Beer Trader Feedback: Sneak Peek (Part 1)

I think the idea is that you would have a discussion, and at the point where you're like "ok, this deal is set, I'll ship on Tuesday" you open a formal trade request to the user. They accept it and the terms, and then you both ship. If someone doesn't accept the trade request, then the idea is that the other person decides not to ship.

Obviously if you decide to not use it, then you're not using it. That's fine. I know that as long as it is a smooth process, I'd likely politely insist on using it, and the hope is the majority of the traders would also. Why not?

 

I've kept a relatively concise log of previous trades, 99% of which have been very successful, and would like to retroactively give credit to those good traders - fair?

I see people worried about the 1 pt versus 2 pts difference, but I think it's the only feasible way to differentiate good from awesome :/ Unless you manage to separate the categories:

Trade Completed as agreed, Yes (+) or No (-)
Extras Likert : Trader included extras (1) <--> Trader blew me away with extras (5)
Packaging Likert : Trader got lucky shipping (1) <--> Trader sent mobile fort knox of beer (5)
Delivery Likert: Slow to ship or respond (1) <--> Very Rapid shipment (5)

Then people wouldn't feel as badly about poor packaging/shipping speed/extras because it wouldn't negatively affect their overall completion of trade

 

Yes, sounds good . . . that places the "mandatory" aspect on the part of the trader, though, not the system itself. Works for me.

 

Plus, someone's refusal to use the system would be a good red flag in and of itself.

 

My biggest belief is a bad trader needs to have a large penalty, or its just semantics... a -1 point honestly means nothing imo...We do have the bad trader list which is a huge plus (thanks oldport)..But as far as a bad trader goes, they need to be examples hit with the harshest penalty possible JMO..

 

Wow...I love the fact that people are participating and have great ideas but I like your original idea of keeping it simple. A lot of other BA's have fantastic input but I like something that is quick, easy and to the point. I just hope that doesn't get lost in all of this with all the "what ifs". Hopefully you can incorporate many of these suggestions without making it too complicated or burdonsome.

Overall though, fantastic idea and I'm excited to see you guys being progressive, taking suggestions and listening to us complain (which we are exceedingly good at). I've enjoyed watching this site evolve over the past several years and am looking forward to the on going improvements.

 

I'm really looking forward to this addition to the site. Will there be any way to catalog and get credit for past trades?

 

I say keep it simple and leave out the feedback. I wouldn't want someone to trade with me cause I sent "awesome extras", and then send "mediocre extras" the next trade and get penalized for it. A 5 star rating system would be too subjective, and would hurt traders feelings if they didn't get 5 stars. Either make it a Great-Agreed-Bad scoring system.

 

Just to clarify, is an incomplete trade a trade where the one of the traders refuses to ship out or if one of the traders decides to cancel the trade?

 

Haven't read through it all, but I would go with:

Trade results were:

2) above expectations
1) at expectations
0/-1) below expectations

 

I almost feel like there needs to be one more level. I'm a novice trader, completing 3 trades, and I would rate all 3 of them 1pt, 2pt & 3pt. 1pt trade I got no extras - and that was my first trade, and after talking with an avid BA trader about how extras are the "Christmas morning" of beer trades, I was really disappointed - but the trade was still completed as proposed so it would be hard to "punish"... 2pts I got a couple extras on a 6btl trade. It was thankful and one of them was even discussed as a possible beer included in the trade - cool! Then there was the 3pt-er. 2 trade bottles +3 extras, all of which were awesome, styled me out!! This is a BA I want to trade with multiple times!

I wouldn't go beyond 0-1-2-3, but that extra level could really encourage more thoughtfulness when BAs are packing that last beer into their trade boxes - which I think we all appreciate!

 

I don't trade often but trade feedback should have nothing to do with "extras", IMHO.

 

Honestly, I think it should be just 1 "point" for a completed trade, and a field for notes to note extras and whatnot. No need for bonus points, no 0 point items, no taking away points.

When I look at a trader, I'd probably see how many points (effectively how many completed trades) they have, and then scan through the list of completed trades to see if there are any really negative or really outstanding notes.

Ok here's the real question: would the trading mods be able to "ban" someone from the trader system, and would that put a mark on their profile? I think that should be the replacement for the Bad Trader list, but I can also see how that would be a huge amount of drama that the Bros don't want to involve themselves with.

EDIT: Quick note, when viewing the feedback for a trade, I'd like to click and see both sides of the feedback, in case there was a disagreement.

 

I like this KISS approach. What if there was also a simple option of selecting "would trade with again" or "wouldn't trade with again"? Like hoerr mentioned above, some trades meet the criteria perfectly well but don't really jazz you up for one reason or another (bad extra, poor communication, put a canister of peanuts in your box as a noisemaker and you're deathly allergic), and you don't necessarily look forward to trading with them again. It's less than name calling or butt hurt, but gives a little more insight into how both parties feel post trade. And if I see a trader who has 20 "would trade with again" and 1 "wouldn't trade with" on their record, I'd probably reach out to that one trader who gave them the "wouldn't trade with" to see what was up and make a judgement call on my own. This is kind of similiar to how some people update their profiles now anyway, and I think the most useful thing about a centrally tracked trading system is that I don't have to search profiles and cross reference before trading. This could give me a handy list.

It would also be cool to be able to track and give props for one sided "trades" (i.e. on the receiving end of BIF/LIF or getting a random awesome box from a trade partner), but I can also see how this might be a pain to implement.

 

This.

The thought that filling out four or five data fields with radio buttons (which takes all of 20 seconds), and a comments field is too complicated makes me concerned that whoever can't take a minute to do this after spending perhaps hours discussing, buying, packaging, and shipping beer shouldn't be trusted driving a car to buy and ship the beer. If someone really wants to avoid it, trade without using the system. But as said above, I'd be wary of that. Do you want to trade with someone who won't take a minute to give feedback when it's done? (Flag for possible communication problems or laziness).

Also, concern about hurting other BA's feelings is well-placed, but not really relevant. The trade falls along a spectrum from worst (6er of bud light lime shows up) to best (a Uhaul of white whales shows up). Generally trades will fall in between Poor and Excellent, and if someones does an average job or below, they will only know that if their feedback received is average or below. Perhaps Trader A really tried but Trader B has had the five local distro extras Trader A included. That sucks, but I don't think Trader A should feel mortally dishonored if the trade gets rated good instead of great.

The system can be called as objective as you want, but if Trader A has done a few great trades with great extras, and then does a pretty good trade with Trader B and receives one good extra, I could see Trader A being conditioned to think his good trade is slightly below average. So how objective can it stay?

 

I see threads about giving subjective point value to extras. In my opinion, extras have no bearing on feedback ratings at all. A trade is successful if it meets its two main objectives: 1) agreed upon beers are safely exchanged, and 2) in a timely fashion, again timelines agreed to by both parties.

 

I would say this would be a great idea, but grade inflation has some notorious blow-backs. The military rates on a 1-5 scale, 1 you need to go, and 5 you walk on water. Grade inflation had made it over the last decade that 5 was the norm, and now in readjusting the scores to reflect their appropriate value (instead of giving and auto 5, actual thought go into the rating) some military members careers suffer, as some leaders feel that all younger members only deserve a 3, while other leaders still hand out perfunctory 5s. My point: some traders will suffer from the point scale as some raters will be sticklers, while others hand out 5s to everyone, it won't accurately reflect the trader being rated in other words. I know the reply will be "just have everyone rate accurately then"; this doesn't happen as people are either dumb, lazy, or ae spectrum combination of be two.

My suggestion: pass/fail. You either are, or are not a good trader. 1 point or 0 point.

 

How about under and over achiever?

 

Maybe you could allow the people who initiate the trade to click the "time frame"?

Another important thing would be to allow the traders to always edit their postings. I've received many extra unsolicited boxes from past traders months down the road and it would be important to me to be able to edit the feedback.