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Finally! Fresh Mongo Bottles

Discussion in 'Pacific' started by OTB, Mar 21, 2012.

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  1. OTB

    OTB Disciple (390) Sep 2, 2011 California

    I posted on this a few weeks ago. Seemed everywhere you looked the freshest Mongo on shelves here in So Cal of all places was from November 2011. New batches just delivered with a bottled date of 2-28-12. Fresh Mongo is soooo good !

  2. tjensen3618

    tjensen3618 Initiate (0) Mar 23, 2008 California

    Sweet, I haven't had a Mongo in months.
    Anybody know when Hop-15 is coming out? love that beer.
  3. pmarlowe

    pmarlowe Meyvn (1,214) Nov 27, 2010 Virginia
    Beer Trader

    Yeah I noticed this too. November bottles were sticking around until a little while ago, and suddenly new stock hit.
  4. BuckeyeOne

    BuckeyeOne Zealot (515) Mar 9, 2008 Washington

    But the question is, Does it have a ton of sediment in the bottom?
  5. pmarlowe

    pmarlowe Meyvn (1,214) Nov 27, 2010 Virginia
    Beer Trader

  6. taffeys

    taffeys Initiate (0) Dec 23, 2005 California

  7. MCorrea

    MCorrea Initiate (154) Aug 23, 2010 California

    If I wanted that much pulp in my drink, I'd buy orange juice. Is lost abbey even trying to fix this? I like the beer on tap, but the huge sediment issue keeps me from ever buying bottles.
  8. pmarlowe

    pmarlowe Meyvn (1,214) Nov 27, 2010 Virginia
    Beer Trader

    Are you drinking the sediment?

    My intuition tells me they really don't care.
  9. BuckeyeOne

    BuckeyeOne Zealot (515) Mar 9, 2008 Washington

    Tomme really does care. I ran into him at Whole Foods in Seattle a few months back. I was openly complaining about the sediment in the bottle to the store beer guy. Tomme was standing right behind me. I had no idea it was him. He gave me his card and said they believed they had the solution. I told him I hoped so because I love it on tap but won't buy the bottles with all that sediment.
  10. pmarlowe

    pmarlowe Meyvn (1,214) Nov 27, 2010 Virginia
    Beer Trader

    I have bad dreams about these types of things happening.

    But that's encouraging to hear. I love Mongo on tap also.
  11. tyrsis

    tyrsis Disciple (321) Mar 13, 2009 California
    Beer Trader

    I don't see the big deal. Don't pour the last ounce in your glass. FWIW, I have yet to have a bottle with floaters in it...
  12. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    I've never noticed the sediment. I assume it's yeast, but I don't think the bottles are bottle-conditioned. Is it just due to incomplete fermentation?
  13. libbey

    libbey Initiate (0) May 18, 2008 British Indian Ocean Territory

    Fresh Mongo on tap is a very tough to beat in my humble opinion
  14. riko

    riko Aspirant (208) Jan 18, 2008 California
    Beer Trader

    It's not as easy as that, unfortunately. A certified Cicerone that I know had so much trouble with sediment while pouring a new bottle of Mongo that he ended up having to dump it.
    MacNCheese and stawn like this.
  15. EdTheEdge

    EdTheEdge Disciple (392) Mar 26, 2011 California

    Nope sorry I can not get past all that sediment.... "Chunky" beers are not my thing.
  16. brentusaurus

    brentusaurus Aspirant (299) Jan 22, 2012 California

    Oh sweeet I need to go beer shopping.
  17. mrkrispy

    mrkrispy Initiate (0) Apr 5, 2006 California

    I had the new Mongo on tap at a few local places and it was fantastic, best it has ever been.
    I then saw a Feb-dated bottle and had to buy one (I don't usually buy Lost Abbey/Port bottles anymore because of the years-long problems). Burned once again....

    The yeasty pound cake at the bottom was at least 1-finger thick. Unpleasant image of the bottle getting Stifflered. I couldn't even get one 8oz pour out of the bomber without a ton of sediment and the sediment completely wrecked the flavor of Mongo.

    If there were a craft beer version of Tosh.0, Lost Abbey would always be the opening scene.
    I almost wish they could implement a laugh-track audio chip in every cap.
    MacNCheese and stawn like this.
  18. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    With the mega bucks Lost Abbey/Port have dumped into expanding their barrel program (which makes some amazing beers), one would think they'd have dumped some cash into a force carbing addition to their bottling line to cover the basics. I do not want, nor will I buy, bottle conditioned IPA's or the rest of the Port line of beers. Love it on tap, won't buy the bottles.
  19. riko

    riko Aspirant (208) Jan 18, 2008 California
    Beer Trader

    Whenever I think about buying another Lost Abbey/Port bottle, this old image appears in my mind:
    MacNCheese and stawn like this.
  20. stawn

    stawn Initiate (44) Sep 16, 2008 California
    Beer Trader

  21. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    Being a certified Cicerone doesn't mean you know how to pour beer. The first-level Cicerone certification is actually pretty easy to get, which is why there's over 10,000 cicerones now (which is a helluva lot of money for Ray Daniels!) When they ask questions like "Hops contribute to what aspects of beer taste?" I'm not really confident that Cicerones know more than the average beer geek. Hell, I've met brewers who like to swirl and drink the yeast cake, which most people thing is a terrible idea.

    Many great beers are bottle conditioned. Weyerbacher's 100% Simcoe bombers, for example, are bottle-conditioned and I really think it helps the flavor of the beer having both bottle-conditioned and force-carbed side-by-side. I prefer bottle-conditioned beers most of the time, even with a yeast cake at the bottom.
  22. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    If you're a certified server cicerone I do believe it means you SHOULD, by the server definition, know how to pour a beer. I took the test when it was $10, got my pin and everything, and yeah, it was beyond easy. I wouldn't want to be around those brewers who are chugging yeast slugs...maybe they work at Shipyard.

    Sweet, but the point of them force carbing has a lot more to do with consistency than anything else. As much as I love their beer on tap, their bottles have had, and continue to have, varying levels of consistency. For a brewery that's marketing itself as top shelf and demanding top dollar, inconsistent bottles is a huge problem. As the venerable Mr. Krispy pointed out, this is a years long issue. Investing in your hardware for QC purposes is the only logical step.

    Personally I do not want bottle conditioned pales/ipas/red etc....I want to upend the bottle to have every last drop of beery goodness. Otherstyles I'm fine with as they do help stablize the beer over time. But beers with a short shelf life should be consumed asap and if I'm not getting 22oz out of a bottle, I'm not happy.
    stawn likes this.
  23. stawn

    stawn Initiate (44) Sep 16, 2008 California
    Beer Trader

    I disagree. From the Cicerone website (which means it has to be true):
    "The word Cicerone (pronounced sis-uh-rohn) has been chosen to designate those with proven expertise in selecting, acquiring and serving today’s wide range of beers. Only those who have passed the requisite test of knowledge and tasting skill can call themselves a Cicerone."
  24. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    In theory, yes. In practice, no. MacNCheese hit it - they "should" know how to pour a beer. Unfortunately the test is extremely easy, and they can look up answers while they are taking it. Don't think that because someone is a Cicerone they are a beer expert. Many of them are nothing more than a certified beer geek with money to burn. I bet most of the regular BAs could probably pass the test their first try, without studying.

    That said, I can pour a beer that has a 1" yeast cake and not ruin the beer. And I didn't pay $350 for the piece of paper that says I know basic beer geek knowledge.

    My comment was simply pointing out that just because someone has a piece of paper saying they know beer, it doesn't mean they know how to use the knowledge. I still go into renowned "beer bars" that serve their beer in chilled glasses - Rose and Crown in Palo Alto, California for one.

    Also, I wanted to point out that many beer experts think that force carbing a beer is not the "right" way to make beer. Bottle conditioning is more traditional, and creates a far more complex beer, even if the hop profile suffers. I can appreciate it when done well, just like I can appreciate the industrial beer method of force carbing, using hop oil concentrates, etc.
  25. stawn

    stawn Initiate (44) Sep 16, 2008 California
    Beer Trader

    All I can say is that I've been Ciceroning the SHIT outta a ton of beers lately. Usually with my lapel pin on so it's official.
    jpeck13, Aexoonge, jtmartino and 2 others like this.
  26. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    The Cicerone Server is $70 and when they celebrated their 10,000th server exam they ran a special for $10, which is when a ton of us took it. For shits and giggles.

    Bottle conditioning is traditional only because way back in the stone age they didn't have the ability to force carb. Certain beers do benefit it, if you're serving a pale/ipa/hoppy you don't want the hop profile to suffer at all. Why would you do that? Purposefully hurting a beer to not present it in the best possible condition?! It's like using ringwood yeast to make beer, horrible!

    Don't bottle condition pales/IPAs, on top of that they have to sit around warm while the yeasties do their thing and fart out some carbonation. IPA's, stored cold, force carb'd and served fresh. Only way to go. Everything else is just rubbish.
  27. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    I was talking about the Cicerone certification, not the server.

    And you're saying the DFH Squall, Bell's Two-Hearted, Weyerbacher 100% Simcoe, Alesmith's IPA, etc. are all rubbish?

    If done right, bottle condition has a tremendously beneficial effect on the beer. And I misspoke when I said "the hop profile suffers" because it doesn't always affect the beer negatively. The carbonation and yeast interaction will often make the beer taste better, as is very clearly the case with Weyerbacher's 100% simcoe. Try them side-by-side...there's no comparison.
  28. IceAce

    IceAce Champion (858) Jan 8, 2004 California

    Nice post!

    If nothing else, at least your first sentence was correct...but you really should've stopped there.

    Sorry, but bottle conditioning and natural carbonation has a huge effect on; a.) the collar of foam and appearance b.) flavor, as carbonic acid can either add/detract from the entire tasting experience, and c.) the overall flavor profile of the beer, especially if the secondary yeast is a different strain from the primary strain. There are many folks who reside in the opposite camp as you; force-carbonation is a shortcut and results in an inferior product.

    Find a fresh Bridgeport IPA or Anchor Liberty, pour aggressively and you will see (and taste) the difference.

    Au contraire, my rumor-repeating friend. It's possible to brew fantastic beer w/ Ringwood...but those who don't listen to Mr. Pugsley and try to crash their yeast early do tend to suffer dire consequences. It's unfortunate that an entire yeast strain must suffer such persecution due to the actions of misguided brewers

    By the way...there is a metric-ton of difference between the Certified Beer Server Exam and the level of teasting for the Certified Cicerone level...but you undoubtedly already know that. :wink:
    jtmartino likes this.
  29. mrkrispy

    mrkrispy Initiate (0) Apr 5, 2006 California

    I think the point is that if you just pass the Beer Server Exam you know damn well how to pour a beer, many of the questions are quite explicit about pouring and serving!

    Regardless, how many of the people in here have actually poured a bottle of feb. Mongo? I bet all of 2 (myself being one of them)
  30. Indifferent

    Indifferent Initiate (0) Feb 29, 2012 California

    I had no problems with the several bottles of Feb. Mongo I poured. Great beer. I still preferred it on tap (at beachwood with their pulled pork).
  31. MCorrea

    MCorrea Initiate (154) Aug 23, 2010 California

    If it were only an ounce I'd hardly consider it a problem. The problem is there is so much sediment that you'd have to forgo the last 5-6 ounces to avoid all the junk floating around in the bottle.

    No floaties in my beer, thank you very much.
  32. originalgoat

    originalgoat Initiate (0) Dec 6, 2005 California

    I'm 99% certain that the sediment in Mongo is not yeast, but chill haze/cold break material that has bound to the hop proteins from the massive dry-hopping. This happens. You should actually roll the mongo bottle around before opening and then pour the whole thing aggresively, the material will re-dissolve and you'll just have a hazy beer, which was what it was before the haze proteins congealed and settled. And we all know what chill haze tastes like, right?
    afrokaze likes this.
  33. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    This changes the whole discussion. Stone ran into similar issues last year, and while the suspended proteins didn't affect the flavor of their beer, they didn't like the aesthetics of a hazy beer.

    Sounds like a lot of people getting worked up over nothing. :stuck_out_tongue:
  34. mrkrispy

    mrkrispy Initiate (0) Apr 5, 2006 California

    except A) the sediment that gets roused up takes like yeast sediment

    and B) the sediment completely adversely affects the flavor of the beer

    What originalgoat is talking about was completely not applicable to the bottle of Mongo that I opened.

  35. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    Dang, lame. I'd go buy a bottle just to check it out, but I'd rather take your word for it! What temp was it served at?
  36. SHODriver

    SHODriver Poo-Bah (1,549) Aug 13, 2010 Louisiana
    Beer Trader

    it doesn't matter, water(a large constituent of beer) can handle a greater concentration of solutes as the temperature increases and the bottles are sitting at room temp with a quarter inch of sediment. chill it and more 'stuff' will come out of solution. it almost makes me want to pour mongo through a strainer
  37. dcgunman

    dcgunman Defender (668) Jul 1, 2009 California
    Beer Trader

    Was at liquor warehouse, mr kegs, and whole foods (long beach) last week friday and all the mongo bottles had sedi's at the bottom. Only about a month ago I found bottles with very little sedi's at the bottom.

    Question: Do the kegs of Mongo have sedi's at the bottom?
  38. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    Considering the Server exam is first and it goes over pouring/serving of beer a Certified Cicerone should still know how to properly serve a beer.

    In So Cal we do not get DFH Squall/Two-heaerted or Weyerbacher. Can't say I can talk about these beers. And Alesmith is now force carbing their 22oz beers for quality control. If Peter Zien thinks it's a good move, then I'll have to agree. Can't taste beers side-by-side that aren't distributed to SD. I suppose I could go grab a bottle of mongo and bring it to Lost Abbey and do a side-by-side. I'll put this on my to-do list. Given that the brewey is 50miles away, it's not high on my to-do list.
  39. jtmartino

    jtmartino Initiate (0) Dec 11, 2010 California
    Beer Trader

    Cold temperature will cause the yeast to crash out of solution and settle at the bottom. If you don't store your beer cold enough, the yeast will take much longer to settle (homebrewer tip). Also, yeast is not soluble in water, so your comment isn't applicable. It's good info though in general!
  40. MacNCheese

    MacNCheese Initiate (0) Dec 10, 2011 California

    A, can be manipulated with your grist, add a little more carafoam if you want a longer lasting head.
    And by force carbing you can dial in exactly B to the point its exactly where you want it. Which is much much more difficult to do with yeast. I'm a big fan of naturally carbonated bottles for those styles I wish to age. C, sure it'll change, but I do not agree that pale beers need a yeast slug to make then fresh and delicious.

    There's simply better yeast that can be used. Top end of attenuation for WLP005 (ringwood) is 74%, whereis WLP001 (cal ale) starts at 74% and tops out at 80%. If you're trying to a make a dry pale ale, ringwood is not the ideal yeast.
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