Online Tasting - Pilsner July 14-16 - Planning Thread

Likely each BA will provide differing 'answers' here.

According to BA both Pacifico and Modelo are American Adjunct Lagers.

I would suggest an additional perspective here that any beer that has a bitterness level of an American Adjunct Lager is not a Pilsner. In my opinion a Pilsner should have > 20 IBUs. And something like the 40 IBUs of Pilsner Urquell being a 'plus' in my opinion.

Cheers!

 

I respectfully think you are missing the idea Jack. What “readings” are you using? Rhetorical question - certainly not the brewery website I pointed to above. Pacifico doesn’t state “AAL” on the label either… and neither does Miller Lite (a fine Pilsner beer). It’s a matter of how wide a net you want to use with “pilsner” - and that is something that is open to interpretation. I understand that you would not personally use this categorization, but there is nothing wrong with someone who believes that Corona is a pilsner if Firestone’s Pivo Pils can be one also. I think there is a lot of room for personal perspective here. Your IBU threshold above is an example of this. Cheers.

 

A variety of sources beyond a brewery's website.

No doubt as I alluded to in my above post: "Likely each BA will provide differing 'answers' here."

There is zero doubt in my mind that both Pacific and Modelo are not Pilsners. Feel free to think differently.

Cheers!

 

Pilsner on the label is not a good indicator. (I doubt that many would call Pacifica a Pilsner.) There are Czech lagers brewed outside Pilsen that are not labeled pilsners, even if they are in the style (see Budvar, Argus Maestic). Here's an image of a domestic label that has asserted "Pilsner" for about 50 years:
https://beerpulse.com/2014/06/miller-lite-12-oz-bottle-label-approved-3169/
But I don't think that qualifies it as a pilsner (even farther out of style than Pacifico!)
Is there a definition that can be used to qualify beers for this tasting?

 

This is diving deep into some philosophical interpretation right here -- and I like it.

 

It is an interesting conversation. Modelo and Pacifico use pilsner-style and Miller Lite, says a fine pilsner right on the can. It's open to interpretation if these beers are pilsners or not is the vibe I'm getting from these posts.

 

If you are willing to play the game (this is all friendly), then is “Heineken” a pilsner (pilsener)?

I can’t help it.

It’s worth stating that almost everyone in these forums would probably vote “no.” The question can be - “How much weight would you give to people in these forums?”

 

According to BA, Heineken is a European Pale Lager. I agree with BA here.

Cheers!

 

One of the most interesting things, to me, about these tastings is the exploration of the edges of the styles.

I look forward to seeing some thoughts on how some of these beers that use pilsner as a marketing term compare to some of the more widely accepted examples of the style. Although, perhaps we should all get some Urquell to use as the baseline of comparison for all the other examples we find.

I've done a lot of comparisons of pilsners available to me over the last few years and I've honestly come to accept that I don't really like the pilsner style all that much. I do still drink a fair amount of scrimshaw in the summer and I'll grab some Trumer from time to time.

All that's to say, I'm not sure that I'll join in this particular tasting but I'll definitely enjoy seeing what people pick up and reading everyone's thoughts

 

Depends on who we're talking about, doesn't it?

 

Where did you get that label? Heineken doesn't call its beer in the US pilsener. Has it ever?

 

Looks like a lot of choices,do I have to get Bohemia Pilsner in black and white bottles and those other Mexican beers.to participate. Really hope someone posts a 24oz can of Miller High Life for a solid thread shit. This is why we can’t have nice things

 

I don’t know if it was ever sold as “Heineken’s Pilsener” in the US like it was elsewhere. I think at the very least “Heineken’s Holland Beer” and “Heineken’s Lager Beer.” They used to differentiate their various styles (Munchener, Dortmunder, etc.) before their “pilsener” became THE “Heineken” in their brand identity. I heard they came up with the “pilsener” spelling but I have no idea if that’s more story than fact.

 

The first Dutch style pilsner? And that long ago?! When will BA get with the times and add this traditional style!?

 

Yeah, seems unlikely. UK newspapers and German language publications in the US in the 1870s used "Pilsener (Bier)". And Heineken today does not use it (at least not in the US version of their corporate website's Heritage page):

Nor in their 2001 self-published history of the company, The Magic of Heineken:

Heineken likes to boast that theirs was "the first imported beer to reappear on the American beer market following the end of Prohibition" on April 11 (so, just 4 days after April 7th when many US states legalized 3.2 beer) but the NY Times noted the following day (below left):

so it appears that it was only, at best, hours before Bass also hit the US docks in Hoboken, NJ. the same day. Both were, of course, 3.2 versions brewed for the US market. (Heineken today claims it was "25 barrels and 50 crates of bottled beer" not the 100 gallons above).

Heineken also likes to imply that their flagship beer in the US has always been brewed in Holland unlike other imports but after Germany occupied Holland in 1940, beer exports stopped and, briefly, the US received Heineken brewed at their brewery in the Dutch East Indies but the Japanese soon ended that, too.

 

Wowee, very contentious waters to wade into already.

A simple solution seems to be to judge these cases as though they are actually Pilsners; which would include fairly prominent noble hops in the aroma, taste and bitterness. See how those marketing departments like those apples.

 

Because it will be Shark Week in a couple/few weeks!?!

I agree 100% with you here (reference: post #41).

Cheers to hops!

 

I wondered about that claim. Awesome find. Seeing the above made me wonder about transatlantic crossing times back then. Looking into it right now, places on the web have it at 4 days. They both must have jumped at the market opportunity. A great thread digression.