Is the "Russian" Imperial Stout Persona Non Grata?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by AccipiterofBeer, Nov 20, 2022.

  1. AccipiterofBeer

    AccipiterofBeer Zealot (515) Nov 28, 2016 New York

    So the relabeling of Brooklyn Black Chocolate Stout cued me in to this possibility with the war in Ukraine happening and Russia really taking a big fat L not just on the battlefield but also in the globalist economy. Brooklyn Black Chocolate Stout has always denoted itself as the "Legendary Russian Imperial Stout" on its label, but the 2022 labeling notably leaves the Russian out of it. Now it's just an "Imperial Stout" Any thoughts on the matter?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. kodt

    kodt Defender (661) Mar 6, 2013 Illinois
    Trader

    3 Floyds Dark Lord also removed the "Russian" from the label this year, and also featured the Ukrainian flag colors.
     
  3. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Poo-Bah (2,149) Mar 12, 2013 California
    Society Trader

    Wow, stunning and brave. Remove the tenuous link to some beer history most consumers are totally unaware of should bolster the Ukrainians through a harsh winter and send those dirty ruskies running for the hills.

    Corporate pandering at it's finest.
     
    KevSal, kuhndog, FLBeerGuy and 43 others like this.
  4. alucard6679

    alucard6679 Aspirant (252) Jul 29, 2012 Arizona

    Yeah, pretty much this
     
  5. Todd

    Todd Founder (6,696) Aug 23, 1996 California
    Staff Moderator Fest Crew Society Trader

    Basically, execs / marketing teams wanting to play it safe to ensure that there's no consumer backlash / impact to brand reputation and revenue.
     
  6. AccipiterofBeer

    AccipiterofBeer Zealot (515) Nov 28, 2016 New York

    yeah this is my thoughts on it as well. I thought it might be significant considering it is a style of beer differentiated on BA
     
    MacMalt, beergoot and micada like this.
  7. Resistance88

    Resistance88 Zealot (571) Apr 9, 2015 California
    Trader

    Waiting for a time where India attacks Pakistan to enjoy a New England Pakistan Pale Ale
     
  8. AccipiterofBeer

    AccipiterofBeer Zealot (515) Nov 28, 2016 New York

    Of course, as you well know as everyone else knows, there isn't an actual active war going on there.
     
    #8 AccipiterofBeer, Nov 20, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2022
    rgordon and MacMalt like this.
  9. Resistance88

    Resistance88 Zealot (571) Apr 9, 2015 California
    Trader

    i said i am waiting:hugging:
     
  10. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Poo-Bah (2,149) Mar 12, 2013 California
    Society Trader

    I stand with Kashmir! All my homies only drink NEKPA.
    There is, it's just not one that our media finds meaningful so we don't hear much about it
     
  11. chrisjws

    chrisjws Champion (888) Dec 3, 2014 California

    Welcome to Capitalism. You must be new here.
     
  12. Rug

    Rug Poo-Bah (2,105) Aug 20, 2018 Massachusetts
    Society Trader

    Yeah you can't really blame them, it's not like it's hurting anyone to do this
     
  13. Resistance88

    Resistance88 Zealot (571) Apr 9, 2015 California
    Trader

    it can also be said that it isn't hurting anyone to NOT change it.
     
  14. elNopalero

    elNopalero Poo-Bah (4,710) Oct 14, 2009 California
    Society Trader

    “Globalist”? Not sure where we’re going with this one…
     
    MacMalt and Resistance88 like this.
  15. RaulMondesi

    RaulMondesi Poo-Bah (4,475) Dec 11, 2006 California
    Society Trader

    From what I see during a brief search, Stone has also dropped the word “Russian” from their newly returned Imperial Stout.
     
  16. BigIronH

    BigIronH Poo-Bah (1,797) Oct 31, 2019 Michigan
    Society Trader

    I agree for the most part here Kyle. The only thing I would say is that “Russian” imperial stout is a centuries old term that probably holds significant meaning to at least some Russians.

    I don’t necessarily see why the actions of one person or the government that person has created is cause to strip an entire nation of people of its heritage.

    At the end of the day, I feel like Americans are still truly in the dark with regards to this conflict and the media has done a lot of leg work to ensure what side of the coin the collective American head space is going to land on; but that is here nor there.

    Point being, I don’t think anyone with a vested interest in the long line of Russian Imperial Stout history, especially those without an interest in the Ukraine conflict, is appreciative of American businesses stripping them of that heritage.
    https://www.birrificiootus.com/en/c...ian-imperial-stout-between-history-and-legend
    Cheers my friend.
     
  17. dcotom

    dcotom Poo-Bah (3,037) Aug 4, 2014 Iowa
    Society Trader

    Not around here, it ain't.
     
  18. Shanex

    Shanex Poo-Bah (1,842) Dec 10, 2015 France
    Society Trader

    It was never “Putin Imperial Stout” so I am a bit taken aback about this.
     
  19. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (2,530) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
    Society Trader

    Well, lots of great Russians over the centuries, including many who contributed to the US as immigrants (from Emma Goldman to Irving Berlin, et. al.).

    "Imperials"
    on the other hand? I'd rather see brewers drop that term, given the generally negative historical impact of most empires and emperors.

    Well, some of those late-50s/early-60s Chrysler Imperials were pretty damn cool (“Tearin’ Up the Highway Like a Big Ol’ Dinosaur” as Springsteen sang about the brand's better known competitor) and I've got no problem with the guys who backed up Little Anthony.
     
  20. beerjerk666

    beerjerk666 Poo-Bah (3,308) Aug 22, 2010 Florida
    Society Trader

    It does seem a bit...silly.

    I can understand the removal, as it has been stated already, capitalism and all. Because in this current culture of constantly finding something that offends you and make a big freakin stink about it, it really comes as no surprise to me.

    It's not like Putin earns a percentage of all Russian Imp Stouts....or does he?:wink:
     
  21. beerjerk666

    beerjerk666 Poo-Bah (3,308) Aug 22, 2010 Florida
    Society Trader

    Someone will be triggered either way!
     
    Rug, BigIronH, MacMalt and 6 others like this.
  22. VABA

    VABA Poo-Bah (6,223) Aug 8, 2015 Virginia
    Society

    I wonder if Russian River Brewing Company will change their name…

    ps-I wonder if the state of California will also change the name of the Russian River in Sonoma…
     
  23. JBogan

    JBogan Savant (912) Jul 15, 2007 California
    Trader

    Maybe Rushin' River Brewing? :wink:

    One thing I noticed after this conflict began, and it's possible it was the case before the conflict began but I only noticed it after ... when I Google Russian River Brewing now it comes up with the name Russian River Brewing, but then it's followed with "Award Winning Beers in the Bay Area".

    I don't recall that last part being there before the war started when I Googled Russian River Brewing. Maybe it was added recently to denote that it's not a Russian brewery for the less informed folks out there? Again though, maybe it was there before but I just never noticed it until lately.
     
    Whyteboar, Rug, Peach63 and 9 others like this.
  24. MacMalt

    MacMalt Poo-Bah (5,711) Jan 28, 2015 New Jersey
    Society Trader

    Why not? It seems Cancel Culture has affected just about everything else in society. And why should it matter that this style of stout was developed in England. By the same logic if India and Pakistan ever go to war, then we'll all be drinking "Imperial Pale Ale" or "International Pale Ale" or maybe "South Asian Pale Ale."

    A brewery I frequent changed the description of its very good RIS to "Ukrainian Imperial Stout." I stopped buying it and told them I only drink beer of a BA recognized style. Maybe that's the next step.
     
  25. micada

    micada Meyvn (1,382) Jul 13, 2015 New York
    Society Trader

    This.
     
  26. BigIronH

    BigIronH Poo-Bah (1,797) Oct 31, 2019 Michigan
    Society Trader

    I for one refuse to support Ukrainians until they acknowledge the BLM movement and sport some sort of badging indicating they do so. Boycott Ukrainian stouts!
     
  27. micada

    micada Meyvn (1,382) Jul 13, 2015 New York
    Society Trader

    Did anyone ask the beer if it identifies as a stout, and if so, does it or does it not identify as Russian? Is it hate speech if one accidentally deadnames it? Too soon? Just playing. I’ll expect this to get deleted…:grimacing:
     
  28. o29

    o29 Devotee (443) Sep 29, 2020 Texas
    Society Trader

    I do think this is a little silly, but I also think the visceral reactions are a bit silly as well.

    Todd's assessment that this is being almost entirely done from a marketing/brand association perspective I think is accurate, so it's not like (most of) these breweries are doing this because the owners are attempting to "virtue signal" that they stand with Ukraine -- they're just removing the word "Russian" from the label because the Marketing department, at this time due to the current average sentiment about Russia, felt that the beer would sell better without that word on the label. Nothing more, nothing less.

    Let's remember that we BA users who get up in arms about proper style designations are the minority of beer consumers. Labels are not always designed with the beer nerd in mind, but instead are typically trying to maximize appeal.
     
  29. VABA

    VABA Poo-Bah (6,223) Aug 8, 2015 Virginia
    Society

    I like your name!

    Unfortunately, it would not work for them. I have been to Santa Rosa, and ran down by the river, nothing saintly nor rosy about it, and the so called “Russian river” is more like a dripping run… just saying.
     
  30. AccipiterofBeer

    AccipiterofBeer Zealot (515) Nov 28, 2016 New York

    Agreed! Probably my favorite style of beer, especially entering the winter months.
     
  31. VABA

    VABA Poo-Bah (6,223) Aug 8, 2015 Virginia
    Society

    Exactly, this is basically why it was named that in the first place. The British wanted to increase revenue, so the named it after some Czar, little did they know he hated beer beer, but the alcohol content was high, so the Russian people taking a break from Vodka soon embraced the new style, meanwhile Nicolas Gogol in Dead Souls no less, argued that the name should be changed to Dnieper Stout, for the river in Euro-Asia and not for the heathen one in Cali…
     
  32. beergoot

    beergoot Poo-Bah (8,997) Oct 11, 2010 Colorado
    Society Trader

    ...a moot point since Hair of The Dog has essentially stopped production, but would they change the name now...???...:

    [​IMG]

    ...while never a liker of V. Putin, HoTD Putin was a very good RIS...and I'd still drink it (actually have one bottle left, I believe)...personally, I see no reason to remove the word 'Russian' from the description of a classic beer style, just like I see no reason for North Coast Brewing to stop selling its Rasputin line of beers just because it is named after another Russian ogre...

    ...
     
  33. MistaRyte

    MistaRyte Defender (698) Jan 14, 2008 Virginia
    Trader

    Went to the grocery store, hit the salad dressing aisle, saw the Russian salad dressing... immediately wanted to speak to the manager.
     
  34. champ103

    champ103 Poo-Bah (5,577) Sep 3, 2007 Texas
    Society

    Rug, budsNpils, MacMalt and 6 others like this.
  35. Amendm

    Amendm Meyvn (1,108) Jun 7, 2018 Rhode Island
    Society

    Once this bottle is used I'm switching to Creamy French.
    [​IMG]
     
  36. AccipiterofBeer

    AccipiterofBeer Zealot (515) Nov 28, 2016 New York

    i'm more of a fan of Italian or balsamic vinaigrette myself
     
  37. Todd

    Todd Founder (6,696) Aug 23, 1996 California
    Staff Moderator Fest Crew Society Trader

    How dare you. It was renamed “Creamy Freedom” in 2003.
     
  38. SILVER

    SILVER Initiate (197) Jan 3, 2007 Florida

    And all the people who get offended by pancake syrup?
    So none of this surprises me.
     
  39. BigIronH

    BigIronH Poo-Bah (1,797) Oct 31, 2019 Michigan
    Society Trader

    I give it 6 weeks and your dressing tastes probably change once more; [​IMG]
     
  40. deanzaZZR

    deanzaZZR Aspirant (233) Jan 8, 2015 California

    I wondered if a local Russian School of Mathematics would survive. I drove by the other week in the late afternoon. I saw tons of kids entering and leaving. Mathematics ability recognizes no borders.