Best beer by country

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by Orca, Jul 15, 2013.

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  1. edwado

    edwado Initiate (0) Jul 9, 2013 New Jersey

    Almost %100 agreement with you except ........Heineken-you have got to be kidding me? Don't even mention it.You were 18? come on now- you spoiled your post. Great picks although I have never had Ayinger-will try; for me Vitus and Aventinus; half a dozen of one ,six of another.
     
  2. Hoppsbabo

    Hoppsbabo Pooh-Bah (2,029) Jan 29, 2012 England
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Yeah, what's the oatmeal stout thing all about?
     
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  3. Samichlaus82

    Samichlaus82 Initiate (0) Jul 26, 2012 Germany

    I agree totally. Spending half my life in Europe (Germany/Belgium/England)and the other half in the USA has enlightened me to come to the conclusion that the American Beer drinking only tastes an extremely limited amount of traditional/historic beers. Americans only preview the select few beers that select importers (All Saint's Brands, B. United International, D & V International, Shelton Bros, etc...) deem appropriate to the chaotic American Beer market. The Americans think they have the most open and sophisticated palate; however, due to their lack of travel they never experience anything beyond the typical beer advocate & ratebeer hyped beers. The European Beer tradition is much to sophisticated for the American palate. While attending Weihenstephaner, I had a beer tasting with the head brewer and in all honesty he felt most American Craft beers should not be labeled as beer because of the excessive use of adjuncts. When we tasted Bourbon County Rare, he insisted that the beer ruined the flavor of the sublime Pappy Van Winkle.
     
  4. JuicesFlowing

    JuicesFlowing Initiate (0) Jul 5, 2009 Kansas

    Ireland: O'Hara's stout
     
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  5. Thehuntmaster

    Thehuntmaster Initiate (0) Sep 2, 2009 South Africa

    Germany: Eszett
    Belgium: 3F Lente
    USA: Rare
    England: Thornbridge Bracia
    South Africa: Kings Blockhouse IPA
    Denmark: Mikkeller Bourbon George
     
  6. Tut

    Tut Initiate (0) Sep 23, 2004 New York


    While I agree with you completely on the average American craft beer drinker's lack of exposure to the best beers from other countries, I don't buy the rest. Saying "The European Beer tradition is much to sophisticated for the American palate" is silly and smacks of arrogance. The head brewer at Weihenstephaner is wrong about the excessive use of adjuncts in our craft beers, and it sounds to me like you both have the same limited experience with our beers that many Americans have with yours.

    Although I've been pointing out American BA's general lack of knowledge of European beers on this thread, the fact remains that many of us travel extensively and have as sophisticated a palate/beer knowledge as anyone in Europe. I've met many Germans who know your beers well but think the USA is basically Bud and Coors type beers. They're totally clueless about the excellent range and quality of craft beers here.
     
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  7. rozzom

    rozzom Pooh-Bah (2,534) Jan 22, 2011 New York
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    You're absolutely right. But I also see where Tut is coming from. I'm from the UK and have been living in NYC for the last five years. It's always tough in threads like these when the 'best' from the UK usually constitutes three or four of the ten or so UK staples that can be found at your nearest Whole Foods.

    Not quite an apples to apples comparison, but imagine lots of people chiming in with Sam Adams Boston Lager as the best beer in the US, and you get the picture. Plus you have to take into account that (although I agree Ruds, things are changing) most of the best UK beer is available on cask, and therefore a) won't make it's way to the US and b) cannot be traded for by US BAs (in contrast to some of the best examples of US beers, that European BAs can trade for, or sometimes find in a shop/bar/pub).
     
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  8. Samichlaus82

    Samichlaus82 Initiate (0) Jul 26, 2012 Germany

    I agree German Beer Drinkers wouldn't know shit from Shinola regarding good American Craft beer. I was raised in the liquor business because my father owned a large chain of liquor stores in CA, WA, OR specializing in European Beers/American Craft. Arrogance is possibly the right word, but due to the "newness" of the Craft industry I find it odd that most beer aficionados assume aging beer is an American phenomena. My father attended the 1968 Thomas Hardy Ale festival and was astonished by the concept; however, little did he know England, Belgium, Germany had been aging beer in oak for years without pasteurization and without the addition of genetically engineered yeasts. I absolutely love Founders KBS, Pliny the Younger, Kate the Great, Three Floyds Darkness, etc..., but I'm also not an idiot to know much chemistry and adjuncts (sugar, non beer yeasts, Monsantos Genetically Modified Barley/Wheat, etc..) go into American Craft beer. I remember going to the New Albion Brewery and meeting Jack McAuliffe in Sonoma as a kid and my father admiring Jack's tradition of acknowledging European traditions and utilizing their disciplinary techniques towards brewing. Jack wanted Beer to be a food item. Not simply another alcoholic beverage.
     
  9. keithmurray

    keithmurray Pooh-Bah (2,943) Oct 7, 2009 Connecticut
    Pooh-Bah Society

    England - Fuller's London Pride
    Canada - Dieu Du Ciel Equinoxe Du Printemps (Hon. Mention: La Fin Du monde)
    Germany - Aventinus Eisbock
    Belgium - St. bernardus Abt 12
    USA - Anchor Porter
    Sri Lanka - Lion Stout (word to my avatar)
    Jamaica - Dragon Stout
    Ireland - Guiness Foreign Extra Stout
    Australia - Cooper's Extra Stout
    Mexico - Bohemia
    Poland - Zyweic Porter
     
  10. StJamesGate

    StJamesGate Grand Pooh-Bah (3,462) Oct 8, 2007 New York
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    A better comparison is Flying Dog:
    Admired, sometimes even worshipped, in the UK, Netherlands, Spain, etc. as proof of how good US craft beer can be.
    Why? Because they've worked very hard to expand their European distribution.

    Anybody think that FD is among the best American craft? Anyone?

    Flip that around and you've got how it is for beer geeks in the US with British beer. There are 1000+ UK brewers, but it's always Fullers/Youngs or Sam Smith making these lists.
     
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  11. Orca

    Orca Grand Pooh-Bah (4,441) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Pooh-Bah Society

    I'm sure everything you're saying is true. And I have no illusions that the beers I can get here in the States from England, Germany, Belgium, and elsewhere represent anywhere near the best those countries have to offer. I also didn't limit responses to Americans only, and so far people have responded from around the world (as I'd hoped), including Israel, South Africa, Germany, UK, Argentina, Netherlands, and Australia. Beers have been mentioned in this thread that I'd never heard of before, and I'll do my best to seek them out.

    My main point when it came to Tut's comments, which I think you understood, was that a lot of us (a) aren't beer experts and (b) haven't had the opportunity to spend a great deal of time sampling a wide variety of beers at their source of origin—but that doesn't invalidate our opinions about the beers we have had. Mainly I just thought he was taking things a bit too seriously, given the context.

    I'm loathe to quote Donald Rumsfeld, but he got this one right: "You don't know what you don't know." That doesn't mean we can't (or shouldn't) talk about what we do know, especially when it comes to beer.
     
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  12. rozzom

    rozzom Pooh-Bah (2,534) Jan 22, 2011 New York
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    Yeah that's a better example.
     
  13. rozzom

    rozzom Pooh-Bah (2,534) Jan 22, 2011 New York
    Pooh-Bah Trader


    Again I totally agree. And any country is going to be at a disadvantage when it's beers are being judged solely based off the distribution another country receives.

    I would just add though, that given it's cask-centric nature, the UK gets particularly short shrift in these types of discussions. Are there great Belgian (for example) breweries that I have never heard of that I don't have access to in the US? I'm sure. Would some of the beers I do have access to from Belgium be better at the source? Quite possibly. But I still get to sample a wide range of excellent Belgian beers/breweries in the US (3F, Cantillon, Rochefort, De Struise, Fantome amongst many others), and can come closer to having a rounded opinion of that country's beers. To sample the vast majority of the 'best' UK beers, you have to go directly to the country, period. There is no other option.
     
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  14. Tut

    Tut Initiate (0) Sep 23, 2004 New York

    No shit! .....and they usually take an authoritative tone in their posts rather than saying something like "I've only had a few bottled Fullers or Sam Smiths, which I thought were good, but wonder if they are really the best Britain has to offer".
     
  15. Tut

    Tut Initiate (0) Sep 23, 2004 New York

    And it's the same for German beer.
     
  16. Zimbo

    Zimbo Pooh-Bah (2,281) Aug 7, 2010 Scotland
    Pooh-Bah

    At the moment it's Tempest Pale Ale in Scotland. But that will certainly change next time I'm in the pub.
     
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  17. DaveAnderson

    DaveAnderson Initiate (0) Jan 11, 2011 Minnesota

  18. patto1ro

    patto1ro Pooh-Bah (1,998) Apr 26, 2004 Netherlands
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Never understood the liking for Flying Dog over here. Availability must be the answer. There's far better US stuff.
     
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  19. ChestSplitter

    ChestSplitter Initiate (0) Jan 22, 2011 Mississippi

    LOL. On the Heineken part you did not notice how far my tongue was stuffed in my cheek. We're all obviously limited by personal experience. In 1984, in the depths of the beer dark ages in America, that was damn good swill to a kid. :wink: A trip to the UK next year will surely take Samuel Smith off this list as well. Try that Ayinger. If you like wheat beer it's great.
     
  20. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Pooh-Bah (2,611) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Can you give examples of genetically modified barley and wheat? There were some threads that showed GMO barley was not released. There was a news item that some GMO wheat had made it out of the lab in small amounts.

    Can you give examples the overuse of adjuncts? Some of that could be true, but many Craft Brewers do no use adjuncts.

    Just asking for some facts.
     
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