El Cajon Brewing Company, Chapter 11

Discussion in 'Pacific' started by evilc, Oct 22, 2012.

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  1. mrkrispy

    mrkrispy Initiate (0) Apr 5, 2006 California

    I like turtles.
    NoSignsOfPain and NickMunford like this.
  2. besaunders

    besaunders Initiate (0) Nov 8, 2007 California

    It appears that this is turtles all the way down.
  3. evilc

    evilc Initiate (0) Jan 27, 2012 California

    So much win.....
  4. nanobrew

    nanobrew Initiate (0) Dec 31, 2008 California

    I wonder if we can turn one of the beer video blogs into a Jerry Springer show? Ryno09 get on it!
  5. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    So I did a little checking about this restraining claims. On the Monday before Thanksgiving, Steve Meadows did file for a civil harassment restraining order against David. A TRO is pretty routine in a case like this and usually stays in effect until the trial/hearing on the request for a 3-year injunction. The TRO and other papers are not available online, so I have no information on the terms of the order or what specific allegations of harassment have been made against David. It doesn't look as if David has filed any legal papers yet to tell his side of the story.

    Does the order really prevent David for posting here? I doubt it, but I would need a copy of the order to be sure. I personally would rather see the drama stop so the owners can fix the problems with the business and everybody can move on.
    CheapBeerBuzz likes this.
  6. womencantsail

    womencantsail Poo-Bah (5,830) May 25, 2008 California
    Beer Trader

    I think we're a little beyond that point...
    MarkIntihar likes this.
  7. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    What can I say? I'm an optimist.
  8. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    Sounds like the owners need to invest in something called a "Head Brewer" and "Malt, hops, yeast" if they want to survive as a brewpub.
  9. evilc

    evilc Initiate (0) Jan 27, 2012 California

    All you need are home brew kits!
  10. Retsinis

    Retsinis Champion (848) Sep 25, 2009 California
    Subscriber Beer Trader

    the results are in...you are NOT the father! "I told you she was ho" Oh wait, wrong thread nvm. :stuck_out_tongue:
    albertq17 and afrokaze like this.
  11. jp7161

    jp7161 Initiate (0) Dec 22, 2011 California
    Beer Trader

    Not me. This is the best thread going on BA right now.
    Retsinis and Levitation like this.
  12. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    Well, there is that. ECBC if one of my wife's favorite places for date night, so I get to drink beer while I make my wife happy. That's almost as good as if she liked to watch football.

    I know the BK attorney for ECBC and for the landlord too. Both are good guys and I have a front row seat to the fun.
  13. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    Why on EARTH is ECBC her favorite place? Food is subpar, service is slow and beer is...? Absent for house beer. I can think of a dozen other joints I'd rather go.

    Unless...she likes the quiet intimacy of an empty restaurant, then I could see the appeal of ECBC.
  14. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    Thanks to ECBC for putting a black mark on the entire industry in the county:


    Other cities that may be looking at the industry as a whole to bring in new revenue. However, it doesn't take much searching to discover that 1) breweries are expensive and smaller cities have smaller budgets. a $625,000 loan that may go unpaid will give other civic leaders pause. 2) this isn't just isolated.

    Since the dumbass who opened ECBC didn't have a solid business plan and refused to listen to his head brewer about the needs for materials to make beer (which is why you're in business) he's screwing over people beyond himself.

    Blacklist ECBC.
    Hatzilla and pinkgrenade like this.
  15. Xul

    Xul Crusader (761) May 18, 2008 California

    Maybe she likes to watch hot girls wield a mop.
  16. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    I'm not much of a beer guy, but my wife really likes their IPAs. The Quatro Cajones Quad and the Off Duty IPA are her favorites.

    We usually sit at the bar and order dinner. I like the stuffed burgers and the only "bad" food I've ever had there is the "lil' bag o'bones". Yeah, the service can be slow at times, but that doesn't suprise me with all of turmoil.
  17. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    No, she's not switch hitter.
  18. pinkgrenade

    pinkgrenade Aspirant (245) Aug 19, 2011 California
    Beer Trader

    this guy... doesnt get it lol. also doesn't understand why places deserve to be black listed apparently
  19. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    I've been practicing law long enough to know that there are two sides to every story and that people involved in lawsuits will often get very emotional statements or tend to exaggerate their stories a little bit. Some of what has been said by both of these guys has to be taking with an industrial sized grain of salt. If the owner is as bad as David describes, I'm sure we'll someday be reading about a huge sexual harassment lawsuit some day.

    Before I "blacklist" a business, I'm going to need a little bit more to go on the words of a bitter ex-partner. I like the place and we have a good time.

    Now I will say that I have seen things in the public records form the current owners that bother me. The court doesn't set the payment plan in a Chapter 11, the debtor proposes it and the creditors get to vote on it and they haven't filed the reorganization plan yet. And how do you get that far behind on rent that the landlord has to file and eviction lawsuit? I don't get their either.
  20. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    El Cajon Brewing Company is the case study in how to rip off municipal funds and tank a business.

    I hope the City takes this guy behind the woodshed and recoups their investment.
    Hatzilla likes this.
  21. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    You just answered your own qeustion on why he should be blacklisted. He opened a brewupb without any knowledge, or interest in the brewing aspect. Refused to listen to his head brewer on the needs of a brewpub to...make beer...then fired him. The fact it's his brother is just fodder. He's in bankruptcy 1 freakin' year after opening and is screwing over the city and his own landlord. With all the other fantastic world class breweries and beer joints, there's no reason to support this place.

    Blacklist it, let it fail and then someone else will come in, rebrand the building and build a business with a solid positive record who *gasps* isn't an utter Galaxy-Class Asshat. It's a great facility with a top notch brewhouse...just run by a moron.
  22. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    That's probably the one bright spot out of all of this...so far. The North County Times published a story yesterday that ECBC is still making its loan payments...so far.
  23. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    While your suggestions are appealing, life and business are never that that simple. If you let the business crash and burn without a viable plan of action, everybody gets hosed: the employees, the vendors, the landlord and the tax payers of the City of El Cajon. In a Chapter 11, there is a chance of either a viable plan of reorganization and a payment plan OR a sale to an interested third party. But right now, you've got a business that owes over $645,000 to the City of El Cajon and probably more than $100,000 in back rent. If you sell the business, you probably need to make a deal with the city and the landlord and they will have to take a haircut in a sale. The might have to take a haircut in a plan of reorganization too, but I'm willing to given them a little time.

    Take a look at what happened to Hostess. Yes, Hostess was run by a bunch of turds. So was the bakers union that went on strike. The Teamsters Union, who represented 2/3 of the Hostess workings, was BEGGING them to call off the strike. Now you have over 18,000 people out of work and I'm betting that Bimbo Bakeries will swoop in and pay less than $300 million for what's left. That's nearly $1 billion on pension benefits that won't get paid.

    In this case, I think everybody is better off from a money standpoint if ECBC can tread water until their get their act together.
  24. evilc

    evilc Initiate (0) Jan 27, 2012 California

    I have a growler from there. Is a pic of it shattered in order? :slight_smile:
    StarRaptor likes this.
  25. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    You're assuming the Galaxy-Class Asshat that owns ECBC will be able to run the business into profits. Given his stellar record so far, in which he's ignored solid advice, I'd say your optimism isn't warrented. Public funds aren't some endless piggy bank to be raided, via bankruptcy I hope the city can force the owner out, sell it off and recoup some of their funds. I'm sure the drama will continue and if he remains in business here's a tip:

    Hire a goddamn excellent brewer, give the guy what he needs to make world-class beer and you'll do fine. If you make average beer, you're going to fail. The damage already done in the community and online isn't going to drive business to him.

    I'll never step foot in that joint again, nor will I recomend it to anyone. While not a brewpub, I do recomend West Coast BBQ in La Mesa as an alternative. Great beer, great prices and damn good food.
  26. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    While I may be hoping for the best, I'm not assuming anything with respect the owner's ability to make this place profitable. I do agree with a lot of the suggestions that have been made here to make the place look like it isn't dead and I even overheard staffers there talking about things like getting a full liquor license and flip flopping the bar and restaurant areas. Are the plans feasible? Will they or have they hired good brew master? Those are good questions. But forcing the owners out will rarely workout as well as a negotiated purchase.

    I used Hostess as example of how a Chapter 11 can go extremely bad for everybody. At the other extreme, you have the Los Angeles Dodgers. In that case, the owner was Soverign-Class Asshat. (Side note: Soverign class starships are larger than the Galaxy class starships).

    Major League Baseball was trying to force the owner out and the owner filed Chapter 11. Eventually, the bankruptcy court approved a sale. All the creditors got paid, the team is still in tact and the Asshat owner got a huge return on his investment. Everybody wins. Two cases, to extremely different results.

    Thanks for tip on West Coast BBQ. I like to support local businesses, particularly those in East County.
    Beerandraiderfan likes this.
  27. DougOLis

    DougOLis Initiate (185) Aug 15, 2008 California

  28. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

    I prefer to think of myself as a geek instead of a nerd.
  29. tyrsis

    tyrsis Disciple (320) Mar 13, 2009 California
    Beer Trader

    only nerds say that
  30. Beerandraiderfan

    Beerandraiderfan Initiate (0) Apr 14, 2009 Nevada

    You guys are both correct. One is focusing on how the product needs to change. One is focusing on the $$$/legal issues that need to change. The place can't survive without changes to both apparently.
    IceAce likes this.
  31. CarlStarrett

    CarlStarrett Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2012 California

  32. SDDanC

    SDDanC Initiate (0) Mar 1, 2011 California

    I will disagree with the notion that house beers are absent.
  33. dimce

    dimce Initiate (0) Aug 24, 2011 California
    Beer Trader

    Literally read this thread all the way from post 1...without a beer. Much better than what's on TV. Think I need a beer now
  34. Craftattle

    Craftattle Initiate (0) Nov 27, 2012

  35. BrianTheBrewer30

    BrianTheBrewer30 Aspirant (211) Nov 17, 2009 Massachusetts
    Beer Trader

    ECBC need to sell out to Pizza Port.
  36. Sebowski

    Sebowski Initiate (122) Jan 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    Pizza Ports West of the 5 only.
  37. besaunders

    besaunders Initiate (0) Nov 8, 2007 California

    I depends on your definition. Their future production facility in Carlsbad will be east of the 5, and I think they'll have a restaurant of sorts there.

    I think everybody is missing the best fit here, though: Hillcrest Brewing East.
    pinkgrenade likes this.
  38. BrianTheBrewer30

    BrianTheBrewer30 Aspirant (211) Nov 17, 2009 Massachusetts
    Beer Trader

    Pizza Port El Cajon. You watch the flock flow....
  39. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    If a beer is brewed, and nobody drinks it, was it actually ever brewed?
  40. albertq17

    albertq17 Initiate (121) Oct 11, 2010 California

    Why is this funny to you?
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