Poll: Should “value” be added as a beer rating category?

Idea Discussion in 'BeerAdvocate Talk' started by Orca, May 18, 2024.

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Should “value” be added as a beer rating category?

  1. Yes

    39 vote(s)
    27.1%
  2. No

    105 vote(s)
    72.9%
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  1. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Well my idea went down in flames but you can’t blame a guy for thinking outside the box.
     
  2. Roguer

    Roguer Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,811) Mar 25, 2013 Connecticut
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I review the beer in my glass, and I don't think value should have anything to do with the beer itself (although people are certainly biased based on cost, rarity, etc.).

    However, I certainly think it's worth mentioning in your review. If I pay $30 for a beer and it's great, but not any better than a $10-15 beer, I'm definitely putting words to that effect so that, if anyone reads the review, they have that information. Basically: if you buy this beer, the numbers (and notes) are what you might expect (assuming we have the same palate lol), but you should consider whether or not you want to buy that beer based on cost.

    Another caveat: value depends not just on the product (as @snaotheus laid out), but on the buyer as well. What one person considers a reasonable price, another may not. Any of us who drink craft beer likely spend more money per ounce than a "regular" (AAL) drinker, and we consider that a fair value based on what we enjoy in life. (I don't spend money frivolously, but that does allow me to spend more money on the things I value: good food, good beer, my house, my car, my family - not in that order! :stuck_out_tongue: )

    So even though at face value it might seem like you can use beer prices to assign a value, in practice it varies from person to person. That might seem like the same subjectivity that goes into rating a beer in general, but at least the practice of rating the beer is based on your impression of, well, the beer, not the price tag. :slight_smile:

    Interesting discussion though.


    Well, and there's the other side of this: if someone wants to incorporate value into their Overall score and consequently influence the rating, they already can - so a separate attribute isn't necessary.

    Hell, if someone wants a Hype attribute ("This beer was great, but not as good as everyone raves about."), there's no stopping that, either.
     
  3. LesDewitt4beer

    LesDewitt4beer Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,315) Jan 25, 2021 Minnesota
    Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Randomly, when writing up a beer review, I might make a note in the "overall" portion of the review (at the end) that the beer was a good value for what it is. I think I've only done that a handful of times. I believe value is a personal thing and this starts to get fractal.
     
  4. John_M

    John_M Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,849) Oct 25, 2003 Washington
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    This is pretty much what I do now. Not for every beer, but for those beers that I feel are hugely hyped, but don't deliver when you actually drink them.

    That was the case when I sampled a glass of Assassin a few years beck. I was very excited to try it, but at least to my palate, the beer hugely underperformed. Considering how rare the beer is, and how expensive it is, I was very surprised. I felt like that was something I needed to point out in my review.
     
  5. moodenba

    moodenba Pooh-Bah (2,502) Feb 2, 2015 New York
    Society Pooh-Bah

    The buyer might well judge whether a beer is too pricey for him/her. But the price the purchaser sees in many cases is determined by the wholesaler markup and the retailer margin. Since the wholesale distributor often has exclusive rights, that price could well be competitive in the brewery's home market, but elevated to luxury-level out in the hinterlands (or vice versa!). It still can be useful to mention pricing in the written review, though.
     
  6. MutuelsMark

    MutuelsMark Grand Pooh-Bah (5,787) Jan 23, 2015 Kentucky
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    Wouldn't that require a place to enter price paid? I might think this beer is worth the $35 I spent, however if you found the beer at a lower price say $25 you might feel that is too much to spend for your enjoyment.
     
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  7. dcotom

    dcotom Grand High Pooh-Bah (6,637) Aug 4, 2014 Iowa
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    My thought was that I'd never want to see it incorporated into a beer's BA rating. While the other rating components are quantifiable, at least some degree, "value" is entirely subjective. Some people would think I was nuts for paying $5/oz for pours of KBBS, or for saying I wouldn't give you a dollar for a truckload of Budweiser. If I ever get the chance to pay $25 for an ounce of Utopias, I'm in. Those are value judgments on my part, and I don't expect anyone to care. By the same token, I don't care about anyone else's take on a beer's value. If it's not worth it to me, I won't buy it in the first place.

    But since it's never happening, it's a moot point.
     
  8. BillAfromSoCal

    BillAfromSoCal Pooh-Bah (2,415) Aug 24, 2020 California
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Given the diversity of descriptions for almost any single beer's perceived attributes in BA reviews, I would argue that looks, taste, etc. are barely more objectively quantifiable than value. IMO, the representation of the beer attributes (look, smell taste, etc.) is highly subjective, even if numeric values are assigned.
     
  9. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Like all other categories, value is subjective. Some people won’t pay more than $X/oz for a beer, others consider the time and effort that went into a given product. It would be up to each user to decide, on a 1 to 5 scale, the value of the beer they are reviewing—just as they do for smell, taste, mouthfeel etc. now. In short, value, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.
     
    ChicagoJ, Amendm and MutuelsMark like this.
  10. defunksta

    defunksta Grand Pooh-Bah (4,164) Jan 18, 2019 Wisconsin
    Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I like the premise and the post. But after thinking about it I definitely vote No. Even though the idea of adding value to beer has good merits, it adds inconcsistency. A stout I can buy for $2.99 in the store, is often upcharged to $10-15 at the bar. Two reviewers would assign very different value depending on where they were drinking it.
    That's not to say there isn't other inconsistencies already in the reviewing process such as beer age, but this would add another component.
     
    tone77, AlcahueteJ, ChicagoJ and 3 others like this.
  11. beerjerk666

    beerjerk666 Grand Pooh-Bah (5,155) Aug 22, 2010 Florida
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Price has pretty much been a determining factor for me from the start of this craft beer journey.
    Ratings are subjective due to everyone being different...duh, right?
    Cost could/will always be different from region to region too.
    That being said, I don't think scoring a beer lower or higher, because I paid more or less for it is fair.
    There are plenty of beers out there that I think are a good deal for what you get, but that shouldn't effect an overall rating, imo.
     
    ChicagoJ and Amendm like this.
  12. chrisjws

    chrisjws Grand Pooh-Bah (3,302) Dec 3, 2014 California
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    No, only because this comes into play when it’s really outsized. Not interested in debating if something is a $7 pour or a $8 pour. Regions come into play and other variables I don’t expect to be well controlled. For me this is only on the far ends of the spectrum and a once in awhile consideration.
     
    ChicagoJ, BillAfromSoCal and Amendm like this.
  13. SLeffler27

    SLeffler27 Grand Pooh-Bah (4,906) Feb 24, 2008 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I’m hungry and need to consider my thoughts before elaborating. Suffice, for the moment, to say, “how on earth would anyone evaluate worth as a community?” Let cost be one of many intangibles to be considered and noted under the Overall category.
     
    ChicagoJ and Amendm like this.
  14. cavedave

    cavedave Grand Pooh-Bah (4,157) Mar 12, 2009 New York
    In Memoriam Pooh-Bah Trader

    You are free to add whatever you want to your reviews, within site guidelines. There never will be a category or any mention of price allowed officially. I won't try to explain the reasoning for that, it would be pointless.

    I came here twenty years ago to find reviews to help me to choose beers. I found plenty of reviewers with my palate, and who reviewed in a way I found helpful. Even though I certainly am not one of them, I believe there are many who would like your kind of price guidelines recommendationary reviews.
     
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  15. BillAfromSoCal

    BillAfromSoCal Pooh-Bah (2,415) Aug 24, 2020 California
    Society Pooh-Bah

    per one of my comments and my vote, I do NOT favor a separate rating category for cost. I only favor allowing raters to take cost into consideration (if they feel it impacts their drinking experience) as one of many drinking experience characteristics when they rate "Overall"
     
    ChicagoJ and LeinenkugelDrinker like this.
  16. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I just want to repeat: I never intended for this question to be interpreted as whether cost or price should be rated, but value. These terms don’t mean the same thing—but a lot of people are talking about price and cost so I figured I’d state this again. Also, as proposed, no one would be required to rate value (as they are with the other five categories), this would be optional. I thought I was clear in the OP but apparently not. Carry on :grin:
     
    ChicagoJ likes this.
  17. BillAfromSoCal

    BillAfromSoCal Pooh-Bah (2,415) Aug 24, 2020 California
    Society Pooh-Bah

    Sorry, I was fixated on some members diatribes against consideration of cost. I meant to say I am against a separate rating for perceived value( my definition = perceived satisfaction / dollars per ounce). However if very hi or low perceived value influences my enjoyment i.e. the controversial “drinking experience” then I will most certainly consider it in “overall” rating despite the F bombs that some members want to assign to that habit.
     
    ChicagoJ likes this.
  18. Immortale25

    Immortale25 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,775) May 13, 2011 North Carolina
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    While intrigued by the idea, after seeing how this thread has shaken down, I voted "no." Yeah, beer reviews in and of themselves are subjective, but throwing a perceived value into the mix, regardless of how low the percentage is, will create a weird dynamic. I could actually see people bringing down the scores in the other criteria once they actually consider the price they paid vs. What they're experiencing. Point being, I think it would only have a negative effect, not a positive one
     
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  19. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,710) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    No, if people interpret value as cost/price in a thread, then they are likely to do the same when rating/reviewing. Just look at the different interpretations people apply to the “overall” category. I just wanted to try to clarify that I didn’t mean a cheaper beer would inherently get a higher “value” score, because that idea had never entered my mind and I never intended for this thread to be interpreted as such.
     
  20. cavedave

    cavedave Grand Pooh-Bah (4,157) Mar 12, 2009 New York
    In Memoriam Pooh-Bah Trader

    Per one of my comments, you (and by extension everyone else) are free to write whatever you want in your reviews so long as it is within site guidelines.
     
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