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Controversial new label from Mikkeller: Mexas Ranger

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by jmgrub, Feb 27, 2012.

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  1. BrewDogRocks

    BrewDogRocks Initiate (0) Oct 15, 2011 Texas

    Hello. I am mexican, born and bred. I am not in the least bit offended by it. I find it very, very funny. People need to lighten up.
  2. ShogoKawada

    ShogoKawada Meyvn (1,247) May 31, 2009 Pennsylvania

    such as what? That mexico has a vibrant culture? I can't see what else you could infer from the label, which shows two people leaving boring texas going into party time mexico.
    ShanePB and stevefinny like this.
  3. Soneast

    Soneast Crusader (744) May 9, 2008 Wisconsin
    Beer Trader

    I don't get it. What am I missing? What is there to be offended about? I guess I'm perpetuating the stereotype of naive Midwesterner. lol
  4. digita7693

    digita7693 Disciple (394) Jan 19, 2010 Germany
    Beer Trader

    OK taken as that yes, Its not bad, wasnt my initial reaction. I took it as 2 mexicans running across the border to Texas...
    Bit of a knee jerk reaction Ill give you that, but having just taught a seminar on racism in American media I jumped the gun, and wouldnt really expect Mikkeller to do something offensive.

    I didnt take issue with that as much as the comment that "inanimate objects" arent really offensive.
  5. draheim

    draheim Poo-Bah (2,431) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Beer Trader

    It perpetuates the stereotype that Texas is boring.
  6. draheim

    draheim Poo-Bah (2,431) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Beer Trader

    The word is "ignorant," not "naive." (As a former Midwesterner I can say that :wink:)
    I believe this is the actual sign (found in border areas) that this label is a take-off on...

  7. kzoobrew

    kzoobrew Initiate (0) May 8, 2006 Michigan

    As stated previously, my comments were very generalized and based off the prospective of beer labels and previous labels discussed on BA. It would be reasonable to be offended by a swastika but that is also an extreme example. I will happily concede that there are many inanimate object that could reasonably offend someone, but in the context of the labels which have been most discussed on this site my opinion does not change much.

    Side note, it would be nice if all the responses to my remark were located directly beneath. I can only imagine it would lead to a more productive conversation.
  8. digita7693

    digita7693 Disciple (394) Jan 19, 2010 Germany
    Beer Trader

    I completely agree, and I retracted my offense to the aforementioned label after looking at it more:slight_smile:

  9. bum732

    bum732 Meyvn (1,150) Feb 18, 2008 Lesotho

    Would you be offended if i posted the Hindu swastika? It is, after all, a symbol of good luck way before the Nazi's hijacked it.
  10. digita7693

    digita7693 Disciple (394) Jan 19, 2010 Germany
    Beer Trader

    A lot of symbols depend on their method of dissemination and their intent. The Buddhist and Hindu symbol found on many temples has a rather different meaning and association than the one on a nazi flag, which was rotated slightly and has an utterly different meaning and intent behind it.
    That is why in Germany it is illegal to display the symbol, unless for academic research/presentations.
  11. bum732

    bum732 Meyvn (1,150) Feb 18, 2008 Lesotho

    And you know Mikkeller's intent how?
  12. digita7693

    digita7693 Disciple (394) Jan 19, 2010 Germany
    Beer Trader

    Firstly, reading comprehension, please. My comment was clearly a reaction to your comment of posting a Hindu Swastika.

    Secondly, I never claimed to have known their intention. In fact, I posted this shortly after:
    "OK taken as that yes, Its not bad, wasnt my initial reaction. I took it as 2 mexicans running across the border to Texas...
    Bit of a knee jerk reaction Ill give you that, but having just taught a seminar on racism in American media I jumped the gun, and wouldnt really expect Mikkeller to do something offensive."

    Which would lead one to believe, those with a remedial reading comprehension level and/or are not simply out to attack every comment, that I quite clearly do not know their intention, nor do I find it offensive on second thought. I took more issue with the other comments, which was duly noted had you taken the time to read:slight_smile:


    ps as a side note, I think our discussion is nefariously close to asinine bickering and taking up bandwidth. If you'd like to continue the discussion I suggest we spare bumping this post ad infinium and discuss this over a beer, geography permitting, or via BM.
  13. bum732

    bum732 Meyvn (1,150) Feb 18, 2008 Lesotho

    Firstly, reading comprehension, please. My comment was clearly a reaction to your knee jerk initial reaction. Way to miss the point champ.

    Secondly, the fact you had a "knee jerk" reaction to a symbol which you clearly had no information on its intent says a lot about you. I'm glad to see some fellow advocates called you out on your stupidity.

    In all honesty, i did not see your apology before i posted my initial post towards you. I apologize. I think we're on the same page now.
  14. DefenCorps

    DefenCorps Poo-Bah (3,455) Jan 18, 2007 Oregon
    Beer Trader

    Out of curiosity, what makes you think those are immigrants, legal or otherwise? They aren't really dressed for crossing the border (tried hiking in heels ever?), and his hat looks closer to a bowler than a sombrero. Maybe I'm dense, but I can't even find anything particularly distasteful about the label, let alone offensive.

    I'm not typically a fan of an argument that goes "The only things that can offend you are the things that you allow to offend you.", but in a situation like this, I have to agree.
  15. draheim

    draheim Poo-Bah (2,431) Sep 18, 2010 Washington
    Beer Trader

    Scroll up to my post with the yellow sign (I can't figure out how to insert the "arrow" code to carry you straight to it). This is an actual traffic sign posted on freeways in border states to warn motorists to be careful not to hit illegal immigrants running across the road.

    The Mikkeller label is clearly a spoof of this sign. Whether it's offensive is another matter, but this is the context.
  16. cbutova

    cbutova Poo-Bah (3,344) Oct 10, 2008 Massachusetts
    Beer Trader

    Cool artwork/colors. Wouldn't mind trying it either. Yo Quiero Mikkeller. Paired with some Taco Bell I think it would produce un-imaginable results the next day.
    wcintula likes this.
  17. teorn88

    teorn88 Initiate (146) Jun 5, 2010 United Kingdom (England)
    Beer Trader

    Sounds good.
  18. LostTraveler

    LostTraveler Initiate (0) Oct 28, 2011 Maine

    I find the label quite shallow and pedantic
    backfat likes this.
  19. Soneast

    Soneast Crusader (744) May 9, 2008 Wisconsin
    Beer Trader

    Lol thanks (on both counts). :slight_smile:
  20. woosterbill

    woosterbill Poo-Bah (2,616) Apr 6, 2009 Kentucky
    Beer Trader

    Yet more proof that the death of nested conversations is having a negative impact on the quality of our forum discussions. They are already missed. :_(
    coreyfmcdonald likes this.
  21. Pahn

    Pahn Meyvn (1,456) Dec 2, 2009 New York
    Beer Trader

    unfortunately, nested conversations are going the way of the dodo. edit: well, there's reddit (and imdb i guess), but i can't remember the last non-BA proper messageboard/"forum" that i've visited that had nested replies.

    lot of trolling in this thread. note to all you kids out there just discovering trolling and How Funny It Is: it's not funny, and BA is as easy to troll as it is boring to troll. stop it. go have fun with each other on one of the 10,000 sites dedicated to trolls trolling trolls.
  22. kmello69

    kmello69 Defender (618) Nov 27, 2011 Texas
    Beer Trader

    I'm pretty sure the INTENT of this label is to be controversial, so I guess the simple answer to the question is "yes" the label is controversial. It's also stereotypical (all Mexicans as being represented by fleeing illegal aliens, as noted with the image of the sign above) and mildly racist. But hey, we live in a country where the football team representing our capital is called the "Redskins", so have at it. The one thing this label did was inspire discussion, which was likely its intent all along. (p.s. - the beer sounds gross anyway, so i wont be trying it)
    alwaysanswerb likes this.
  23. abecall98

    abecall98 Devotee (448) Aug 11, 2007 California
    Beer Trader

    The beer sounds gross and will probably be 15$ or more, leaving a lot of buyers underwhelmed, like how most Mikkeller beers do. I enjoy that brunch weasel and the regular beer geek brunch, but all these one offs, crazy beers, or wilds they make have all been butthole, especially the new sour one I forgot the name of.

    Oh, the label is pretty. I'm Mexican, but not offended, but I won't discredit those who do find it offensive.
    alwaysanswerb likes this.
  24. stevefinny

    stevefinny Initiate (0) Aug 28, 2009 New Jersey
    Beer Trader

    Couldn't have said it any better!!!
  25. chinabeergeek

    chinabeergeek Meyvn (1,270) Aug 10, 2007 Massachusetts
    Beer Trader

    bobpinch and draheim pretty much summed up how i feel about the situation. but in any case, i think the moderators would be well-advised to simply lock this thread.
  26. jmgrub

    jmgrub Initiate (0) Nov 20, 2010 California

    Totally agree with this, though Nelson Sauvignon was fantastic (even considering the hefty price-tag).
  27. WassailWilly

    WassailWilly Initiate (0) Sep 8, 2007 New York

    I love it !!!!
  28. stevefinny

    stevefinny Initiate (0) Aug 28, 2009 New Jersey
    Beer Trader

    couldn't agree more!!!
  29. yapez

    yapez Initiate (0) Aug 13, 2008 Maryland

    So, I'm a huge fan of Mikkeller beers. I'm not suggesting anyone boycott his beers. But, it would be nice if someone pointed out to him that the label for his "Mexas Ranger" beer is pretty racist.

    Again, I'm not accusing anyone of racism, but the label is racist. It depicts a stereotype of Mexicans in a negative light for cheap comedic effect. It's not even a terribly clever play on words, which I suppose is acceptable for someone whose first language is not English. Again, I'm trying to be as understanding as possible. But, as a Mexican, I can't help but cringe when I see the logo. I love the idea of a person from a completely different culture attempting to connect with mine (cocoa + chili pepper + black beans + avocado leaves), but I would hope he would do so with a modicum of respect.
    yamar68 likes this.
  30. crossovert

    crossovert Initiate (0) Mar 29, 2009 Illinois

    if you are offended by that i don't know what to tell you, grow some skin.
  31. yapez

    yapez Initiate (0) Aug 13, 2008 Maryland

    It's about not having your culture treated as a giant punching bag. There's a reason Black Americans dislike black face, and it's not just because people who dress in it generally aren't funny.
    dcook11, dejrrma and gkatsoris like this.
  32. yamar68

    yamar68 Initiate (0) Apr 1, 2011 Minnesota

    Although that is part of the reason... haha but seriously I'm with you on this one.
  33. yapez

    yapez Initiate (0) Aug 13, 2008 Maryland

    Also, he can be excused for thinking almond milk is typical in Mexico. In Mexico, we have a drink called "horchata." The drink originates from Spain, where it was traditionally made with almonds. In Mexico, we make it with rice. You may have also heard of Spanish "marzipan." In Mexico, we have a similar dessert called "Maizpan," which is made with peanuts rather than almonds. Almond milk is not remotely Mexican.

    Everything about this beer just strikes me as poorly researched and stereotypical. For the record, I absolutely love New Belgium's Cocoa Mole. There's definitely a way to make a "Mexican-flavored" beer without being offensive. Mikkeller failed.
    dejrrma likes this.
  34. crossovert

    crossovert Initiate (0) Mar 29, 2009 Illinois

    i agree with this, if he is trying to make a mole inspired beer he missed the mark a lot, as did new belgium

    The label is not that offensive, honestly, I am about the least racist person alive too. Sometimes you just have to take it, there are a million things that "offend" me it is okay to have intestinal fortitude you know.
  35. yapez

    yapez Initiate (0) Aug 13, 2008 Maryland

    I guess it's the difference between being Mexican and not being Mexican. I do love a good Mexican joke, like "Why are there no Mexicans in the Olympics?" Obviously, there are Mexican olympians, but that's not the point. For whatever reason, I see the Mikkeller label and can't help but feel like my culture was reduced to a mere stereotype without the least bit of wit. Again, perhaps that's because the brewer is European and removed from North American racial dynamics.

    On the other hand, I look at the New Belgium Cocoa Mole label and I see a celebration of Mexican culture. There's a skeleton on the label a la Day of the Dead with a bunch of papeles picados. I look at it and feel proud of my Mexican heritage. When I look at the Mikkeller lablel, I see a cheap joke made at my people's expense.
  36. mondegreen

    mondegreen Devotee (423) Nov 4, 2009 Georgia

    So a beer label that mocks border crossing signs by portraying people trying to leave the US and go into Mexico is racist? If anything, the beer and label are complimenting Mexican culture.

    Here's the sign for reference:

  37. stevefinny

    stevefinny Initiate (0) Aug 28, 2009 New Jersey
    Beer Trader

    I thought the label was clever. I don't see it as racist. "Crossing the Border" really!!!!! To me it sounds like the brewer is going South with the beer, look at the ingredients "(cocoa + chili pepper + black beans + avocado leaves)". I like it.
  38. fvernon

    fvernon Initiate (0) Mar 1, 2010 Wisconsin

    I'm going to give Mikkeller the benefit of doubt here, and say that he hopefully did not do a very good job of perspective-taking while producing this label and simply failed to understand how his communication (this label), when interacted with and interpreted by the population he is depicting, is assigned the meaning of disrespectful or less-than-nuanced stereotyping.

    I don't think there is an objective measure of racism gained by some inherent 'racist' truth out there - it's a phenomenon of social interaction, so an argument about whether it truly 'is' or 'is not' racist may not be too helpful, since racist meaning here is constructed in the interaction between Mikkeller and the OP (and others, I would assume). This points to the message in the label being unclear and potentially troubling; OP: I'm not sure my advice would be to 'grow skin', since that pretty much devalues your power and ability to raise our consciousness concerning being more nuanced perspective-takers... any way you can try and engage Mikkeller in a dialog about the label and its problematic but potentially unintentional message? Maybe an email? Perhaps some mutual understanding and even a new way of thinking or acting regarding Mexican culture could come of this on his part, or maybe he can explain his intended message in a way that alleviates your interpretation... either way, it seems a better discussion than a bunch of us on here getting into an argument over whether or not your sense of disrespect is valid, and done in a way that leaves the burden to either change or deal squarely on your shoulders.
  39. tjensen3618

    tjensen3618 Initiate (0) Mar 23, 2008 California

    I'm gonna bring a bottle to my Mexican in-laws' place next time I go; at least they'll have a sense of humor about it.
    ShogoKawada likes this.
  40. crusian

    crusian Crusader (743) May 14, 2010 Oregon
    Beer Trader

    these signs are in southern california... on the roads... so...
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