"75% of Consumers believe Shock Top is from a small Brewer"

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by Kanger, Sep 23, 2014.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Kanger

    Kanger Zealot (521) Sep 3, 2013 New York

    This is insane, but not surprising.



    From Ben Johnson's Article:

    Roguer likes this.
  2. Providence

    Providence Crusader (706) Feb 24, 2010 Rhode Island

    I'm surprised it's that low. I would have thought more in the 90% range.
    Boverhof3, SHerninko, Dope and 10 others like this.
  3. BrettHead

    BrettHead Zealot (504) Sep 18, 2010 Nebraska

    "I'm intimated by most craft beers because they're are too pretentious and complicated"

    Man up, Matt
    JohnnyMc, fox227, Cracker666 and 20 others like this.
  4. moshea

    moshea Devotee (464) Jul 16, 2007 Michigan

    I had a co-workers 21 year old son lamenting about how much Blue Moon has gone down hill since Coors started brewing Blue Moon.

    I replied by telling him that it was still water before Coors started brewing Blue Moon
  5. BrettHead

    BrettHead Zealot (504) Sep 18, 2010 Nebraska

    It's always been a Coors company though

    Blue moon that is.
    riverlen likes this.
  6. Fargrow

    Fargrow Initiate (0) Feb 7, 2013 Michigan

    A 4-ingredient food product is too pretentious and complicated for Matt.

    Matt doesn't get out much.
  7. moshea

    moshea Devotee (464) Jul 16, 2007 Michigan

    right, that is what makes it funny
  8. bluehende

    bluehende Poo-Bah (2,428) Dec 10, 2010 Delaware

    I haven't seen a can. Does it even mention there parent on the can. I know the big guys used to set up a brewery name just to hide the fact that they were brewing it. Plank road brewery anyone?????
  9. StuartCarter

    StuartCarter Initiate (0) Apr 25, 2006 Alabama

    These quotes encapsulate a serious problem in craft beer.

    1. Equating beer consumption with "manliness" is misogynistic and stupid.

    2. Patronising language like this is exactly what causes macro drinkers to accuse all craft beer drinkers of snobbery.

    3. By acting on points 1 and/or 2 above, you have permanently driven people away from craft.

    These attitudes are toxic to craft beer culture and are actively hurting our chances of being taken seriously by, and of winning over, the casual craft drinker - especially the casual female drinker. By espousing these attitudes you make the job of educating the uneducated much harder, and drive another wedge between half of the population who are already tired of sexist advertising and attitudes.
  10. Fargrow

    Fargrow Initiate (0) Feb 7, 2013 Michigan

    Those are some harsh words. I stand by my post.

    This is not a war that needs to be won. I'm not out on the street handing out craft beer pamphlets. Most importantly (not that I need to defend myself to someone who clearly takes the internet too seriously), that post wasn't meant for Matt to see. It was meant for you all, who know better. If I ever met him, I would tell Matt that craft beer is a 4-ingredient food product that he should not be afraid of. Your "sky-is-falling" attitude is toxic to conversation. Have a beer and relax.
    JohnnyMc, mlefebvre7, fox227 and 39 others like this.
  11. Kanger

    Kanger Zealot (521) Sep 3, 2013 New York

    Kind of the same battle, but granted Big Record labels aren't spending millions of dollars to try to make you believe that a band like Puddle of Mudd is an indie band.

    Bo_bandy likes this.
  12. hoptheology

    hoptheology Poo-Bah (5,092) May 12, 2014 South Dakota
    Society Trader

    I agree that us craft guys need to tone down a bit. It's easy to really slam the macro beers because we've graduated from that. Some people prefer to stay in preschool. That's okay. And I don't mean that in an offensive way. Some just like drinking Bud Light and that's all. But perhaps that's because they have never had the chance to try a craft brew, or as some have said, are driven away by the snobbery. I think Shock Top is a good gateway to crafts.

    I'm guilty sometimes of being a snob, but I try not to let it get out of hand. In person I'll joke with someone and say, "how about you try something with flavor?" and smile at them, letting them know I'm not picking a fight. At the end of the day it's beer - it's not politics or war or religion.
  13. spicoli00

    spicoli00 Defender (642) Jul 6, 2005 Indiana

    Can someone tactically activate a beer into my mouth?
  14. cambabeer

    cambabeer Meyvn (1,242) Dec 29, 2010 New York
    Fest Crew Society Trader

    yeah, I'm actually suprised that percentage isn't higher. Almost all of my aquaitences that hear I'm into beer they'll say something like "yeah I'm into craft beer, my favorite is shock top."
    StrappingYoungLad and cervezango like this.
  15. gory4d

    gory4d Defender (657) Apr 14, 2007 Texas

    Who is Matt? He's not mentioned in either article, and does not otherwise appear in this thread. I'm confused. Confusion is toxic!
    SouthAtholSuds, Plissken and Fargrow like this.
  16. jrnyc

    jrnyc Meyvn (1,159) Mar 21, 2010 New York

    Not surprising. If BMC spent as much money on making quality beer as they did on Marketing, misleading and brainwashing the American public they would make amazing beer.

    Pretty sickening they need to make their fake craft beer appear to be well made beer by calling it "crafty" or finely crafted.
    pjbear05, sajaffe1 and Kanger like this.
  17. evilcatfish

    evilcatfish Defender (626) May 11, 2012 Missouri

    I have no problem with Shocktop or where people think it comes from. A lot of places that aren't craft centric often have it, and no matter how hard we try, sometimes we end up in these places.

    Granted its not the greatest beer out there, but I'm a firm believer that if Shock Top was brewed by a respected craft brewer it would receive much more praise
  18. Kanger

    Kanger Zealot (521) Sep 3, 2013 New York

    StuartCarter likes this.
  19. Kanger

    Kanger Zealot (521) Sep 3, 2013 New York

    I have no prob with the beer itself.

    The main issue is Labatt spending nearly $3 million in 2015 to TRICK people into believing that it IS craft beer.
    Bung, Roguer and jrnyc like this.
  20. Kanger

    Kanger Zealot (521) Sep 3, 2013 New York

    Everyone should read that Labatt PDF:

    This first line of it states:


    They are literally waging war on smaller brewers.

    EDIT - The title of this thread should be that quote
  21. otispdriftwood

    otispdriftwood Initiate (0) Dec 9, 2011 Colorado

    There is something to be said about how the macro lager brewers have responded to the emergence of better beer and it is best expressed in the old adage - "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em". When you think about it, that's what they're doing. And every Shock Top or Blue Moon or whatever big brewer crafty beer they sell, it's one less of their core product that they sell. After all, the people who buy the 'crafty' stuff are more likely macro lager drinkers than craft beer drinkers who already have their favorites or know that the crafty stuff is just that, crafty. And if a percentage of the crafty buyers want something better, they're not going back to macro lagers, they're looking up the taste/abv/quality chain, not down. So either the macro lager brewers will need to get craftier, or lose customers forever. Either way, it seems to me that once a beer drinker weans him or herself off macro lagers, they never go back and the macro lager brewers lose market share for their core products. It all sounds good for real craft beer, but there is a caveat. If the macro lager brewers see their core product market share slip too much, they will go after the craft beer segment based on price, which would be a catastrophe.
  22. SirRainboom

    SirRainboom Initiate (0) Jul 27, 2014 Germany

    Hey now. Lambics make for at least 5-6 ingredients! And come on, French always equals pretentious. :rolling_eyes:

    @otispdriftwood makes some nice points. One of the ironic things with the whole "if you can't beat 'em, join em" thing here specifically is that the "craft" stuff produced by subsets of the bigger companies is pretty much always more expensive than products of the traditional ones. I can get 0.5l bottle of Schneider Weisse or Weihenstephan for less than any 0.33l bottle of CraftWerk or Braufactum.
    Fargrow likes this.
  23. Droopy487

    Droopy487 Aspirant (231) Dec 3, 2013 Tennessee

    Some people fall into the category of what my old college roommate was explaining to me when I saw him on a recent trip. I can't say I disagree with him. He is Bud Light guy through and through. Good for him. But, he wanted to mix it up some, so he started buying some Sam Adams and Shock Top varieties. (In his defense, he is from a small town that has been dry until just the past couple years...so even bud light was non existent in this town.) I asked him why doesn't he try some other beers like Sweetwater, New Belgium, Great Lakes, etc. if he's willing to try Shock Top's beers and a couple Sam Adams' beers.

    His answer was plain and simple. He said, "I buy Sam Adams because I know it will be decent. They have been around for years. Is it the craziest beer ever? No. But, I just don't want bud light anymore." He said he buys Shock Top simply because the label tells what it is clearly and he knows they are owned by Budweiser, so he knows since it is from a big beer company it will be decent as well. He said, smaller companies confuse him. He said, "I'd like to try different things, but I get confused and aggravated so I just buy what I know and go on. He further said, how am I supposed to know what "Road Trip" is or what the crap does Kolsch mean? He said when you are in a liquor store that's 6 months old and you ask the clerk what a beer style is or tastes like and they just shrug their shoulders at you it's kind of hard to justify throwing money away at beers you've never heard of.

    He is telling me he wants to explore craft, but it's hard in a small town with little access and even less access to people to provide insight. Some of us are so high on our pedestal, we forget what it's like not being throat deep in a hobby that some people don't even know this hobby exists. LOL.

    Can't say I disagree with him. How is someone wanting to try different beer styles and get into craft beers supposed to know what this is? Not just beating up on SW, a lot of breweries have labels that don't tell what is either.
  24. emannths

    emannths Aspirant (231) Sep 21, 2007 Massachusetts

    Figuratively, not literally. There are no guns involved, afaik. :wink:

    And...of COURSE they're waging war on their competitors! That's how most businesses operate!
  25. drtth

    drtth Poo-Bah (4,006) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania

    Once again a large mass market brewer fails to recognize that the real threat to their market share is coming from Wine and Spirits.
  26. jampics2

    jampics2 Meyvn (1,484) Dec 19, 2008 Ohio

    When companies that are household names (Bud, Miller, Coors) spend millions to hide that brand recognition, there's something seriously shady going on. It's up to consumers to educate themselves, plain and simple; until that happens, this problem will linger. And we, as craft beer fanatics, need to understand that not everyone cares as much as we do...just like many here don't care where their clothes were manufactured or where their food was grown.
  27. ASak10

    ASak10 Initiate (0) Jan 2, 2014 Colorado

    This is an excellent point. I'm "into" beer and I can't figure out what the hell type of beer that is supposed to be :confused:
    Droopy487 likes this.
  28. ASak10

    ASak10 Initiate (0) Jan 2, 2014 Colorado

    I think they are all well aware of it, but it's not like they only have to fight one fire at a time. I'm sure they are working on how to gain market share back from craft brewing (however small that is) AND dealing with the wine and spirit issue.
    DWheeler379 likes this.
  29. Jirin

    Jirin Aspirant (227) Apr 28, 2013 Massachusetts

    Have you seen those Blue Moon ads? They show people manually checking the quality of every ingredient and dropping it into small barrels. I suppose that's no less ridiculous than those Coors ads where they show a very concerned man with a mustache holding up a Coors to make sure the color is just right.

    There is a small streak of snobbery in the craft culture but it's one of those cases of 'A vocal minority making the rest look bad'. And 'Pretentious' is one of the most badly used words in the English language. It gets thrown out arbitrarily to cast anybody with a niche hobby of pretending to like something to seem cool. Any time I hear the word 'Pretentious' thrown out to denounce any kind of craft or art I immediately lose interest in talking to that person because it's a big signifier that they're only interested in having their own tightly guarded opinion confirmed.
    JohnnyMc, Bung, dedbeer and 2 others like this.
  30. John_Beeryman

    John_Beeryman Initiate (0) Jul 19, 2014 Virginia

    *evil laugh of a corporate beer executive* "Splendid! All is going according to plan!" *more evil laughing*
  31. SirRainboom

    SirRainboom Initiate (0) Jul 27, 2014 Germany

    Dogmatism much? How is that any more shady than Stone or BrewDog's "guerilla marketing" of crushing an assortment of macros with a forklift/blowing them up/smashing them with golf clubs etc? That this is even proclaimed to be a "problem" is quite distorted IMO. It's not like getting beer in general is a zero sum game and people have blind loyalty to one brand. Plus: This is about beer for the love of it, not everything has to become a socially divisive issue.

    And as a tangential sidenote: Clothing can be really expensive and whether food is "local" or not is irrelevant to its quality.
  32. ASak10

    ASak10 Initiate (0) Jan 2, 2014 Colorado

    Ugh, I hate that I sometimes turn into some some sort of BMC defender in these threads, but those breweries take quality control and consistency very seriously. So yes, that mustached man at Coors actually IS very concerned that the beer is just like they want it to be. You can say what you want about the taste of the beer, but from a quality control and consistency standpoint, no one can compete with BMC.

    Also, there are several Coors divisions that actually do small batch/quality stuff (Sandlot at Coors Field, where Blue Moon was first made, AC Golden), so they certainly have the ability to and knowledge to do it.
  33. Dweedlebug

    Dweedlebug Disciple (352) Feb 28, 2012 Pennsylvania

    That's a more accurate statement. It's not the beer that's pretentious.
    Fargrow likes this.
  34. jrnyc

    jrnyc Meyvn (1,159) Mar 21, 2010 New York

    There may be some pretentious craft drinkers out there, same as any other hobby. But calling people pretentious just because they like quality in the products they consume or use is so ignorant.

    WCKDVBZ Meyvn (1,034) May 9, 2014 South Carolina

    WOW! People are pathetic.
    CraigTravor likes this.
  36. drtth

    drtth Poo-Bah (4,006) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania

    Maybe, but on the other hand maybe they are fighting a small battle they think they know how to deal with while losing the war for public taste overall.

    Here's something that might interest you:


    Edit: Note that the figures for beer include the craft segment.
  37. gory4d

    gory4d Defender (657) Apr 14, 2007 Texas

  38. ASak10

    ASak10 Initiate (0) Jan 2, 2014 Colorado

    I think that may be a better question - is it WORTH it for them to fight the battle against craft, versus focusing on wine/spirits? Thanks for the link, very interesting (and informative).
  39. jampics2

    jampics2 Meyvn (1,484) Dec 19, 2008 Ohio

    It may not be any more or any less shady, but many companies would almost literally kill for the brand recognition BMC has. Strategies vary by industry and marketplace, but I personally find the fact that they can't leverage their household name (and, instead, feel the need to disavow and bury it) doesn't say much about the public's perception of the quality of their core brands.

    Not to mention, at the same time they are distancing themselves from offshoot labels, these companies are running commercials using ingredient buzzwords and featuring brewmasters...a far cry and step in the right direction from the days of skateboarding dogs and Sweds in bikinis, but makes me wonder if they don't even believe their brand's quality is enough to legitimize their offshoots. It'll be interesting to see if they can turn the corner on public perception of quality, freshness, honesty, hand-crafted-ness and if the distance between the flagships and offshoots is narrowed or continues to grow.

    Agreed, just saying that the things we are most passionate about may not matter at all to others (and vice-versa).
    wrightst likes this.
  40. RandyWilde

    RandyWilde Initiate (0) Jun 27, 2014 North Carolina

    Well a second or third order effect of this campaign to market Shock Top as a craft beer could be that consumers of Shock Top think to themselves "Wow, Shock Top is really good! I wonder what other craft beers are like..." Then they will try a Blue Moon or something similar that is available almost everywhere and slowly expand into buying other things. Not a short term victory in the eyes of smaller business but a potential victory, none the less. A Shock Top today, a Blue Moon in 2 months a Sierra Nevada in 6 months and so on and so forth. Cheers to hoping!
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.