Have East Coast Hazemakers Changed Direction?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by Dansac, Feb 19, 2021.

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  1. nc41

    nc41 Initiate (0) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    I would never consider HF, Alchemist, Lawson’s, MBC NEIPAs. They were around well before this OJ bomb craze.
     
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  2. Sheppard

    Sheppard Grand Pooh-Bah (3,282) Mar 16, 2013 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I wish I had the pictures but it was definitely not milkie in the smoothie was. It was milky in the there were so many high alpha acid hops used in this way. It was very lupulin laden. I really need to read Scott Janish's book.
     
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  3. nc41

    nc41 Initiate (0) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
    Trader

    I’d like a 15 day old MBC Dinner right about now, or a Pliny like I had last week. That was so damn good it can’t be understated, should be more like this and not the OJ bombs.
     
  4. stairway2heavn

    stairway2heavn Zealot (722) Aug 17, 2017 New Jersey

    Other Half is definitely trying for minimally bitter and upped the sweetness in the lay year or so. Also, the formerly rare melon profile now is in a very high percentage of their beers. Their core beers, hop showers, All Citra, and space diamonds, tend to be closer to the original recipes as far as I can accurately remember, but even so they aren't quite the same. They are sweeter than they were (but less sweet than the million one offs).
     
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  5. Apathetiq

    Apathetiq Zealot (730) Sep 10, 2012 Massachusetts
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    Thank you for pointing out the melon note! Almost every single OH beer I've had recently suffered from dominant melon qualities. Curiously, another NY darling, EQ has the same thing, but a little dirtier, like pumpkin.

    I would consider these flavors akin to the Trillium "peanut shell" thing, a definite shift in the goals of the beers (through fermentation, mash, or whatever, a choice was made). IMHO to increase the perception of weight, and make bittering (especially in the citrus pithy family) feel out of place in accordance with nebulous feedback that bitter is bad.
     
  6. nc41

    nc41 Initiate (0) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    Hmmm. I’m not sure it’s the lack of bitter that drives NEIPA sales, I think it’s the love of the sweet fruit and how great they smell, plus a robust mouthfeel that’s soft. Just my opinion.
     
  7. jakecattleco

    jakecattleco Grand Pooh-Bah (3,625) Sep 3, 2008 California
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Really, ASB? They've had their own string of beers/recipes that came off sweeter than previous batches. I can't speak to Monkish, but I personally took a break from ASB after the last batch of Nelson Baby! Maybe it's because I'm personally more sensitive to sweetness, but you can't speak absolutely that they've been devoid of their own QC/consistency issues. YMMV
     
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  8. pinyin

    pinyin Savant (1,065) Sep 19, 2013 New York

    EQ uses cheaper thinner aluminum cans, and their hopping process to me at least gives their ales a very distinct orange julius taste. I've gotten this beautiful aroma and flavor in nearly every IPA of theirs that I've bought from the actual brewery.

    I have also bought their beers (refrigerated at the store and in cold coolers in my car) from a bottle shop about 40 miles south in NJ, and the hop character had faded slightly. I'll chalk it up to distributor and retailer mishandling. Something about their hopping technique. Their hoppy beers fade hard and fast when they change temperature for too long.

    When you order from them for brewery only pick up, they make you agree to the terms of keeping the beer in refrigeration up until the point of consumption. You can't check out (pay) until you agree with this. Even printing on the sides of the cans, it states "Drink cold, store cold, trade cold, ship cold".

    To me they produce the best hoppy beers in the region (yes better than OH, Grimm, Finback) but only when bought fresh from the actual brewery and kept chilled until ready to drink.
     
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  9. DrStiffington

    DrStiffington Grand Pooh-Bah (3,586) Oct 27, 2010 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah Society

    Equilibrium is both overrated and overpriced, imo. In NJ I can get better IPAs for nearly half the price per four pack.
     
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  10. bubseymour

    bubseymour Grand Pooh-Bah (4,656) Oct 30, 2010 Maryland
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I think for the Brewers the OP mentioned it is probably a combo of scaled up production and expanded distribution causing the inconsistency and apparent declines. For what it’s worth I visited OH in DC about a month or so ago and tried about 4 different beers and all were excellent IMO. The Aslin classics like Double Orange Starfish still taste spectacular but their new releases are hit or miss. In the past there were never any misses.
     
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  11. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (878) Dec 6, 2014 California
    Trader

    Their doubles have gone sweeter but they still preserve the intense hop oil aromatics. The latest batch of Nelson Baby was actually their best since the OG, quite green and drier. Are you sure you're not thinking of the previous one?

    I think ASB killed it throughout 2020.
     
  12. Dansac

    Dansac Pundit (878) Dec 6, 2014 California
    Trader

    The ones I've had had a lot of orange quality, of the sort I associate with Amarillo hops, but they were way, way too sweet.
     
  13. jakecattleco

    jakecattleco Grand Pooh-Bah (3,625) Sep 3, 2008 California
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    Batch I referenced was mid-2020, not sure if there was one after that. Went back to the 2020 ASB thread, plenty of other folks commenting about the increase in perceived sweetness. I'll agree its definitely more pronounced on the Doubles. Everybody's palates are unique, I just think some folks would disagree about ASB consistency.

    I found similar impact on my enjoyment of Trillium beers when they tweaked their fermentation profile. I don't enjoy them as much now, sweeter than I'd prefer.
     
    #33 jakecattleco, Feb 21, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2021
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  14. bret27

    bret27 Pooh-Bah (2,900) Mar 10, 2009 California
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I meant to buy CNJ 2017 edition and bring that info to this discussion. However when I checked my bag at home they gave me the regular Alvarado CNJ by mistake.
    Sorry, nothing to add. Was looking forward to seeing what 2017 Alvarado would be like.
     
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  15. tinoynk

    tinoynk Pundit (776) Sep 25, 2010 New York
    Trader

    I don't deny that EQ can still produce great stuff, but District 96 is like 30 minutes away and to me has been consistently excellent to a degree other places in the area haven't been. But they also have a much lower output, and though scarcity=quality bias can be a thing, I can also understand how scaling up and needing to shift production to being 100% cans might be a curveball for operations big enough to have been sending out large amounts of kegs pre-Covid.
     
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  16. pinyin

    pinyin Savant (1,065) Sep 19, 2013 New York

    i've been to D96 a few times and I enjoyed everything I've bought from them. their hoppy beers reminded me a lot of Other Half. similar yeast profile and after taste. i still think EQ is the best in the region in terms of hoppy ales closely followed by Finback and OH. conversely, haze cans that I've tried from Icarus in NJ also had this very similar mineralization and hop character to D96 and OH.
     
  17. rolltide8425

    rolltide8425 Pooh-Bah (2,286) Feb 18, 2011 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    I have to agree with everyone about Trillium. I was very excited when they began shipping to PA as I hadn't had any of their offerings in some time. Got them and was disappointed with almost all the IPAs I got. Vanilla PM Dawn was excellent though. Not a fan of this trend towards sweeter, let's shove lactose in everything beers. I've found myself trending back towards lagers, particularly classic German styles, lately because of this.
     
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  18. joerooster2

    joerooster2 Aspirant (254) Aug 18, 2020 District of Columbia

    Aslin is likely a QC issue (you were unlucky), they seem to have tried to grow too fast for their own good. They've always had QC issues even when they made good beer (lots of sediment and hop burn in early batches) so scaling up probably wasn't something they should have done so aggressively. They also had some turnover with their brewers and even one of the owners left (essentially the head brewer), can't imagine this didn't have some impact on the quality of their beers.

    They have almost 40 packaged beers available at the brewery, tells me sales aren't too good, especially when they distribute to every grocery chain in the area, distribute out of state and sell online. They also started venturing into seltzers, wine and ciders although I haven't seen or heard much about the wine or cider stuff in a while. They opened a 2nd tap room recently as well. All these things likely pull resources and time away from the brewing side of things.
     
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  19. TheIncredibleHoke

    TheIncredibleHoke Initiate (0) Nov 11, 2020 New York

    I’ve always considered Other Half my local since they started and I have always been a huge fan. But after being burned with sweet, cloying, thick brown pours for about 40-50% of my OH purchases this year, I’ve stopped buying their beer.

    The few Equilibrium beers I’ve been able to purchase were also just so cloying and overwhelmingly sweet, that I steer clear of them as well.

    My OH experience has pushed me straight into the arms of Threes for most of my local purchases.

    This could really be a big factor. OH has no flagships and very little consistency other than consistently releasing new labels to grab your attention.
     
  20. JayORear

    JayORear Grand Pooh-Bah (3,034) Feb 22, 2012 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah Society Trader

    If you're talking about Nelson Baby! here, the November batch was phenomenal. I was in Sacramento when it came out, and I bought four 4-packs. Amazing beer.

    EDIT: I actually thought it came close in many ways to OG Alpine Nelson.
     
    #40 JayORear, Feb 24, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2021
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