and somehow your attitude here is now just shitting on him by bringing up "he still has not sent me his address" since the 40 mins you asked him on here for it...Maybe he is busy with work? wooooooaaahhhh..where have I heard that excuse...?

    Listen, im sure your a good guy...Others have pointed out why and I see why you are...But your starting to come off in a bad way..Im sure your a little frustrated at the responses, I understand that... I just believe you now should leave it on the OP to contact you and this will all stop..

    cheers man
     
  23. markgugs

    markgugs Champion (980) New Jersey Dec 20, 2006

    well this certainly escalated since my last notification
     
    riemster, kmello69, AdamP and 2 others like this.
  24. IPAFan521

    IPAFan521 Savant (460) Illinois Jan 20, 2013

    I believe that all of this stems from frustration. I return from a chaotic work trip from hell to a community I used to find comfort in only to be bashed because I did not contact someone for a few days.

    It would be one thing if I set up an exact time and meeting place and stood him up. I did not even get that far. I am sure these things happen all of the time, but go unnoticed because one member does not jump the gun and pop up a new thread. Like I said, it's just beer. I don't know any of you, and the ones that actually take the time to get to know me, actually like me.

    Take the time to get to know someone and actually listen to both side of a story before pulling out the pitchforks.

    I give everyone the benefit of the doubt and I get screwed over more times than I would like to admit to, so this is the last thing I would do to anyone else.
     
    ufmj and tommyz like this.
  25. ufmj

    ufmj Savant (395) Florida Feb 15, 2013

    With all due respect, it seems like you are being a tad bit hypocritical when you yourself have gone to bat for a BA with "poor communication".
     
    bruindre likes this.
  26. F2brewers

    F2brewers Moderator (440) Massachusetts Mar 12, 2005 Staff Member

    All:

    At this point, please let the OP and this trade partner work this out and report back once the trade is either finalized or abandonded.

    None of us have the skills of persuasion to make us all magically realize that either party here is either perfect or the wurst (that's me). At this point the argument is moot and we're not having a constructive discussion. Rather, it's devolving into arguments outside the topic of the thread itself and I'm loathe to see it fall any further down that rathole.

    Make your own decisions on whether to trade with either party based on what you've seen here and your own interactions with them.
     
  27. I'm pretty sure that anyone in a similar situation would have the exact same emotional arc, this has nothing to do with "real attitude", it has to do with the fact that a guy is being attacked over and over again having already apologized and gone out of his way to make it right and then some (see: his offer to not only complete the trade, but contribute bottles to OPs sharing group). I can't think of anyone in the world that wouldn't become frustrated, and ultimately angry, at the level of vitriol brought his way.

    There do exist bad traders on this site, but not every person that makes a mistake or isn't perfect is one of them. I understand that it can be easy to lump every unfortunate scenario into the same boat, and as many bad situations as there are, if you are someone who frequents this particular subforum, I can definitely understand the general level of disdain for people with no follow-through. It is just as important, however, to remember that the same level of disdain is not required for every person in every situation.

    Let's save the anger for those that actually deserve it, and give this guy the finger wagging (and not much more) that this guy deserves.

    edit: sorry F2, was typing this post before yours came out
     
    ufmj likes this.
  28. F2brewers

    F2brewers Moderator (440) Massachusetts Mar 12, 2005 Staff Member

    NP...totallly understandable.
     
    ufmj likes this.
  29. jsboots21

    jsboots21 Savant (280) Tennessee Jan 19, 2009

    @F2brewers thank you for the above post. I'm requesting this be locked since it is not constructive as you said. I will resolve this individually with @IPAFan521.
     
    ufmj and cavedave like this.
  30. cavedave

    cavedave Champion (940) New York Mar 12, 2009

    You are right, but I just guaranteed he'd come through because I knwo him, and would even step in to make good if need. If he wasn't my friend though I probably would have been harder on him though, true
     
    jshusc, TheBeerAlmanac and ufmj like this.
  31. F2brewers

    F2brewers Moderator (440) Massachusetts Mar 12, 2005 Staff Member

    Ok, OP wants it locked, so I will do so.

    @jsboots21 please let me know via BM once this is fully resolved so I can post an update for all to see.

    Update:

    Both parties agree that the trade is dead.

    I received a BM from @jsboots21 confirming that and asking that I present the following information from @IPAFan521 : he offered to send (by mail) the beer owed plus some more beer to make up for the situation. @jsboots21 declined the offer and the two are going their separate ways.

    If I've misconstrued the situation gentlemen, please let me know so I can fix it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2014
    jsboots21, Jaycase, bruindre and 2 others like this.
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