Where have all the Altbiers gone?

Less than a month past expiration date? That's practically fresh! Seriously, I probably would have been all over that if it was something I was looking for. I get it, fresh beer is always best, but many of these beers are not as fragile as some seem to think. I've had a number of weihenstephaner brews that have been as much as 9-10 months past bottling date that were still very tasty. I don't expect German beers and imports in general to be as fresh as domestic brews and allow some flexibility. If you keep complaining about shrinking availability of classic German beers while being as picky about dates with imports as you are domestic beer, you're kinda contributing to those beers being less available. Especially when it comes to the styles that are more malt forward anyways. Just my two cents, but I'd rather have slightly past its prime Weihenstephaner than two week old beer from some domestics. But to each their own.

 

Couldn't help but hear The Kinks when I read the thread title. I've had a string of Uerige bottles end up lousy as well. Stopped buying them. State Line comes to mind. I often pause at the German section and want to grab (honestly) an alt but most of those bottles are of questionable quality (age). Haven't had Freigeist Hoppeditz in awhile, but I remember liking it. Anyone else try that one? Wondering if I should take a chance on it next time I'm at SL.

 

Long trail ale Double Bag is their take on alt bier. It is really good and readily available year round here in NJ.

 

Just to clarify, Long Trail’s flagship, Long Trail Ale, is an alt bier style. See here: http://longtrail.com/beers/long-trail-ale®
Double Bag is based on the Long Trail Ale recipe with “double“ the malts, which they call a Strong Ale or double amber. http://longtrail.com/beers/double-bag®

I like both beers, but Double Bag isn't really an altbier.

 

That is why I said it is "their take" on the style. Gimme a break-

 

I’m not as picky with import pils as I am with IPAs. I would have bought the Jever if it had been 2-3 months before expiration. But I didn’t really want to lug home 4 cans on top 2 bottles of Bourbon County anyway.

 

OK but Long Trail clearly does not call Double Bag an altbier. You can have your opinion, but if it defies the brewer's opinion of their own beer you might want to reconsider it. EDIT: and in this case it's even more odd to hold unto this opinion because the brewer makes another beer they do call an altbier.

 

Long Trail does consider Double Bag an Altbier. Look at the bottle label in your link: "Double Altbier." Their use of the words "double amber ale" elsewhere is just indicative of the name games used with beers like it - such as Alaskan Amber "Alt style ale." The Long Trail beer is analogous to Uerige's Doublesticke... which is a heavier version of their Sticke... and their Sticke is a heavier version of their "Altbier."

Having said that, you also said "Double Bag isn't really an Altbier." One can ask the question, "Is a Doppelsticke really an Altbier?" In my experience, drinking their normal Alt and the Doppelsticke are such different experiences. I'm really not informed on the scope of Dusseldorf breweries, but it seems like the Uerige Alt fits in well with the norm there and the Doppelsticke is an anomaly. The fact that the smallest beer in Uerige's range is called Altbier should make people take a second before calling their Doppelsticke an Altbier, but the current Sticke and Doppelsticke labels actually have Altbier written on them (and that should probably trump all).

One thing in my mind when I wrote the first post quoted above is that "normal" Altbiers have been almost unavailable in the US. When I drink a Doppelsticke type beer, I never feel like I'm drinking a typical Altbier. Uerige's Doppelsticke was created because their US imported suggested it (if I remember correctly). It was made for the American market. I'm sure it's considered a win-win for the importer - It might hold up better with age, consumers will feel more inclined to spend more money on a single bottle of beer if the ABV is high, and the tastes of the American drinker of expensive beer leans towards big and bold. The result is that while Uerige is the most ubiquitous German Altbier producer on American shelves, their actual "Altbier" is far less common (in my experience) than their bigger beers. Buying a typical Altbier from Germany is extremely difficult in my import-rich area.

All of this brings me to the Freigeist beer mentioned above. It's a Doppelsticke Alt, and if my memory is correct, it's a relatively heavy beer as a result. I always assume that the more standard bottled Freigeist offerings (like this one) are very old bottles.

 

Part of me feel that English and German Imports are fading out which is concering but you are in Maryland, Perfect Pour and State Line liqours have a good selection of both. That reminds me now that I drink Wheat Ale I may drive up to State Line and look at there import section again.. Its a trip to get up there though.

 

It's simple the future generations of craft beer lovers don't care for the style. It's all sours, stouts, ipas , cider & hard seltzers. Sad but true. People my age will don't want to drink popular german style beers and they really don't sell anywhere locally by me. The times are changing

 

I haven't had an Alt for ages but had one today at a sports bar; Zipline Copper Alt

 

Altbier dies not travel well. Bottles of Zum Uerige hauled back to the States are starting to go off in a week or two. Brewery Process, flip top bottles, the bottling line, or whatever has the beer going off. Travel to the Altstadt in Düsseldorf and drink like you will never have it so good again. Then you will make sure you come back.

 

The beers may be there, on the shelf, but that does not mean they are fresh enough to be worthy of purchase.

Did you read what @Bouleboubier stated in post #42?

"I've had a string of Uerige bottles end up lousy as well. Stopped buying them. State Line comes to mind."

Cheers!

 

Old Meck can do no wrong.

 

The bigger question is where has all the malt gone? Maltsters must be hurting these days since it's hard to find anything but hazy, juicy, NE style maltless IPAs. I've been to a few craft brewery taprooms lately where there was nothing on the menu except that style, with a few other lighter beers like Pilsners, Goldens, and a sample of fruity/chocolately/flavory beers.

I love a good malty IPA like Great Lakes' Nosferatu or Alesmith's Double Red but beers like that are few and far between any more.

And call me stubborn but "their take on" a style...isn't. Friend & I visited Magic Mountain brewery in Akron last month. They had an Altbier on tap so we sampled it. Interesting beer, but not an Alt. Too much (too many?) hops, which is pretty standard for U.S. brewers' approach to any style any more.

 

I suppose this could be hyperbole? ... but a true "(barley) maltless" beer's label in the US would not have a COLA/ be approved by the TTB, and would have to have a label that meets the FDA's requirement including the actual ingredients listed by volume, and, as such, would stand-out from most other beers. (Obviously, not going to be the case with draught-only/on brewery premise beers).

TTB Ruling 2008-3 - Classification of Brewed Products as “Beer” Under the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 and as “Malt Beverages” Under the Federal Alcohol Administration Act

FDA - Labeling of Certain Beers Subject to the Labeling Jurisdiction of the Food and Drug Administration Guidance for Industry

Examples of DFH's and Full Sail barley-maltless beer labels:


I'd suspect that most of these much hated "hazy" and NE IPA's use a larger percentage of barley malt than the average AAL (typically ~60% malt/~40% corn/rice adjunct).

What are some examples of hazy/NE IPAs brewed without any barley malt?

 

McNeills in Brattleboro used to brew an alt and double alt. They don't anymore. Sad, it was great stuff. I will ask what happened next time I stop in.

 

Stone EnjoyBy 1-1-20 I think it is should scratch that itch.

 

I stand corrected then. I went by Long Trail's description on the website and I missed the "double altbier" on the label. I wasn't fully aware of the history of the varying ABVs of altbiers.

@Claude-Irishman sorry.

Unfortunately, there aren't many altbiers here in the US to compare and get an understanding of which is or is not to "to style," so just "it's good/bad to me" will have to do and you provided that. I do still think that when brewery a makes regular and double versions of an altbier, as Long Trail does, mentioning both might avoid some confusion [or maybe it's only me that thinks this style is confusing].

 

Even back in 2001 BA was noting that altbiers were a disappearing style
https://www.beeradvocate.com/archived-articles/260/

The same article lists five American altbiers, including Long Trail

Which shelf?