Whats whetting the whistle 5

Discussion in 'Australia' started by mulder1010, Apr 12, 2016.

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  1. sinkas

    sinkas Initiate (0) Jul 9, 2008 Australia

    if anyone wants to do a box swap just let me know,
    ill send you some might tasty WA brewz
     
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  2. ubiq3000

    ubiq3000 Initiate (0) Dec 6, 2013 California

    I just wished the beer trade market was as strong as the US trade market.

    What are the factors limiting your country? this? Brewing technique? Australian terroir, i.e., wine country (Yarra Valley, Alpine, Beechworth, Rutherglen), distilleries, produce lends itself to incredible high potential, but no absolute hits. Maybe small breweries need a tax break, like the one we got in 1980. Thoughts?
     
  3. ubiq3000

    ubiq3000 Initiate (0) Dec 6, 2013 California

    I just remember when I lived in CA, I used to trade every other week; to buddies in Austin, Indiana, Portland, Tampa. It was a huge adjustment since moving here. I find Australians clamoring for decent American (US standard), of which are usually gray market quality (3-6 mo passed freshness date), which I find baffling. Makes me appreciate what I once had (RS and Ambassadors of Sour member, lived close to Monkish, HPB, soon to be FSW Venice). I just wished the trade market in Australia was a fraction of what it is back home.
     
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  4. hawthorne00

    hawthorne00 Devotee (331) Nov 23, 2010 Australia

    The importance of trading in the US is due to (inefficient and often outrageous) State government restrictions on interstate trade and the related antiquated, restrictive and anti-competitive tiered distribution system. These things are illegal and/or unconstitutional here, so trading has only very small gaps to fill. Getting beer from shops (including webshops) is normal. Having to skirt the law, spend lots of time repacking beer, putting individual parcels in the post and assuming the risks of breakage and fraud is not normal.
     
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  5. spicelab

    spicelab Savant (1,223) Nov 6, 2009 Australia

    This has some relevance to the bigger players but is only a small part of the picture.

    There are a huge number of nano-breweries in the US that aren't producing enough product to satisfy demand in their own State, let alone distribute further afield. Breweries like Casey, de Garde, Hill Farmstead etc are hyper-local by design, more akin to wineries. And many of the new wave (Other Half, Highland Park) have such small bottle/can runs that it's pretty much impossible to get them outside of the brewery. Then you have the short-run/limited release beers from the well-regarded larger breweries.

    I wouldn't rule out a trade market emerging here in a few years but we don't yet have the calibre of breweries to support one.
     
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  6. Gasc0igne

    Gasc0igne Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2013 Australia

    I'd argue we don't have the caliber and/or quantity of enthusiasts (that would actually trade) to support it yet either.
     
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  7. hawthorne00

    hawthorne00 Devotee (331) Nov 23, 2010 Australia

    There are a huge number of nano-breweries in the US that aren't producing enough product to satisfy demand in their own State, let alone distribute further afield. Breweries like Casey, de Garde, Hill Farmstead etc are hyper-local by design, more akin to wineries. And many of the new wave (Other Half, Highland Park) have such small bottle/can runs that it's pretty much impossible to get them outside of the brewery. Then you have the short-run/limited release beers from the well-regarded larger breweries.

    Sure. But what do wineries do in those circumstances? They have a mailing list and they sell them from the winery. Maybe they pull their product out of shops (but usually not restaurants). Perhaps they sell out quickly or limit some wines to loyal customers. Perhaps they change prices to more or less equate demand with supply - almost certainly they do this for their regularly produced products.* But what they don't do is sell them off on site to people who go home and repack them to barter for other wine.

    *OK, I'm an economist, but why do you think breweries don't put their prices up?
     
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  8. danieelol

    danieelol Initiate (0) Jun 15, 2010 Australia

    Because they want to grow their brand and maintain consumer goodwill. They are far better off having high-demand products they can move quickly, then brew some more; rather than having too much product sitting around.

    If they overcharge for one batch and it turns out terrible, then people are going to be less likely to buy their stuff in the future. By keeping prices moderate they are able to move their stuff immediately and let the buyers assume the risk for it.

    I think also by nature a lot of those hyper-local breweries are not solely in it for the money and there is probably some idealism influencing how they charge for their products also.
     
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  9. ubiq3000

    ubiq3000 Initiate (0) Dec 6, 2013 California

    Exactly. Firestone Walker has kept there pricing constant wrt Parabola, Sucaba, Stickee Monkey, Agrestic, etc. They've effectively created a demand from their strong presence, enabling them to branch off into their sour and wild ales series, all of which are moderately priced, but have as strong a demand as their flagship brews. Volume not pushed (highly unlikely) are then re-released prior to new releases or are cellared. It has gotten to a point now where the market has oversaturated. Limited release beers entail hypebeast lines, along the same lines as Jordan releases.

    On that tangent, what was once seen as a dichotomy, is now seen as a parallel, with respect to beer and sneaker culture. As a keen observer of both, one can't deny the similarities between the consumer and the pusher. Limited releases, retroing and re-retroing of different iterations of sneakers or beer adjuncts alike, has created demand and thus inflating pricing, spilling over into a vast trade market.
     
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  10. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Initiate (0) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    So ATP and international beer collector are normal??
     
  11. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Initiate (0) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    Wine culture in Australia= beer culture in US
     
  12. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Initiate (0) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    Will chime in on this.
    I really doubt that there will be a big culture of trading that develops in Australia. Totally different market than the US, or to even some extent Europe that does have a trading culture. if you look on RB and to some extent on here there are Euro's that do trade. Pretty simple really. Trade you some loons/ Narke stuff for some BA US stuff or IPA's. Not a lot of people in Europe looking for Wild Ales when 3F and Cantillon is easier to obtain for them.
    The US beer scene is far more regional and much more spread out than here. Russian River only sells beer to a handful of states. Midnight Sun to only 4-5 states. Some breweries can only produce so much for a region. Try to think of a craft brewery that is comparable to Midnight Sun in Alaska in Australia.
    The US has a beer release culture. Does that even exist here? There are people in the US that are willing to hop in a car and drive 4-8 hours for a release. IE Hill farmstead, Russian River, Toppling Goliath, Cigar City, Lost Abbey are examples. There are beers like Churchill's Finest Hour, Dark lord, Hunauphu, darkness, I can go on for days on this.
    There is a bigger emphasis on the taproom in the US than here with beer. Go to any average small to large brewery and you will find a specialty tap at the brewery. it is generally the norm to only find the core/ seasonal beers on tap at a brewery here. In essence the brewery is a destination in the US. Not as much here as the destination is the pub or to a winery as those are destinations. Even the good bottle shops here have about the same range from coast to coast. not much different.
    Beer in the US was at different points of development when trading began. For a time everybody wanted Midnight Sun stuff, then Russian River, then Lost Abbey, then Cigar City. There was once a time when Black Ops was considered a wale.
    I can include general pricing of beers as believe that for out here fewer people will buy single bottles that are over $30 a bottle. $30 for a 6 or 4 pack can be justified but a different kettle of fish for 1 single bottle.

    Hope it makes sense and ends rant.
     
  13. hawthorne00

    hawthorne00 Devotee (331) Nov 23, 2010 Australia

    Wasn't very ranty at all.

    Interesting point about breweries mostly serving their core range. Mornington is a rare exception and even there it's more often a seasonal than a special beer.

    The US has a beer release culture. Does that even exist here? There are people in the US that are willing to hop in a car and drive 4-8 hours for a release.

    What a waste. It's in bottles. Even kidney transplants don't require you to attend the motorbike accident in person.
     
  14. sinkas

    sinkas Initiate (0) Jul 9, 2008 Australia

    Im glad "we" have the fairly uniform accedd to stuff here
    I like doing tge BiF AND BOX swaps, but the wierd passive aggressive attempts ive had interbatiinal trades Left me perplexed
     
  15. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Initiate (0) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    That proves my point. There are a lot of breweries in the US that ONLY do releases at the brewery. People do travel for it. Heck. Blabaer is released in a bottle shop in Belgium.

    I get the thinking of I can wait for the beer because it shows up at Slowbeer or Carwyn and just buy it. At the same token I had a lot of fun at the Veritas 08 release. Even standing in Line at RR for Beatification was fun because of the people.
    It is the people that make trading fun and the people that you meet that make it fun. If I had one qualm for out here I do not find it as much fun, or maybe as passionate as the US is. That is what makes trading fun to me. Some times you get good beers, sometimes you get bad beers but it is about the experience. Sadly Australia does not have it to the same level.
     
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  16. Gasc0igne

    Gasc0igne Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2013 Australia

    * Denmark
     
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  17. danieelol

    danieelol Initiate (0) Jun 15, 2010 Australia

    I can think of a fair few breweries/brewpubs in Aus that have either brewery-only or extremely limited release stuff on tap...
     
    #37 danieelol, Jun 13, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2016
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  18. ubiq3000

    ubiq3000 Initiate (0) Dec 6, 2013 California

    Exactly right. I went to the past Framboise for a Cure release at RR and GREAT release at Alpine, had mini-shares in line and arranged a few IP trades while there. Enthusiasm was high, which is sorely missed.
     
  19. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Initiate (0) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    You counting GABS kegs?? We know you love them.
     
  20. Narkee

    Narkee Initiate (0) Jun 20, 2013 Australia

    We want to give this another crack? Any theme is good!
     
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