Is supporting lion Nathan craft worthwhile?

Discussion in 'Australia & New Zealand' started by mulder1010, Mar 29, 2012.

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  1. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Meyvn (1,019) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    Question for all of you..............

    Is it really in the best interest of the industry to support lion Nathan made craft. Not talking about Little Creatures as they hold a majority stake, but the squire and mad brewers range. Or is it like goose island? where the quality and creativity remained the same even after the sale to InBev. Should the squire rang be viewed the same as monteiths and pretty much avoided?

    Thanks for input
  2. bylerteck

    bylerteck Poo-Bah (2,894) May 17, 2009 Ontario (Canada)
    Subscriber Beer Trader

    Hoppy Hefe is a great beer and I don't really care who makes it. I don't see why I shouldn't drink it unless someone can tell me.

    I'm not up to speed on who owns what but I'm assuming Malt Shovel is owned by Nathan Lion? I know Malt Shovel brews James Squire stuff as well.

    Which 'craft' lines does CUB brew/own?
  3. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Meyvn (1,019) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    Matilda Bay is under the CUB umbrella. So the question would also include them as well
  4. MrKennedy

    MrKennedy Champion (893) Dec 29, 2006 Australia
    Beer Trader

    I take the view that it depends on the, dare i say, intentions of the brewery.

    If the brewery is essentially producing beers in order to fill a gap that the owner-company has with regards to changing tastes, then i don't believe supporting it is in the best interests of the industry. Yes, there may be some benefits like better beer on tap (Fat Yak/150 Lashes taking over taps previously held by say Carlton Dry/Hahn Super Dry) in most of the pubs and clubs in the country, but i don't think that is the best outcome you could want/hope for/deserve.

    If the brewery is going about producing genuinely good beers that obviously sell, then it is in the best interests of the industry to support them.

    I guess Goose Island produce some decent beers 312, Honkers, IPA that sell plenty and produces a number of other excellent beers (King Henry, BCS and its variants, Sisters series).

    Monteiths intentions hardly seem in the best interests of the industry when they successfully trademark style names (Radler) so that other breweries can't use them. Monteiths also produce beers that seem to try and fill a pseudo-craft gap that i don't believe are good, like Sparkling Ale, Summer Ale, Pilsener, Original, Single Source et al. These seem to be there purely to preserve market-share of problem with that, that's commerce.

    James Squire produce some decent beers in their core range (IPA, Pilsner), but seem to be focusing more on things like 150 Lashes, Golden Ale, a couple of ciders. That's where the money is, i'm sure. There's the odd gem in the sporadic release like Ten20, Rum Rebellion etc. They seem to be straddling the line in between Goose Island and Monteith's.

    As a consumer i'll buy the Squire beers i like or think i'll like if they're the best available to me at the time and won't boycott their stuff. But certainly won't be paying for things that i know are there to purely chase dollars or preserve market-share of the mother company.
  5. joecast

    joecast Meyvn (1,115) Jun 30, 2003 Australia

    Not much different than Mr K. I prefer more independent (and Tasmanian if possible) beers but it doesn't stop me buying drinking and enjoying beer from Matilda Bay or James Squire.
    Is that in the best interest of the craft industry? Probably not since that dollar is going to some multinational corp rather that a guy dumping hops into a kettle in some shed.
    Anyway, I try not to worry too much about such things when buying drinking and enjoying a beer.
  6. danieelol

    danieelol Savant (954) Jun 15, 2010 Australia

    Personally I'm fairly pragmatic in this regard so I probably would buy stuff made by macros if it was half-decent.

    Luckily there seems to be an unwritten rule that macros will not brew anything half-decent. James Squires is garbage now. Hoppy Hefe was reasonably enjoyable but not priced all that cheap anyway. I did buy it and I enjoyed it.
  7. dgilks

    dgilks Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2008 Australia

    Tend to agree with what has been said. I have no real problem buying the good beers that Malt Shovel et al make. That said, there haven't been many in recent times. The JS and MB core ranges have little appeal to me with Alpha Pale being about the only one I'd really be happy drinking. It's a pity too because Golden Ale, IPA, Porter and Dogbolter all used to be quite good. In fact, they all used to be pretty good but have gone downhill in recent years.

    And, yes, I liked Hoppy Hefe. Unlike the Scribbly Gum and Noir Stout it was both tasty and interesting, something that those other beers lacked respectively.
  8. Darwin553

    Darwin553 Initiate (67) Jan 5, 2009 Australia

    I think people on here are being pretty naive as to the extent of the benefit that the wider craft industry receives with pubs and clubs having malt shoval and matilda bay on tap. Not only is it better than the usual options provided by XXXX/Tooheys and Carlton but also it should be viewed as a promotional tool for all players in the industry regardless of whether they have a direct interest or not as it broadens the horizons of the average lager drinking person and puts it in their mind despite whether or not it is a poor representation of the style, that there are other, tastier beers out there and when they need go to the pub again where they have these two options on tap that they choose one of these options first and continue to choose them, but more importantly when they go to the bottle-o that they seek out those craft brews instead of their macro shit...
  9. joecast

    joecast Meyvn (1,115) Jun 30, 2003 Australia

    Darwin553 makes a good point. Obviously more and more people are drinking craft beer and how many of them/us got a start with Matilda bay or James squire?
  10. dgilks

    dgilks Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2008 Australia

    Ahh, but here comes the real questions - Is MB and JS really craft?
  11. goatherder

    goatherder Initiate (0) Jun 10, 2005 Australia

    The thing is, you can now go into pubs in die-hard lager territory & buy a drinkable APA. That's progress. It doesn't matter if you label MB or JS craft (for the record, I say they're not any more), the important bit is that these mega breweries have recognised the shifting tastes of the punters and are doing something about it. I'm more than happy to support them for this, particularly when in most small town pubs they are the only thing on tap worth drinking.
  12. joecast

    joecast Meyvn (1,115) Jun 30, 2003 Australia

    Depends which association they belong to I suppose :wink:

    IMO though, no. Just as important is the question, is it good beer? IMO yes. And that's why I drink beers like fat yak, hoppy hefe, etc.
  13. dgilks

    dgilks Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2008 Australia

    Yeah, it's tough. I suppose my problem is the compromise that appears to go into a lot of the beers they make. Hoppy Hefe, Ten20 and a few others seem to be exceptions but in general I find beers like Fat Yak, Golden Ale, etc to be a bit watered down which takes away from their appeal.
  14. mulder1010

    mulder1010 Meyvn (1,019) Aug 29, 2008 Australia

    The Lion Nathan stuff is supported in Sydney so why show them support? Boycott the taphouse in Darlo until they show appreciation for Sydney and not for Lion Nathan
    Go to 4 Pines, Rocks, or Murray's.
    Quit giving love to a company that does not show support for Sydney. Melboune or bust pretty much
  15. Darwin553

    Darwin553 Initiate (67) Jan 5, 2009 Australia

    What about everyone else? I guess I'll just go and lift a couple of hundred tooheys cartons instead...
  16. foles

    foles Initiate (0) Jan 28, 2007 Australia

    I buy beer that tastes good, and I know is fairly consistent and in good condition. I wont put $$$ into a craft brewery that isn't producing good beer that I like, or that I cant get a fresh example of. I do have a preference for local stuff generally because its condition is better. For example a growler of Feral rye IPA I had on Sat pissed all over the growler of Racer 5 IPA I had recently. Because the hops had dropped right off on the racer 5 as it wasnt super fresh like the feral beer.

    LiIon Nathan gets my $$$ for the mad brewers beers and if its the best of a bad bunch at a pub im visiting.
  17. Lukie

    Lukie Initiate (0) Jun 16, 2007 Australia

    Feral Rye IPA was amazing.
  18. danieelol

    danieelol Savant (954) Jun 15, 2010 Australia

    Okay I drank a few jugs of Golden Ale tonight

    It wasn't too bad really
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