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stille nacht reserva 2010

Discussion in 'Beer Trading Talk & Help' started by thegoon55, Dec 30, 2012.

  1. thegoon55

    thegoon55 Advocate (515) Massachusetts Oct 27, 2012 Verified

    I know these threads are annoying, but I see FT:ISO offers that are insane for stille nacht reserva 2010.... Has any of them got done? Would it really trade 1:1 for things like rare or CC?

    Cheers and thanks
    reyes29201 likes this.
  2. MordorMongo

    MordorMongo Initiate (0) Jul 19, 2009

    No, not quite but seems close. And I may be wrong.....also depends on if domestic or international. You will expect to give bigger bottles domestically than internationally where you have additional shipping expense and the SNR2010 was a bit "cheaper" $wise.
  3. MordorMongo

    MordorMongo Initiate (0) Jul 19, 2009

    Well fuck, I guess ignore me....just looked at ISO:FT and apparently we have ourselves another insta-whale folks! I really just need to quit trading, I obviously am doing it wrong.
  4. thegoon55

    thegoon55 Advocate (515) Massachusetts Oct 27, 2012 Verified

    ...this is why I posted this. Though I don't see this trading for what people are asking, but on the odd chance it is...there's a bunch on insta-whalez in my backyard!
    reyes29201 likes this.
  5. jodan

    jodan Initiate (0) California Jul 24, 2008

    Goandpickitupformebro? ;-)
  6. thegoon55

    thegoon55 Advocate (515) Massachusetts Oct 27, 2012 Verified

    I would! Sadly they're $40 a bottle so I only got 2 one to drink now, and one to drink later..
    reyes29201 likes this.
  7. AlexFields

    AlexFields Advocate (645) Tennessee Dec 13, 2009 Verified

    I know some people have traded these for stuff like King Henry or packages of less rare beers, other people have received offers for Cable Car, Rare, T20, etc. What deals were actually made, whether they were 1:1 or what, I don't know.

    I'd be surprised if I actually got an offer for a Ann or V004 or one of the other bottles I listed in my post, but given the really limited number of bottles around, it doesn't seem completely out of the question if someone wanted to collect 2-3 bottles of snr 10 in one deal.

    More likely I imagine the deals for the near future will look more like SNR for rare or DDG, or snr + something else for izzy or cable car or whatever.

    Then again I could be overestimating the deairabity of these bottles based on their connection to snr 2000 and their limited production. Either way I guess I'll find out based on the responses I get to my post.

    Also seems fairly certain that this will trade for a lot more in a few years than it will now, unless the bottles really start to decline or something.
  8. kscaldef

    kscaldef Champion (855) Oregon Jun 11, 2010 Verified

    I'm quite sure you'd have no problem finding people who would paypal you the money to buy more at that price and ship it to them.
  9. kscaldef

    kscaldef Champion (855) Oregon Jun 11, 2010 Verified

    If it's really true that only 360 bottles of this came stateside, I see no reason given the pedigree that it shouldn't trade for either of those, or fairly close. However, I have to say that given the number of people who have claimed they could "go buy a case of them right now" I'm questioning that 360 number a bit. My understanding is that Portland got 36 of those bottles, and they disappeared very quickly (and historically we don't go crazy for beers at that price point).
    AlexFields likes this.
  10. thegoon55

    thegoon55 Advocate (515) Massachusetts Oct 27, 2012 Verified

    South Carolina only got 30 bottles, it's just beer doesn't move as fast as other markets. I do believe the 360 bottles is accurate. Remember a case is only 6 bottles
    reyes29201 likes this.
  11. AlexFields

    AlexFields Advocate (645) Tennessee Dec 13, 2009 Verified

    I believe western NC got two cases--one went to Bruisin Ales and of course sold out immediately, the other went to Thirsty Monk (beer bar, not bottle shop) which is where I got mine.
  12. xnicknj

    xnicknj Advocate (730) Pennsylvania May 25, 2009

    i know this is the conditioned response around here lately but with only 4k total bottles and only ~400 making it to the US, this IS actually rare. as opposed to anything ever released by goose island, founders or other shelf wale producers (by no fault of their own).
  13. MordorMongo

    MordorMongo Initiate (0) Jul 19, 2009

    True, but the ISOs aren't for shelf whales by those breweries (except for Rare), so in a way you are validating my point. Ann was 1/3 the bottle count just counting what came to US, v004, again less, etc. Everyone is free to try and get what they can and I am equally as free to laugh at it.
  14. AlexFields

    AlexFields Advocate (645) Tennessee Dec 13, 2009 Verified

    Well first, I clearly stated I would trade multiple bottles of snr for the two beers you just named and also add other stuff, so pointing to their lower bottle counts isn't really fair. Second, I have some Upright and Jackie O's and Hardywood beers with bottle counts much lower than Ann or V004--does that mean I should laugh if I were offered V004 for an Upright beer? Finally, I'm not expecting to actually be offered one of those beers, and I basically said as much in my post. I put other beers that I am much more likely to get in my ISO, but why not include some crazy stuff that I probably won't get just in case there's someone out there willing to trade it for multiple bottles of snr? It's not like I said those deals SHOULD happen or that I believe they're likely or warranted.
    Kuemmelbrau likes this.
  15. xnicknj

    xnicknj Advocate (730) Pennsylvania May 25, 2009

    This is my favorite part of the ISO forum these days.

    Some of the requests are definitely crazy, but I could see asking for limited 'Loons or other lambics reasonable. Plus, isn't it supposed to actually taste good? I keep forgetting about that side of the equation. ;)
  16. xnicknj

    xnicknj Advocate (730) Pennsylvania May 25, 2009

    I think you're missing the point here - Ann and V004 would be insanely difficult to land even if the bottle count was 3x what it was bc of the reputation of the breweries and beers themselves. Upright, Jackie O's and a ton of other breweries are churning out low bottle count limited releases, but that doesn't mean they're going to land extremely limited beers by De Dolle, Cantillon, HF, etc.
  17. AlexFields

    AlexFields Advocate (645) Tennessee Dec 13, 2009 Verified

    Yeah no I understand that, and I don't use bottle count as a gauge of trade value per se. But Mordor was pointing to the bottle count of those beers as though that were the reason the trade were off.

    Rightly or wrongly, Upright and Jackie O's don't have the reputation or pedigree that these other breweries have and so those bottles don't trade in the same league and I wouldn't ask for them to. But De Dolle DOES have a really solid reputation and the stille Nacht Reserva releases in particular do. Which is my point--the really relevant thing for trade value is how badly people want the beers, not technicalities about bottle count or bottle cost.

    How badly people want/will want the snr 10 is still kindof up in the air, but it's limited enough and has high enough expectations that I don't think it's unreasonable or laughable to test the waters in the way that I and I guess some other folks are doing.
    chase2634 likes this.
  18. stxSS07

    stxSS07 Initiate (0) Illinois Nov 23, 2010

    Leverage it to the hilt. Reverse default lambic swap buy back.

    MordorMongo likes this.
  19. huskermike12

    huskermike12 Savant (485) Vermont Nov 14, 2011

    The real problem is Etre had bottles up for about a day, so most people who REALLY wanted it went that route I'm guessing. I logged on to buy it then decided to pass because they basically had no limited Cantillon stuff to add to the order. Obviously other people did not.
  20. It was 18 bucks a bottle back 2001 or so when I saw a full wooden case in Buffalo sitting there ...
    This year seen NADA
  21. kscaldef

    kscaldef Champion (855) Oregon Jun 11, 2010 Verified

    Etre had bottles up for 2-3 hours is more accurate, I believe. I have no idea how many total they sold, but I can't imagine it actually added that much more to the US supply.
  22. BAstoutsNsours

    BAstoutsNsours Initiate (0) Florida Sep 21, 2012

    This is one tap right now at Independent Tampa. Just FYI
    cfrances33 likes this.
  23. Anonymous1

    Anonymous1 Savant (490) Illinois Mar 19, 2012 Verified

    Lets be realistic here. When was the last time anyone threw up an ISO for the Stille Nacht Riserva 2000, 2005, or 2008 before the most recent release? I'd say its pretty certain that this one will be all but forgotten in the next few months until they do another release.

    Of course you have a vested interest in these trading high since you're shopping them on the trade forums right now.
    claaark13 likes this.
  24. MordorMongo

    MordorMongo Initiate (0) Jul 19, 2009

    So I see you read my post but conveniently completely ignored the last sentence. Go back and read it again. I don't give two shits what you try and trade your beer for man, more power to you. You think you got yourself a whale and you haven't even tasted it yet. For all you know it sucks donkey balls but that is irrelevant as it trades for gold man. THAT is the part that irks me a bit and it is fully within my rights for it to do so. Please note I didn't say a thing in your ISO, or even directly to you, as I don't have any interest in deterring your trade. So, carry on and such.
    KaslD and cfrances33 like this.
  25. JAXSON

    JAXSON Savant (475) Pennsylvania Dec 15, 2005

    Okay, let's be realistic. You're saying given your vast experience "it's pretty certain" that SNR 2010 "will be all but forgotten" in a few months. Wanna bet on that? This beer comes out approx every five years. If you were around this site or ratebeer in the mid 2000s, which you likely weren't given your 2012 join date, you would understand how legendary and sought after the 2000 was, probably the most sought after beer out there along with 99 Framboos. This was many years after it was released. Even the 2005 vintage, which is considered inferior by most people, was trading for big stuff several years after it was released. 2008 was never officially released.
  26. Anonymous1

    Anonymous1 Savant (490) Illinois Mar 19, 2012 Verified

    Sought after by whom? '99 Famboos is a megawhale, but I've never seen anyone ponying up big bottles for SNR 2000 or SNR 2005. At least not over the past few years.

    Also, what happened 5 years ago has little to no bearing regaring what's going on now. Remember when Dark Lord traded for Blabaer?
    cfrances33 likes this.
  27. tbadiuk

    tbadiuk Savant (425) Manitoba (Canada) Feb 9, 2009 Verified

    The 2000 you don't see many ISO's for because it's sort of like trying to ISO Framboos or Soleil de Minuit, in other words no-hope-in-hell unless you have a case of M sitting in the basement next to the shelf full of Wooden Hell. Now, the value is mainly due to the age, even though it was quite limited as well. Really, in 2000-2005 the walez-train really didn't exist, so people actually *drank* beer, not many bottles from 2002 around. SNR 2010 is also supposed to be a re-creation of the SNR 2000 recipe so of course many people want it to try for themselves (and hopefully, to drink and not trade like baseball cards).

    Also, since the old forum has now gone with the reset about a year ago the old ISO's are gone, but this should give you an idea with what kinds of friends SNR 2000 hangs out with:



    cfrances33 likes this.
  28. JAXSON

    JAXSON Savant (475) Pennsylvania Dec 15, 2005

    what happened five years ago is relevant because you're saying that the 2010 will be forgotten in mere months while anyone with a few years on here knows that SNR 2000 was massively sought after for many years after being released. You're contesting that it ever traded big, which is a joke and cements your noob status...It was comparable even 3-4 years ago with things like M and Loerik, I remember a FT: M, ISO: 2000 post a couple years back, one bottle selling for near $1k on eBay, just feel free to research it before making all these bold proclamations.
  29. tbadiuk

    tbadiuk Savant (425) Manitoba (Canada) Feb 9, 2009 Verified

    It still is too, those links I posted above are from early this year. The forum reset blew away everything from a year+ ago, but the demand has never gone away. Even now M for SNR 2000 would get done no problem I'd imagine. I'd link to ratebeer ISO's but I don't think that's allowed...
  30. cfrances33

    cfrances33 Champion (795) Illinois Jun 12, 2012 Verified

    Some very interesting stuff from an equally knowledgable BA. Thank you for that. Won't change my current ISO, but it's always intriguing to have a cool brew history lesson like that!
    tbadiuk likes this.
  31. Anonymous1

    Anonymous1 Savant (490) Illinois Mar 19, 2012 Verified

    I see people frequently asking for Loerik, Don Q, Soliel, Framboos '99, M, Dave, and Wooden Hell. Seems like at least a few times per month. I don't really see that happening with SNR vintages. That's all I was saying. I'm sure it's an awesome beer.
  32. AlexFields

    AlexFields Advocate (645) Tennessee Dec 13, 2009 Verified

    I heard it was 24 bottles on Etre, which the Etre guy went and bought at De Dolle and turned around and sold for a profit.

    And @Mordor: I don't see what the last sentence of your post really has to do with it. I was responding to the content of the first couple sentences, which aren't really changed by what you said in the last sentence. I mean I know you weren't trolling my thread, and it's fine to express skepticism or whatever about the possibility of something getting done--I wasn't trying to call you out or say you're being a dick or anything, I was just responding to your comments in what I thought was a reasonable and polite way.

    And RE: the quality of the beer, two things. First, my experience with the regular Stille Nacht + the status of the original SNR release + the initial reviews on ratebeer and lots more conversational feedback form people who've had the beer all indicate that this is a great beer and probably something really special. I mean I haven't tried Lente either but I'm holding onto a couple bottles that I'm sure I'm going to love--you don't have to try a beer to have a reasonable idea of its quality. Second, is the quality of the beer really what's in question here? I'm very excited to try this beer and I'm going to get to. But I don't have the $$$ or the cellar space to hold onto multiple bottles of every cool beer, so as far as I'm concerned having one bottle to drink is probably enough regardless of whether I love it or am disappointed with it. I'm more concerned about trying lots of things than about drinking one thing repeatedly. And for better or worse we all know that how much we enjoy a beer personally doesn't have much to do with what we're able to trade it for. So the level of desirability and the level of availability are the more important factors determining what it will trade for.

    And I didn't say that it does or should trade like gold--I said it might and that as long as it's a big ?? I may as well find out. If it turns out not to trade that well, that's fine and I'm not going to say people are being unreasonable to not trade whales for this.

    A further point that I think is important: my decision to see if I could get one or more big bottles out of this has a context. I don't get to try big rare bottle that often. I've never had Duck Duck or Cable Car or Izzy or Deviation or T20 or T25 or even Beatification despite wanting to try all of them for years. When you live in east Tennessee and don't make an outrageous amount of money, there's really no way to build a big cellar full of one off Cantillons and rare Lost Abbey sours and so on. So when you get really lucky and find a few bottles that MIGHT be able to get you a chance to try some of those beers you've wanted to try for years, you have a lot of incentive to see if it can happen.

    If I had a deep cellar and had bottles that I KNEW could land my biggest wants, I would have much less incentive to try to milk the most out of the SNR bottles and would feel greedy doing so. I'd probably just send them to regular trading partners or trade them $4$ for whatever, or just drink them. (And even right now, if I knew one of my regular trading partners really wanted one of these, I'd promise it to them with or without the promise of anything special in return.) And I DO trade that way with bottles of the type I know I can get again and easily replace--I've given away bottles of Black Tuesday and Dark Lord and plenty of Jackie O's beers for free or for shelf beers to people who I knew didn't have the ammo to trade for them at market value. I send those things out as extras all the time. It's not a big deal to do that when you have easy access to those kinds of beers on a fairly regular basis.

    It always strikes me as a little arrogant when people with really deep cellars who try super rare stuff all the time and are sitting on multiple whales heap scorn on people who are looking to get something really rare for basically the first time ever and maybe aiming a little high with the bottles they have. Trying to go for it when you finally have a chance to is really not the same thing as being greedy and trying to win trades all the time.
    Kuemmelbrau likes this.
  33. Snr 2010 was a big boozy mess...can't see it trading for things like cc
  34. tbadiuk

    tbadiuk Savant (425) Manitoba (Canada) Feb 9, 2009 Verified

    Correct, although the exact # is a bit of speculation, but accounts of what people saw points to two waves of 12 bottles each. (Also, I will never order from Etre again due to this little stunt of theirs, I don't care if they list Framboos for 20 euro in the future!)

    Just wanted to mention T25 should be do-able with your gots. For a 1200 bottle count beer it's suprisingly easy (relatively speaking) to trade for.

    It's most likely because it's hard to read intent. That is, if you see a 'reaching' ISO it's hard to tell if it's what you wrote, or someone who is trying to 'win' every trade unfortunately. I've started to be a bit pro-active here. I make notes of things I see on the forums and then sometimes base trades around that. For example, last fall I saw someone list "1. Fou'Foune 2. Fou'Foune 3. Fou'Foune" in a thread titled "your top 3 wanted beers", later he posted an ISO that I normally wouldn't have responded to, but did because I knew this guy *really* wanted Fou'Foune...:p
    AlexFields likes this.
  35. AlexFields

    AlexFields Advocate (645) Tennessee Dec 13, 2009 Verified

    Yeah, I know I could land a T25 or b5 Beatification and so on pretty easily. I may have been exaggerating slightly for rhetorical purposes--I mean I've been trading and going to tastings and releases for about three years now, I've had a lot of great stuff including some rare sours, but the majority of them I've had because others shared them (I'll admit I did own a few bottles like Blabaer and Flaming Fury that I broke down and bought on Ebay, sad face). And I did just trade for a Blauw, which was my very top want, by trading basically the three rarest bottles I owned even though I really wanted to drink them and haven't tried any of them. I'm not a total newb who's never had anything really rare, but my point is that it's a big deal for me to have a chance (maybe not even a very good chance haha) to own some of these bottles for myself and in my eyes it kinda makes sense to aim high when you don't get to aim that high very often if ever.

    And that's really cool about helping the guy out with the Fou'Foune, I've tried to do that too when I could but the most I've really been able to help anyone out with is like Black Tuesday or Dark Lord (and it wasn't hard to give away Dark Lord having had it and knowing how nasty it is haha).
  36. MordorMongo

    MordorMongo Initiate (0) Jul 19, 2009

    So, you admit you are trying to "milk the most out of the SNR bottles" and are surprised I commented on it?

    Is this your first day here?

    EDIT : justified bullshit is still bullshit. Let's agree to disagree, I really don't care what you do yet you continue to justify it. I commented on this thread, that's all. Trade away my man, hook all the whales, I genuinely hope you do only so you can post the haul and mock me with it.
  37. hooliganlife

    hooliganlife Advocate (665) Missouri Apr 12, 2007 Verified

    apparently is the same recipe as the original 2000 only better barrels. with that in mind, long term...
  38. claaark13

    claaark13 Advocate (715) Indiana Nov 29, 2007 Verified

    Boozy? If you found it to be boozy, you must have a very low tolerance to even the slightest hint of alcohol. I found no signs of booze, but I guess I'd say the oak was fairly present.
  39. Jparkanzky

    Jparkanzky Initiate (0) Ohio Apr 5, 2011

    Had it last night, would not call it "Boozy" at all.
  40. huskermike12

    huskermike12 Savant (485) Vermont Nov 14, 2011

    Was it good?