I don't find the malt presence to be along the lines of an ESB, despite what WBC judges think, and as you've stated, fresh is another thing.
I think it's a totally subjective phrase. As I've stated before, High Life was the first beer I had that I actually liked, some 50ish years ago. That's a flavor I mentally refer to when using the phrase. And, as with anything this subjective, if that's what ya like, that's what ya need to drink. As a very well trained wine guy dealing with the public I constantly have the conversation with people about "I know it's inexpensive (read cheap), but it's what I like", and my response is always "if that's what ya like, that's what ya needs to drink. Anything else is just somebody else's opinion." And who the hell are they? Even if they are more "educated" and "experienced", they aren't you. So.............back to topic: my point of refence is High Life. It's a flavor I harken back to, that makes me happy. It's my money, and I'll spend it for what I like. Now, get off my lawn.
I object to defining something as beer flavored beer. To me, anymore, the standard beer is a middle of the road WCIPA. That’s what I think beer should taste like. 20 years ago, I really like Killians Red and things like that. 15 years ago, it was the original Fat Tire. What beer should taste like is a subjective thing. There’s a sizable portion of the population that likes ice cold AALs. There some that don’t, like me. So what. I’m not sure why this justifies much discussion.
Well we've definitely gotten a wide variety of answers, as I expected. Everything from Pale Ale to ESB to Pilsner to American Wheat (I would argue the wheat addition disqualifies it, but that's just me) to Blonde Ale and, of cours, AAL. I also forgot about English Bitter and English Pale Mild Ale. Definitely lots of things fall into the category of "A beer that tastes like beer and nothing else" with a wide range of color as well Yet here we are on page 3 All I'm trying to accomplish is to keep the dialogue going about what craft beer is all about: Exploration and Innovation. And it doesn't need to include special ingredients, barrel-aging, funky bacteria or any yeast other than Saccharomyces Cerevisiae. There are dozens of beer flavored beers out there for people used to drinking swill (again, a subjective term, I know, but you know it when you taste it) to give a shot and maybe, just maybe go "Hey! I actually like that!" There's another thread that got revived again called "Make Beer Dumb Again." Fuck that. This site and this movement was not started to drink the same boring shit over and over again. We're here to strive for the opposite: Being open-minded to new things, which sometimes requires stepping out of our comfort zone. Not to get too meta, but it could be seen as a metaphor for life. Do you want to go back to the '70s when there were only a little over a hundred breweries in this country and most of the beers being produced had neutered, muted flavors? Edit: I see @brewme actually started the "Make Beer Dumb Again" thread but never chimed back in on it after the OP. I'd love to hear your take on all this and why it's not worthy of conversation.
Beer taste is heavily influenced by place. The Moretti in Italy was way better than the one in Florida. The Super Bock in Portugal paled in comparison to the one in Texas. And some beers are on vacation, not after a stressful day, or week, at work. It's not just the beer when we taste it.
I was called a beer "snob" in the early 80's for liking Henry Wheindharts Private Reserve. Taste is funny.
Wiley Roots Brewing Co. -- Beer-Flavored Beer ...in this case, a German-style helles lager... ...more to the point, beer-flavored beer to me pretty much means traditional style beers with no barrel aging or adjuncts such as coffee...of course, go into styles like sahti or saisons and farmhouse ales or even fruit beers like pumpkin beers or lambics, sure, we're starting to get a bit beyond more traditional lager and ale styles, but to me, beer-flavored beer means pretty much malted grain, hops, yeast and water...
' A few years ago when Schlitz changed the formula "supposedly" back to the original, I bought a 12 pack of bottles. I took a bottle out of the fridge, put it on the counter, and poured it into a chilled 16oz glass. I immediately smelled beer in the room. When I got the scent of beer in the room after pouring that Schlitz into that glass, and having a nice foamy head on it, before I even tasted it I knew it would have Beer Flavor. I was right. '
Ok, so, as a kid in the late 70s, I'd get my grampa's beer mug(which I have now)out of the freezer and pour his beer- Piels, Schlitz, Schmidt, Pabst, Schaeffer(Never Bud!?)- when he got home from working in a vacuum repair shop in Brooklyn. He'd let me take a lil sip, usually just getting my nose in the foam, and laugh, when I'd pull back and say something like, 'Yuck!" Of course, I grew to love AALs, aka the Classic American Pilsner, so to me THAT is what beer tastes like. That's beer flavored beer. But as my palate grew and styles changed, SNPA became my touchstone as to how 'beer' should taste; moving ahead, moving on, evolution, but 'beer flavored beer' at the basic level still remains the CAP. Today (and some may find this crazy, or, at least see the 'high' gravity of the situation), my palate tells me my favorite 'beer flavored beer' is none other than Heady Topper
Looking at my progression of beer flavored beers through the years… Blatz Miller High Life Coors Banquet Point Special Carlsberg I see there’s no ACTUAL PROGRESS. Sure, there were detours along the way. Like Leinenkugel’s Red. But beer was basically yellow and tasted like beer. It wasn’t until microbreweries took off and I started trying different styles that I realized how much the beer world had to offer. But plain old beer is still comforting. Just like when I don’t know what whiskey to drink I’m going for Bushmill’s. Or when I’m not sure which bourbon to go for I end up with Bulleit. I’ll end up with a Carlsberg when I’m not sure what I want. Default no-brainers are comforting. Cheers!
