Resistance is not futile.

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by Rollzroyce21, Dec 23, 2015.

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  1. lateralusbeer

    lateralusbeer Savant (1,222) Feb 7, 2010 North Carolina
    Trader

    I think the point is, every one of us can help avoid things getting to this point.
     
  2. Norica

    Norica Zealot (660) Feb 2, 2006 Massachusetts
    Trader

    It took until 12/23 to finally see The Post of the Year.
     
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  3. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    Interesting take. Actually I hadn't been thinking of it as advertising so much as something that might be described by a series of beers that would sound like they were named at Russian River. :slight_smile:

    Repentance
    Confession
    Penance
     
  4. eldoctorador

    eldoctorador Pooh-Bah (2,096) Dec 12, 2014 Chile
    Pooh-Bah

    So Elysian said
     
  5. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I see eye to eye with you in regards to the equation to advertising and feeling a bit embarrassed. Regarding your last paragraph, I too tend to see things through an "all beer" lens, BUT I think you would agree that there is small and big beer in the sense that some beer is produced by enormous companies and some beer is purchased at a farmer's market (note that I'm not assigning a good/evil or superior/inferior tag to either)... and I doubt you'd want to be in a world without the latter. I'm not suggesting that the success of one will eliminate the other, but the landscape is volatile. It might be too hubristic to simply believe that the cat is out of the bag at this point.

    I'm not trying to get into a big vs little debate, I'm just starting to think that we are heading towards a new "it's all just beer" rhetoric for better and for worse.
     
    #25 zid, Dec 23, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2015
  6. Chaz

    Chaz Grand Pooh-Bah (3,668) Feb 3, 2002 Minnesota
    BA4LYFE Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    "KCCO Beer" / Resignation Brewery is brewed by Redhook, so those cats are on the scene, man!
     
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  7. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    Might not be. Our alternatives for cheeses in supermarkets are no longer either Kraft American or CheeseWhiz. Our alternatives in breads are no longer either Wonder or Hostess. Our choices in wines are no longer this jug wine or that jug wine. So suggesting that our alternatives in beer are no longer B or MC and that situation will continue doesn't seem too extreme to me.
     
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  8. mwa423

    mwa423 Initiate (0) Nov 7, 2007 Ohio

    I'll admit, I lol'ed.

    Beyond that though, I have been chuckling to myself at all the holier than thou "I'll never sell out" bull that is being spewed by business owners right now. Everything in the business world has a price. Let's say BMC showed up on this idiot's door step and offered a million dollars for his BBQ joint, cash on the table, hundred dollar bills. Would he take big evil beer's money? Would he sell out? Of course. If he wouldn't take a million of "dirty big beer money" then I bet he'd take two million. But if he wouldn't take two million, he would happily take three.

    The old joke is: "A man walks up to a woman and asks "would you sleep with me for $20? Offended, the woman replies "of course not". The man then says "well, how about for $200,000". The woman then says "well, I suppose for that much". The man then replied "well, now we've established what you are, now we're just negotiating price".
     
  9. evilcatfish

    evilcatfish Pooh-Bah (2,116) May 11, 2012 Missouri
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Awe, how cute and noble of Beachwood :grinning:

    But seriously, what happened at/after the Bourbon County event last year that made the owner realize he made a "huge mistake?" Goose's ownership hasn't changed since last year so why the 180 on Beachwood's part this time around? I have my suspicions but don't want to speculate.
     
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  10. drtth

    drtth Initiate (0) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania
    In Memoriam

    Money is not the only yardstick by which a life is measured and some have already resisted the prospects of a big dollar pot of money being dangled under their noses.
     
  11. meefmoff

    meefmoff Pooh-Bah (1,922) Jul 6, 2014 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I'm on board with the general sentiment of not being overly outraged about acquisitions, but I'm also a bit surprised at how often people repeat something to the effect of "all businesses are only in it for the money".

    For one, I don't think that's true - opening something as likely to fail as a brewery or restaurant is a pretty poor choice of career path for that. And two, to the extent that it is true, it's symptomatic of what's gone wrong with capitalism in the U.S. and not of what's gone right. The choices aren't binary between greed-fueled-crony capitalism and the Soviet Union.
     
  12. LambicPentameter

    LambicPentameter Initiate (0) Aug 29, 2012 Nebraska


    "So all the money we collect from this keg will go to the CCBA. They do an amazing job advocating for the actual craft brewers"

    Well, the ones for whom it makes marketing sense to classify as craft brewers anyway.

    I have to admit, there was/is a part of me that wants to see New Belgium sell just to see how the CCBA would handle that. New Belgium is 3rd (for 2014) on their list of top craft brewers by sales volume, and losing them would take a massive chunk out of the growing "craft beer" market share.

    Amen to your entire post, but especially this. Not that I blame them. Both sides are using the tools that they have at their disposal and that are most likely to appeal to their target consumers.

    My issue comes in the fact that real people work for breweries that are owned by ABInBev the same way real people work at Beachwood. That fact seems to get a little bit lost when we start fixating on whose pockets receive the surplus revenue/profit.
     
    #32 LambicPentameter, Dec 23, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2015
  13. tillmac62

    tillmac62 Pooh-Bah (2,859) Oct 2, 2013 South Carolina
    Pooh-Bah

    I bought a BCBS last weekend and I don't feel guilty about it.
     
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  14. pat61

    pat61 Initiate (0) Dec 29, 2010 Minnesota

    Its sad to see a favorite brewer swallowed up by a giant mega corporation but if I owned a brewery and was sitting around exhausted from years of 18 hours days and 7 day weeks trying to figure out how to send my kids to college if someone came along with a wad of cash, if would sit up and listen. Shit will happen. On the other hand, craft beer itself, is safe for a long time. First there are several niches in the market and not all of them are susceptible to buy out or attractive. Next the craft brew industry attracts certain kinds of people and not all of them will fit in a mega brewery. How many AB-InBevs will tolerate a brewery booming heavy metal with a brewer standing on a pallet of bottles playing air guitar? Either the big guys are going to adapt so they keep the people or the people are going to leave. Even as the breweries get gobbled up, the people who don't fit who make the beer we love are going to end up somewhere else making the same or better beer. And, finally there are 4173 or so brewers out there and new ones coming on board faster than the big guys can gobble them up.
     
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  15. beerjerk666

    beerjerk666 Grand Pooh-Bah (5,155) Aug 22, 2010 Florida
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I hate to see big businesses continue to buy up all the small(er) guys, it's just my "routing for the underdog" mentality. But if they continue to make great tasting beer, I don't care; but again it does suck to hear!
     
  16. Geuzedad

    Geuzedad Initiate (0) Nov 14, 2010 Arizona

    I think the real issue here is "big beer" attempting to buy up all the craft they can and drive the rest out of business. ABInBev is currently under investigation for buying up distributors who then begin forcing out their craft accounts, making it hard for those little guys to get their product out there. It happened to Ninkasi. The other part of that is the availability of cans to package the product as there are currently only three companies producing cans for the market and guess who takes most of them? Also the raw materials (hops, grain, etc.) needed to produce beer. Recently a local brewery, Four Peaks, got invested by ABInBev. The owners stated a big reason for selling out to them was to gain access to more of those in order to manufacture more beer. So here you have a large conglomerate buying up little breweries, who are also buying up distributors, and controlling the market for raw materials (cans, hops, grain,etc.) and many of you here seem to think that's not a problem. Well when those great little breweries we all seem to be so fond of here can no longer get the material they need to produce, can, or distribute their product what are we going to do? Just say "No problem, I just got all this expensively overpriced BCBS I just stood in line for, for over 8 hours to comfort me."
     
  17. boilermakerbrew

    boilermakerbrew Initiate (0) Aug 13, 2010 Indiana

    Why does this topic continually rear its ugly head? I would argue that most of us here are unaffected by such deals, and frankly, deals like this are the embodiment of the American Dream. Be successful and make money, do good along the way.

    This whole big vs small argument is ridiculous. Sure, the smaller companies need some protection, but this type of competition and risk of buy out is a normal part of industry. Hell, the competition is natural, otherwise you would see tons of small, useless animal running around instead of being food for larger animals. I digress....

    To the original post and EvilCatfish's point, why was hosting a (hugely profitable) Black Friday Bourbon County even such a bad decision? Sometimes I honestly think that small brewers don't want to make money or earn a living by the practices they exhibit. In the words of Ran Swanson, "Captilism: God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor."
     
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  18. gopens44

    gopens44 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,560) Aug 9, 2010 Virginia
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    I've went on tirades either way on this as it's a fairly gray situation to wrap one's head around but I've started to lean towards the majority opinion that the problem lie within our government. If the government was not so corrupt, greedy and run by all around shit for brain turd sucking asshats, they may actually put the good of the people ahead of the good of whatever benefit they receive from writing into law only that which benefits big business. I put only about 1/3rd blame on big business because if they aren't taking advantage of the condition of our "free (cough, cough) market" than they aren't doing their job in the eyes of shareholders. Yep, they could have something called morals and ethics (although they are antiquated pillars of doing business...) but they are not paid to be fair, they are paid to be dicks and make money. Boycott ABInBev all you wish but until we start figuring out a way to "boycott" the government and lobbyists, we're just spinning our fucking wheels. Sorry for the rant, again, just had to work that out of my system....

    In related news, let's all tip some bottles up while listening to The Dead Kennedy's Bedtime for Democracy
     
  19. breadwinner

    breadwinner Initiate (0) Mar 6, 2014 California

    I've been thinking a lot about this one. My guess -- and this is totally conjecture, not based on any studies, interviews, etc. -- is that we just happen to be arriving at a point in time where the growth/popularity of craft beer is intersecting with the time in some folks' careers when they're more open to moving on. Some of these dudes who are selling have been at it for 20+ years. They've worked their asses off making beer, growing their businesses, etc. Doesn't surprise me in the least that, after all that toil, some of them are open/ready to move on. Is that right or wrong? I dunno. It just doesn't surprise me.

    Probably especially true when there's no clear succession plan for some of these guys. If you don't have family or trusted friends/associates ready/willing to take over the business, it's not hard to imagine why you'd think about selling. Again, not saying it's a good idea or bad idea, just that it's not surprising and actually probably fits pretty well within the life cycle of a growing, family/founder(s)-owned small business.
     
    #39 breadwinner, Dec 23, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2015
  20. Leebo

    Leebo Initiate (0) Feb 7, 2013 Massachusetts

    You selling stock in an imaginary company mr. pyramid scheme?
     
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