Never a 5

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by Huffaroma, Mar 26, 2013.

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  1. StArnoldFan

    StArnoldFan Zealot (585) Dec 28, 2012 Texas
    Beer Trader

    I try to review beers on where they fit for the style, then to my liking. Iv seen someone on a forum say they hate IPA and went to check out thier reviews to find he had some top notched ones at either a 2 or 3. I hate seeing bullshit like that. So that being said, my favorite imperial stout is Ten Fidy and I gave it a 5, my favorite DIPA is Firestone Walker Double Jack and I gave it a 5, and my favorite flavored stout is Pumpkinator by Saint Arnold so I gave it a 5. I find it hard to believe there are people on here that have had 500+ beers and not 1 is worthy enough to be a 5.
    JuicesFlowing likes this.
  2. 1up

    1up Initiate (0) Mar 5, 2013 District of Columbia

    But I see you've ranked some beers as having PERFECT appearance, smell, taste, and/or mouthfeel! Interesting that you've seen some beers attain perfect in specific categories but never the whole package (except for BA Pt5)?

    I wish there was a way to standardize people's ratings, like a guide? Maybe one exists, haven't checked. Just throwing spaghetti.
    StArnoldFan likes this.
  3. Reneejane

    Reneejane Devotee (440) Jan 15, 2004 Illinois

    There was a fun thread over on the homebrewing forum about BJCP judges, and what's a good score. Pretty much it was agreed 45 (which is the top score) is unattainable. They said that even the top commercial breweries were rarely getting 38's. 45 is like the best ever, world class blew your mind, phenomenal. A good beer, fits the style, and is tasty, etc. is going to be like 31-35.

    here's the thread:
  4. sergeantstogie

    sergeantstogie Aspirant (202) Nov 16, 2010 Washington

    I'm a horrible reviewer. I give out 5's like candy. Once I like a beer, it's almost a 5. Thanks for pointing this out, I think I may never review again. Sho do like drinkin'em though!
    hornsup, KWMiles and 1up like this.
  5. Gotti311

    Gotti311 Crusader (769) Mar 22, 2009 Wisconsin
    Beer Trader

    I think people are overly influenced by the "beer advocate" standards. I think of it as a bell curve, so 1-2% of the beers I have drank should be perfect 5's. Everyone gets too bogged down in looking for criticisms. Lighten up and enjoy it.

    And why in the world do people rate appearance? I dont care if the beer is bright green, if it smells and tastes great, why would appearance matter. I would trust the rating of a blind person just as much as my ranking.

    My 5/5 beers are Cuvee des Jacobins Rogue, Bourbon Barrel Plead the 5th, and BCBS to name a few.
    mp19, Cvescalante and 1up like this.
  6. Reneejane

    Reneejane Devotee (440) Jan 15, 2004 Illinois

    well, it should look like it's supposed to, a brown ale should be brown, a stout should be black, a pilsener should be clear and straw colored. You've completely missed the style if it is the wrong color and clarity. (my perspective is as someone who homebrews and enters competitions.)
  7. PatriotsRule

    PatriotsRule Aspirant (257) Sep 25, 2012 Massachusetts

    Hoponius Union and Kiwi Rising are my 5s
  8. Reneejane

    Reneejane Devotee (440) Jan 15, 2004 Illinois

    I've never rated a beer a 5, myhighest though (just checked, I've reviewed 90+ beers) was Diamond Bear's Paradise Porter. It was so long ago, and it's not distributed that I haven't had it since, but.. now *pout* i want to try it again, and see if I agree with myself.
  9. Reagan1984

    Reagan1984 Poo-Bah (2,135) May 15, 2008 Massachusetts
    Beer Trader

  10. Gotti311

    Gotti311 Crusader (769) Mar 22, 2009 Wisconsin
    Beer Trader

    I homebrew also, but I am not to the point where I enter competitions. Part of my problem is that I think me and my buddy do a pretty good job constructing recipes and I usually dont like parting with any of my hard work :slight_smile:

    People are too influenced by color. A great example is Bells This One Goes to 11. Yeah it looks red in color and is 11% ABV, must be an imperial red...Except it has the hoppiness and taste of a Double IPA. One of the biggest problems is brewers are pressing the boundaries of brewing styles, which diminishes from categorizing beers. For me, it doesnt really matter, if it is good it is good.

    It all comes down to my original point: I would trust a blind person's opinion on my beer as much if not more than someone that has complete vision.
    mp19 and Cvescalante like this.
  11. Reneejane

    Reneejane Devotee (440) Jan 15, 2004 Illinois

    it's absolutely FINE to brew not to style, there is an "other" category in BJCP competitions, too. And, there's nothing wrong with creating new styles (black IPA?) nothing wrong with Imperial Red, either, G'night is an Imp Red, and it's on that style border, too. If you ever do want to start entering competitions, I have learned it's best NOT to brew at the bottom of one style so that it could be, maybe be, Oh, gee, those never do well. I had a British IPA/ESB crossover once, fine beer, fine fine beer, but it was a neither/nor, those don't do well,a nd it doesn't do yourself any good to enter that in a competition, enjoy it for what it is.
  12. Reneejane

    Reneejane Devotee (440) Jan 15, 2004 Illinois

    I will add, that in some styles color and clarity are of uptmost importance, such as a pilsener, and less importance in other styles, like IPA's, in which clarity may be there or might not, either is fine. If you're going to put out a hazy pilsener you should expect as a brewery or a homebrewer to get downgraded on style for haze, alone.
    herrburgess likes this.
  13. alex_hart

    alex_hart Disciple (355) Feb 28, 2013 Oklahoma

    i disagree..if i have rated a beer above a 4 then obviously i thoroughly enjoyed it. If i give it above a 4.5 then there is no way in hell I am going to forget to buy this again. If it gets above a 4.75 I know that it is one of the best beers I have ever tried. I wouldnt give a beer a 5 just because it is my "favorite" at that point in time. If all of a sudden I try 5 beers in a row that I considered my "favorite" each time in one specific style, then I believe all of those 5 beers, with a set of 5s across the board, would have diluted scores.
  14. Ivegotmule

    Ivegotmule Initiate (0) Nov 7, 2012 North Carolina

    KBS, Ruination 10, and Stone 15 year are my only 5's. there are many other 4.75 ish beers but those 3 I wouldn't change a thing.
  15. Ivegotmule

    Ivegotmule Initiate (0) Nov 7, 2012 North Carolina

    Oh, and Stingo :wink:
  16. dsal89

    dsal89 Disciple (331) Jul 6, 2008 Indiana
    Beer Trader

    I didnt read a lot of the posts (if any) but I just wanted to say I always laugh when I see all fives across the board except for the lone 4.5 for appearance. My guess would be that they didnt want to give a certain beer all fives so they knock the appearance down.

    ...or in some cases the beer itself could just look bad
    Gotti311 likes this.
  17. BB1313

    BB1313 Poo-Bah (2,343) Jul 16, 2009 Ohio

    I've never reviewed every beer I've ever tried. Rarely review beers I have on-tap, I don't know why. Dreadnaught is the only beer I gave a perfect score to. Big whoop, what you wanna fight about it?:wink: I don't think I'd change a thing about it, except for the price/format.
  18. papaholmz

    papaholmz Initiate (0) Nov 7, 2012 South Carolina
    Beer Trader

    I haven't rated any beers on here yet, but I do write a quick review on the untapped app everytime I try something new (I feel less pretentious that way). So far the only beer I've rated 5 and would rate 5's across the board on here is Bell's Black Note. I had it in the bottle and it got a 4, then I had it on tap, and it was amazing, easily a 5; I could drown in that stuff and be perfectly content.
  19. YogiBeer

    YogiBeer Initiate (0) May 10, 2012 Illinois

    Fortunately (or unfortunately, depending on how you look at it), I don't think he ever has to worry about that.
  20. Gotti311

    Gotti311 Crusader (769) Mar 22, 2009 Wisconsin
    Beer Trader

    you think haze in a pilsener really matters if it doesnt change the taste? I think these BJCP people should re-prioritize.
  21. Gotti311

    Gotti311 Crusader (769) Mar 22, 2009 Wisconsin
    Beer Trader

    Just because someone brews the perfect beer or tastes the perfect beer, it is only one beer in one style. So if someone brewed the perfect DIPA, you can't drink DIPA's every day for the rest of your life. Most of my perfect beers are hard to get or seasonal. I have had a perfect BA stout, but I wouldnt go near it in summer if I had 5 cases sitting in my basement.
  22. philbe311

    philbe311 Poo-Bah (1,966) Jan 21, 2008 Pennsylvania

    1,070 reviews... Only one perfect 5 - Westy 12... That only came in the past year... At times I never though one existed... The next closest was a 4.83 (Voodoo Black Magick)...
  23. CasanovaCummins

    CasanovaCummins Initiate (0) Jan 10, 2012 Nevada
    Beer Trader

    Guys, this isn't the Olympics and you aren't Olympic judges.
    'Cuz if it were the Olympics, Coors would be bribing DFH who would kick back to InBev and so on and so forth...
    Relax a bit, people.
    fujindemon74 and HeyJim like this.
  24. HeyJim

    HeyJim Initiate (0) Sep 22, 2012 Pennsylvania

    I wish my "had" scores weren't counted in BA rating. I mainly use the had function. I just don't feel like writing reviews.

    I mostly use it so people know what I've had, and how I generally feel about the beer, and to track what I've had and how I felt about it. If I give it a 5, it's not because I think it's the end all, be all of beer, it's because I really love it and purchase it regularly. It also gives potential trade partners a gauge of what I like.

    If I give it a 1, it's because I had it and hated it. That's not to say it's a bad beer, because I've given 1s to stuff like BCBS and Ducheese De Bourgogne. I don't like the bourbon flavor of BCBS and the ketchup flavor of Ducheese. I never want to drink these beers again, so to me, that's a 1. *puts up flame shield*

    Admittedly, when I first started, I made it rain 5s, so I've had to go back and adjust some things. Eliot Ness was amazing when I first had it but now I hardly think it's a 5 anymore.

    All said, I just don't take the ratings as seriously as a lot of people here do, I suppose.
  25. SadMachine

    SadMachine Meyvn (1,250) Mar 14, 2011 New Jersey
    Beer Trader

    I am of the opinion that a 5s across the board can, and should happen, but with minimal frequency. When it comes down to it we all have our own palates, and even those change from day to day. If you encounter a beer that YOU genuinely wouldn't want to change any way because in that moment it is perfect to you, then go ahead and give it 5s across the board! That doesn't mean that nothing better or different but just as good can be achieved, but it means that for what that beer is/is trying to be, it is perfect. My only 2 perfect scores so far have been Enjoy By and KBS. I have had many, but not all of the top rated DIPAs, and to me Enjoy By just does everything right every single time I drink it! Do I still absolutely LOVE Heady and Sucks? Absolutely! But would I want Enjoy By to be more like them or vice versa? Not really because I enjoy the uniqueness of them all and the different things they do for me. Same goes for KBS, though I really should reserve my full judgement until I've had more (I was only fortunate enough to get 1 ~6oz pour). Perhaps when I've had more of it I will slightly alter my judgement, but at that time in that place it was everything I could have asked for in a BA Stout. I wouldn't want it to change to be more like something else, so I gave it a perfect score.

    In the end everyone is going to have different opinions on this and different opinions on a given beer, but it is my feeling that in a given moment perfection is achievable in a beer. You may enjoy something more in the future, but you don't know that for sure, so why "leave room" in your scoring for improvement?!
    Premo88 likes this.
  26. endovelico

    endovelico Initiate (0) Jul 25, 2008 Portugal

    I've never given a 5 but i don't abide by the 'only if it's perfect' rule. That would be like never given students A's because they don't know everything about a given subject.
  27. papat444

    papat444 Initiate (0) Dec 28, 2006 Quebec (Canada)
    Beer Trader

    Since the "Hads" count, i've seen a lot more 5's past by than in previous years.
  28. Hessian257

    Hessian257 Devotee (482) Mar 22, 2011 New Jersey
    Beer Trader

    I've given HT, 2011 PvW Darklord, and KH all 5s, they all stood out to me as being something special. Amazing beers in my mind.
  29. ChrisMon02

    ChrisMon02 Crusader (724) May 2, 2010 Ohio

    I couldn't wait so I took a half day and am having a glass as I type and am waiting for a Buffalo chicken my priorities strait!
    HopCraverDave likes this.
  30. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,005) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    Because you can only get Schlenkerla Maerzen or Augustiner Helles from the oak barrel by traveling 5000+ miles. Still there's always Orval and, if you're a bit more lucky since it's no longer brewed, Rodenbach Alexander.
    TongoRad likes this.
  31. MetalMountainMastiff

    MetalMountainMastiff Initiate (0) Oct 1, 2012 California
    Beer Trader

    I think Parabola might be a 5 for me. I haven't had it in awhile though. I'm excited to review it once I can get more in a few weeks.
  32. TongoRad

    TongoRad Poo-Bah (1,816) Jun 3, 2004 New Jersey
    Supporter Beer Trader

    I actually have Orval at 4.97 (only 4.5 on appearance- hey, I'm calling 'em how I see 'em)- so sometimes the numbers don't tell the whole story. I like the way the scores are done now, though- anything over a 4.5 gets a score of 100. It's all top tier stuff, anyways- no need to geek out about the numbers too much.
    herrburgess likes this.
  33. herrburgess

    herrburgess Meyvn (1,005) Nov 4, 2009 South Carolina
    Industry Beer Trader

    Agree. Long ago I adopted Michael Jackson's system as my personal "rating" method: *typical of its style and country, **above average, ***worth seeking out, ****world class. Has yet to let me down over my (now, many) years of beer travels.
    TongoRad likes this.
  34. ShogoKawada

    ShogoKawada Meyvn (1,247) May 31, 2009 Pennsylvania

    OG citra was an easy 5, as was RR PtY.

    Fantome Classic could be a 5 on a good day. That beer is breathtaking.
  35. davey101

    davey101 Meyvn (1,080) Apr 14, 2009 Connecticut
    Beer Trader

    Yea, I do give 5's to some categories in order to better rank beers over the same style. This was especially an issue when we didn't have .25 increments. Otherwise Id have dozens of word class IPA's locked in at 4.5. I've yet to have a beer achieve all 5's and there is a lot of manipulation that goes on in order to show which beer you prefer compared to others. The rating system is not perfect, especially when you start to get over 100+ beers.
  36. cbeer88

    cbeer88 Crusader (719) Sep 5, 2007 Massachusetts

    I've given out one perfect 5 in a review - Aecht Schlenkerla Urbock. It's IMO the best rauchbier in the world, and it is literally flawless. I wouldn't change a single thing about it.

    I've checked off 5 in a lot of hads, and I would probably give some of those a 5 in a formal review as well. But a 5 on a review basically says you don't think the beer could possibly be any better.
    1up likes this.
  37. beertunes

    beertunes Poo-Bah (4,594) Sep 24, 2007 Washington
    Beer Trader

    Over 1800 reviews/hads and I've 2 all-5's: North Coast Old Stock Ale and Unibroue La Fin du Monde. Perfect doesn't necessarily mean flawless, just that that specific beer couldn't get any better. For example, Tripels are probably my favorite style, and Chimay White is my favorite example of the style. But, I think LFdM is better example of the style.
    1up likes this.
  38. Philly82785

    Philly82785 Aspirant (235) Dec 17, 2008 Minnesota

    I've only had one beer that I reviewed and thought was exceptional and that was Cuvée Van De Keizer Blauw (Blue)
  39. Cvescalante

    Cvescalante Initiate (0) Dec 24, 2012 Texas
    Beer Trader

    I've given 5's a few times. If it's incredible, I'll give it credit. I gave abyss, heady, kbs, victory at sea, and fou fonne all 5's.. It's all personal opinion. I'd say all of those beers are just top notch and deserving of 5's. There's a few that I've reviewed that I've given too much credit, but if I absolutely love a certain beer, I'm gonna give it a five, so I can remember how much I enjoyed it.
  40. DaveAnderson

    DaveAnderson Devotee (479) Jan 11, 2011 Minnesota

    I suggested it to the Bros. when they were making all of those recent site changes. Consider my review of Peeper Ale. Anyone can see that the rAvg is 4.15, so my 4.08 clocks in at -1.7%. But what is not obvious is that my average rDev is -5.63% for reviews and -1.01% for hads. In that context, Peeper Ale got an above-average review from me.
    Premo88 and 1up like this.
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