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White Labs Yeast WL830

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by JUNCK, Mar 1, 2013.

  1. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    Brewing tomorrow with this yeast for the first time. Any tips? How have your beers turned out using 830?
     
  2. Great for pilsners. Treat like any lager yeast.
     
  3. Worked out great in a Helles recipe!
     
  4. warchez

    warchez Savant (285) Massachusetts Oct 19, 2004

    +1 one for these yeast in a Helles. Repitched it across several lagers last year and it did great through four generations at least.
     
  5. premierpro

    premierpro Savant (315) Michigan Mar 21, 2009

    I have used this yeast quite a bit. This year in seccesion I brewed a Pilsner,Dunkel,and a Rauchbier. Definately do a D-rest. I have noticed that this yeast will subdue hop flavor and aroma. Happy brewing!
     

  6. “I have noticed that this yeast will subdue hop flavor and aroma.” An interesting observation!

    I brewed a Classic American Pilsner last year using WLP830 (the shop was out of my preferred lager yeast 2124). That beer had a noticeable bready character to it which greatly surprised me; I have never obtained a bready character in my CAPs using other lager yeasts (2124, 2035, 2206, 2272, etc.). Did you notice a bready character in your beers (Pilsner, Dunkel, etc.)?

    While I have never used WLP830 to brew a Helles it would seem to me that the bready character that this yeast seems to produce would be very suitable to the Helles style.

    Cheers!
     
  7. I got a very nice bready character in my Helles Jack and found it to be very nice. This was my first lager so I can't compare but I figured if its JZ's favorite it's gotta be good.
     
  8. Thanks for your report on WL830 in your Helles. I am also glad to hear that it turned out well.

    “I figured if its JZ's favorite it's gotta be good.” You might be interested in knowing that the yeast that Jamil recommends in his Munich Helles recipe published in Brewing Classic Styles is WLP838 Southern German Lager.

    Cheers!
     
  9. Wow. Didn't know that, but in one of his early jamil shows, maybe CAP or BO pils, he recommended getting comfortable with one lager strain and using it for all lagers. And he said that 830 was his favorite.
     
  10. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    I've heard that advice before, but disagree. Lager strains do not all taste the same, so why use just one? Unless it's just to get familiar with the fermentation behavior of one strain and then know what to expect every time. But really, lager fermentation just isn't all that hard.
     
    jsullivan02130 likes this.
  11. I totally agree with you vikeman. Even though this is the only lager strain I've used so far, I would imagine proper pitch rates, pitching cold, and temp control is gonna lead to a nice lager no matter what the strain?
     
  12. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    Nice? Sure. And clean. But clean comes in more than one flavor, so to speak.
     
  13. MMAJYK

    MMAJYK Savant (455) Georgia Jun 26, 2007

    WLP830 is my favorite lager strain. It smells like ass when fermenting, but it's a very good one. I always do a diacetyl rest with it, but I've never needed it, per se. I've never detected diacetyl in any of my 830 lagers.
     
  14. In my experience, this yeast can work fairly quickly too. I can't remember exact numbers off the top of my head, but I remember one time I primaried for a week at around 50*F, did a 2 day diacetyl rest at about 65*F, crashed and lagered at <40*F for about 3 weeks, and it was good to go. YMMV.
     
  15. Marc, do you obtain a bready character in the beers you brew with WLP830?

    Cheers!

    Jack
     
  16. MMAJYK

    MMAJYK Savant (455) Georgia Jun 26, 2007

    No bready character, IMO. I usually just use it on my Pilsner based beers and I definitely get that sweet Pils malt shining thru, and maybe a slight crackery character, but no real "bready" character to me.
     
  17. “No bready character, IMO.”

    Hmmm, I must confess that I am perplexed why I got a bready character in my Classic American Pilsner. It isn’t from the malt since a CAP is 6-row and Flaked Maize. I have made my CAP many, many times using an assortment of lager yeasts (2124 for the past 5 years). The only time I got a bready character was when I used WLP830. My CAP tasted just like Troegs Sunshine Pils which has a strong bready character. If somebody poured my WLP830 CAP into a Pilsner glass and asked me: “Would you like t drink this Sunshine Pils?” I would have drunk that whole beer being 100% convinced that I drank a Sunshine Pils.

    Cheers!
     
  18. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    What temp did you guys ferment at? I am doing 48 degrees for 4 weeks then diacetyl rest and then lager @ 37 for 2 more weeks.
     
  19. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    4 weeks is generally more than long enough for the German strain IMO. I ferment at 50F until attenuation is about 80% (or a little more) done (about a week or two (at the very most)) , then raise to a diacetyl cleanup temp.
     
  20. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    How do you control your temp? I don't really have a way to raise the temp of my Better Bottle from 50 to 60. I have a chest freezer that works great when the temp of the garage is above the temp I need to ferment at.

    I was going to pull my Better Bottle out and then wrap a brew belt around it and plug and unplug until it sits at around 60 for 2 days then back in the chest freezer to lager for a few weeks.
     
  21. jklinck

    jklinck Savant (255) Washington Jul 23, 2007

    You need a dual stage temperature controller and a heat source (I use a desk lamp).
     
  22. I pitched at 45f and then ramped it up to 48 over the course of 2 days, 2 days at 48 then ramped it up to 50f for another week and a half and at 2 weeks it was down to 1.011 from 1.052 OG. Definitely smelled like eggy farts during primary but do not worry that will subside. I didn't need a diacytyl rest but I let the beer sit at 55F for another 2 weeks and it tasted great! Lagered at 35F for a week then kegged it because I was so excited. I drank some off the keg but then bottled a case or so of it. After a month in the fridge cold its totally clear and has a more rounded flavor.
     
  23. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    That would work, though it will be kind of a PITA. Adding a temp controller to the brewbelt would be a more elegant (and more expensive) solution. Or find a place in your garage/house somewhere where the ambient temp is right.
     
  24. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    One more thing. How do you cool your wort to 45? I have a 50 foot immersion chiller and could only get it down to like 57. :(
     
  25. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    Depending on the temperature of your water supply, you'll eventually hit a wall where you can't get the wort temp down any further. When necessary, I recycle cold water through my immersion chiller using a pond pump. The pump is submerged in a utility sink containing ice and wtaer.
     
  26. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    Umm.. if I pitched at 57 and stuck the Better Bottle in the chest freezer at 49, will be beer turn out ok?

    Also in the future, could I cool the wort as low as I can and put it in the chest freezer and pitch the yest the following morning once the wort is at proper temp?
     
  27. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    Either of these methods can work. I don't pitch lagers when the wort is that warm, but some people do. If I had to choose, I'd probably let the fridge bring the temp down first.
     
  28. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    Thanks VM! I'll try brewing the same recipe if I like it and next time bring down the temp and pitch and see if there is a difference. I am sure that is the one true way to test it.
     
  29. If you want to perform an ‘accurate’ experiment you really should conduct a split batch. Make one batch of wort and split it 50/50. Pitch yeast in one batch at the traditional lager pitching temperature (e.g. 45°F) and let the batch free rise to fermentation temperature (e.g., 50°F). In the other batch pitch at a warmer temperature (e.g., 57°F) and over a period of time (e.g., 24 hours) get that batch down to fermentation temperature (e.g., 50°F). You should then treat those two batches exactly the same. Ferment at the same exact temperatures for the same period of time. Lager at the same exact temperatures for the same period of time. Package the two beers in identical fashion. Conduct a side-by-side taste test of the two beers at the appropriated period of time (e.g., three weeks after bottling).

    You could do two separate batches but there are a lot of variables which could influence the resulting beers.

    Cheers!
     
  30. premierpro

    premierpro Savant (315) Michigan Mar 21, 2009

    Hi Jack. My yeast comparison sheet shows 2124 as the same as WLP830. I am not sure that it is more "bready" I percieve a more malty flavor. This years lagers have been split between WLP830 and WLP800 and I can tell you from drinking my hydrometer samples that the 830 is more malty with subdued flavor and aroma then the 800. This should be fine as I brewed a PIls. Dunkel,and Rauchbier with these yeasts. Take care.
     
  31. Thanks for your response. It is sometimes difficult to discuss the specifics of flavor since we all have different palates and most people (I know that I do) have some challenges in turning flavor perceptions into words.

    You state: “My yeast comparison sheet shows 2124 as the same as WLP830.” That was my understanding last year when I ordered WLP830 in place of the 2124 that was out of stock. I have used 2124 many, many times in making my Bohemian Pilsners and lately (last 5 years or so) I have been using 2124 for my CAPs. So, last year I made two batches of CAP in the exact same manner with the only difference being the yeast selection. The two beers came out noticeably different with the WLP830 having a strong bready taste. Now, you might have drunk that beer and stated that it had a strong malty taste (again, differing palates and differing abilities to word flavors). One thing that I am personally convinced of is that WLP830 is not 2124; or more precisely I should state WLP830 is not 2124 for my palate.

    Cheers!
     
  32. sarcastro

    sarcastro Savant (415) Michigan Sep 20, 2006

    I generally bring my lager wort down to 50 for pitching. Once I didnt have time and had to pitch at 63. The beer turned out great.

    I also use the pond pump with ice water. It works great.
     
  33. premierpro

    premierpro Savant (315) Michigan Mar 21, 2009

    I'll take your word on this as I only have a comparison sheet that I printed off some site. Happy brewing!
     
  34. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    If I brought it inside for 2 days at about 68 degrees would that be ok for the d rest?

    After the d rest, should I just add it back to the fermenter at 32 degrees for a week or so or should I gradually bring the temp down from high 60's to 32 and after it hits 32 start the 1 to 2 week lager schedule?
     
  35. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    Should be, assuming attenuation was finished or very nearly finished. If you're starting the D-Rest with a few points of gravity to go, you'll want to make sure attenuation had also finished before you bring the temp down (after the D-Rest).

    By fermenter, I assume you mean your fermentation/lagering fridge. Assuming the yeast were finished, you don't have to bring the temp down gradually. It's okay to crash. Are you planning to bottle or keg? If kegging, I would transfer to keg before lagering.
     
  36. JUNCK

    JUNCK Aficionado (135) Washington Jan 7, 2011

    Still bottling for a few more months, should I transfer to secondary before lagering? Thanks for the reply.
     
  37. I primary ferment my lagers in a bucket and I transfer to a carboy (secondary) for the lagering phase. I have a concern about leaving my beer in a bucket for a couple of months (e.g., 2 weeks of primary and 6 weeks of lagering) since oxidation could possibly occur (plastic is oxygen permeable).

    Cheers!
     
  38. VikeMan

    VikeMan Champion (750) Pennsylvania Jul 12, 2009

    I switched to kegging before I starter making lagers, so I can't answer that one from direct experience. But if I were bottling, I think I would lager in a secondary. I tend to lager for a couple months, and that's a long time for beer to sit on the trub.
     
  39. premierpro

    premierpro Savant (315) Michigan Mar 21, 2009

    Before I keged I would secondary my Lagers in a plastic bucket. I would bottle after 4 weeks.
     

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