Dark IPA?

That would be a Black IPA, a totally unnecessary style IMO, but I lost that argument. Search "Black IPA" on this forum and you should get lots of information.

 

What's there to disagree with in a black pale beer, @VikeMan ?

@asaf another search term would be a cascadian dark/black ale. Basically take an IPA recipe with floral/citrus/dank hops (tropical don't work well from what I've seen) and then add some debittered black or do a cold steep with any roasted malt to add

 

I brewed a black IPA last winter. The only real difference between it and any other IPA was the addition of Carafa III at about 5% of the malt bill.

 

My argument about whether a black IPA is 'unnecessary' or not would be whether you brew a dark IPA or a roasty dark IPA. I personally don't like the roasty flavor with the hops, so I'm in the group that would vote 'unnecessary' because it's just a color issue to call it 'black' and not a flavor enhancement to make it distinct. Otherwise you'd call it an India Dark Stout.

 

@Mothergoose03 at one point I had kicked around the thought of an IDK - India Dark Kolsch

 

Might I suggest an American Stout? http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style13.php

 

Terrible idea. I can't believe they made black IPAs an official style.

 

Some years black IPA was said to be 50% of the specialty category, which makes it popular enough for its own style. How do you feel about White IPA? Red?

 

I used to agree with you, but then I had 3 or 4 really excellent examples that were more than just a gimmicky beer. Much harder to do well than a regular IPA, but really delicious black IPAs exist.

 

I think really delicious hoppy porters and hoppy stouts exist. And for those, there's no need for a "Black IPA" designation IMO. OTOH, "IPAs" that are just dark (but not roasty) seem pointless to me. But I guess you could add color to any style and declare it something new. Anyway, it's all moot. That ship has already sailed. Given that though, I do wish at least that Cascadian Dark Ale or one of the other names had stuck. Black India Pale Ale, whether or not the style was needed, is still a silly name.

 

Fair enough. I can't argue with the silliness of calling a beer black and pale. I like the term CDA as well and usually call mine that. I never liked the ones that were just an IPA darkened while adding as little roasted flavor as possible.

 

This beer is fantastic. It is designated as a Cascadian Schwarzbier , but it is the closest thing to a black IPA that I have enjoyed. They list out the hops varieties so that is a start.

http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/26520/79012/

 

That would be a Black IPL : )

 

touche

 

Nah .. the darker malts tend to over shadow the hops somewhat .. kinda like pissing in the wind really.

 

I'm probably not one to weigh in on having 12 styles of IPA out there. BJCP always did a good job of separating beers out by regionality. Not always, but most of the time. I think we'll see more of this subcategory, so long as the microbrew community continues to endorse shows like "Brew Dogs."

 

Cough cough american stout cough cough

 

My two cents.

I, too, have had some excellent examples of the style; Uinta's Dubhe and Stone's Sublimely Self-Righteous Ale come to mind. I believe that few people would mistake either of these beers as a stout, even an American stout. In my book an American stout, while hoppy, is still predominantly defined by its roast character.

While I agree that Black India Pale Ale is a rather incongruous name, I don't find Black IPA so hard to swallow, as this designates a beer that in essence is an IPA, but additionally is very dark. Some would say that a Black IPA should have (essentially) no roast flavor, while a Cascadian Dark Ale has some noticeable roast and/or other dark-malt character. I actually like this distinction, but this difference is a bit like the distinction between San Diego and Northwest IPAs, which the BJCP has chosen to also ignore.

I've tried my hand at some hoppy dark beers. I agree they are more difficult to pull off well compared to some of the more traditional styles. I regularly brew a hoppy American Brown Ale that comes quite close to my understanding of Cascadian Dark Ale, although I do not dry hop it. This beer I have dialed in to where it is essentially a house beer. I've also tried my hand at a Black IPA a couple of times. While quite drinkable, neither of these two beers has been as good as the two commercial example I mentioned above. In the last one I used 5% crystal 75 and 5% Carafa III Special, both added to the mash. A small amount of roast is apparent, even with this fairly small amount of Carafa. However, the amount of roast certainly does not make it a stout.

Cheers!

 

I'm a big fan of Cascadian Dark Ales/Black IPAs! I brew a couple every year and have only been disappointed once. My last one started out as a "clean out the fridge/freezer" brew but turned out spectacular! I used some aromatic, rye, golden promise, Munich and only 1/2 lb of dehusked Carafa I...I used 4 3ml hop shots (1 @ 30, 1 @ 10 & 2 @ 0 for a 15 minute hopstand), an ounce of Nelson and Mosaic at 0 for the hopstand and 2 1/2 ounces Mosaic for dry hopping and I used BRY-97 West Coast yeast as well. It turned out a deep dark brown (srm was right at 25) instead of black, but it also had a nicely balanced "black"/slight roast characteristic. I had a 40th birthday party last month and this beer kicked very soon after the Zombie Dust clone, which was first...the SNPA clone was 3rd to kick, so that tells me the crowd liked it better than the old standby

 

I feel like my opinion doesn't matter. It seems that commercial brewers have a tough time selling beer if it doesn't have IPA in the name or some other reference to the sub continent e.g., India red ale, India pale lager, etc. I'm pretty sure that @CurtFromHershey 's India dark kolsch would outsell the best example of the Kolsch style merely because consumers would be fascinated with the name. It's frustrating to me to see enthusiasts so swept up in IPA that refreshing but more subtle styles must get a makeover to survive.

 

I'm getting a visual of some ancient Summerian dude ranting about how hops will ruin beer as he is ladling beer out of a mud puddle. I feel like an IPA apologist sometimes, just because the style is so popular now (although IPA bashing seems to be in vogue also). Drink what you like and damn the torpedos (pun intended) : )

Cheers

 

I personally like the Black IPA style. Dry, semi sweet, roasted malt acrid ness, paired with potent dank hop aroma and flavor.. yes please.

 

The name is incongruous, but haven't we reached the point where IPA is no longer an acronym but just means very hoppy beer?

Also, Dunkel Weisse seems to have established this incongruity previously.

I like (but don't love) Black IPAs, and I find them quite different from hoppy porters and stouts.

ETA: and I love some hoppy stouts and porters like FFF's Snow Weasel and Black Flame.