Possible solution to bottle limits on special releases

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by Barrelsnbeer, Mar 10, 2013.

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  1. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    So after ringing up a bottle of Enjoy By at a price that seemed a little to far out i did some investigation as to why it was higher than i thought it should be. Turns out a hoarder came through and basically picked the whole case off the shelf by paying other people to purchase the beer for him (subverting the bottle limit) so he could have all of it.

    this in turn caused a price increase to discourage multiple bottle purchases and really only get it to the people that really wanted it.

    now i dont blame the guy but he just essentially screwed the rest of the customers from being able to buy a normal priced bottle

    my idea, and id love to hear feed back on this, is a reverse tier pricing structure to reward customers with the best price for purchasing smaller amounts. this way if some one truely wants the whole case they could purchase it if they wish but would endup paying around double the cost for doing so.

    example 1 bottle 3.99/bottle, 2-4 bottles makes 5.99/bottle, 4-8 bottles 7.99/bottle so forth and so on with different structures based on allocation (10 cases v 1 case)

    thoughts and ideas? anyone currently using this practice or come across it previously?
    BDEE and Ispeakforthetrees like this.
  2. Jake1605

    Jake1605 Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2009 Missouri

    I would rather pay a much higher price than to have to hit 10 stores for a few bottles. I can justify bar price, plus I like my house better anyways lol.
  3. WankelEngine

    WankelEngine Initiate (0) Mar 28, 2011 Illinois

    Interesting idea, but that wouldn't change much about the situation you described where one guy has several other people buy bottles for him. If anything, that will just encourage those with a lot of money to hoard more beer by making them think they deserve it because they paid more for it.

    In the end, I can't imagine this would do any more to discourage hoarding than the standard bottle limit.

    Also, that may violate some price discrimination laws and/or piss off distributors/producers, depending on your location.
    BDEE and hamsterhero515 like this.
  4. whendeathsleeps

    whendeathsleeps Initiate (0) Nov 5, 2011 Indiana

  5. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    this i understand but i hate telling people they cant get what they want, i dont mind telling people they can have whatever but theres a price for hoarding
  6. fritts211

    fritts211 Aspirant (210) Feb 19, 2011 Tennessee
    Beer Trader

    Never heard of it, don't like it. People could just come back during different shifts and buy a bottle at a time, or pay people to buy single bottles of a time to offset the cost of the price increase. It's not going to discourage the people that pick stuff like this up and re-sell or hoard anyway.

    More than likely all that would happen would be customers that want to trade and share with friends get the short end of the stick, since they wouldn't be trying to mastermind how best to rip the store off. Good guys would suffer, bad guys would win IMO.

    Oh, and I'd smack someone in the mouth if they jacked up the price on me because someone else came in and cleared them out. Supply and demand, stores can charge what they want, free economy, blah blah blah, but it would still piss me off. Set a price and stick to it.
    priwen likes this.
  7. WankelEngine

    WankelEngine Initiate (0) Mar 28, 2011 Illinois

    Doesn't that just further encourage hoarding? I was under the impression that most BAs were at least mildly opposed to hoarding beers. (Unless they happen to be the ones buying them!) I know I would be pissed if I went to the shop for a limited beer and found out that the guy before me bought the whole case, but it's ok because he paid more.
  8. kzoobrew

    kzoobrew Meyvn (1,167) May 8, 2006 Michigan

    Fix the beer geek and not the release. Until people realize they don't need every beer and don't need to pick up multiples only to profit off of it, releases will always be a mess.

    I first said it jokingly but there is a fair amount of truth to the statement. Hoarders and truck chasers actually benefit the beer community. They remove unneeded distractions and allow us to focus on the great beer that is readily available to us. A simple change in perspective would change everything when it came to releases.
    jimmy666, sullenbee, jgluck and 19 others like this.
  9. Ispeakforthetrees

    Ispeakforthetrees Aspirant (232) Apr 2, 2012 Colorado

    Although it totally defies economics I love the thought process.
    Dannywhitewash likes this.
  10. aasher

    aasher Poo-Bah (2,572) Jan 27, 2010 Indiana
    Beer Trader

    Sounds like that STORE needs to check itself before it wrecks itself. How dare they blame demand for a price hike!
    kojevergas likes this.
  11. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    demand plus limited supply equals higher prices. had hoarder not come in and try to buy every bottle and use subversive tactics to do so then the price would have stayed extraordinarily reasonable

    plus that price hike is what im trying to fight with this method, if you want to take it all then your imposing the higher prices on yourself
  12. beerborn

    beerborn Initiate (0) Jan 22, 2012 Georgia

    this is what I was thinking
    EyePeeAyBryan and creepinjeeper like this.
  13. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    It does in a way. With this system he could have bought all he wanted. He just would have had to pay more eliminating his need to go find people to help him out. It may not completely stop this situation but it would sure dampen it
  14. WankelEngine

    WankelEngine Initiate (0) Mar 28, 2011 Illinois

    I don't think that's the case. This in no way makes it more difficult for someone to hoard beer. Either that man could do what he was already doing and have people grab them for him for the regular price, or now he could just pay more outright. It only makes it easier to hoard, not more difficult. Unless you're just worried about him breaking the rules?? But that's hardly the point
    TongoRad likes this.
  15. Hanzo

    Hanzo Initiate (0) Feb 27, 2012 Virginia

    If a guy is motivated enough to pay a bunch of people to go in and buy a limited beer he's not going to be subverted by any anti-hoarding policy. I say let it go.
  16. PatriotsRule

    PatriotsRule Aspirant (257) Sep 25, 2012 Massachusetts

    If prices were lower in the opposite of bulk, I'd call up all my boys and stock up as a crew. Maybe even go the extra mile to have us all reserve the maximum amount at a reasonable price if the beer is REALLY worth it.
  17. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    The idea isnt to stop people from hoarding just that doing so has a price associated with it that the person who really wants that whole case can pay as opposed to the regular customer who would have just grabbed the one bottle still gets the appropriate price my issue lies in people paying way more than they need for a product. I used the word "possible" in the title because i knew the system wasnt perfect and i was looking for/greatly appreciate all feedback.
  18. kzoobrew

    kzoobrew Meyvn (1,167) May 8, 2006 Michigan

    The idea has merit and is one of the more creative solutions I have heard as on late. With that said I would expect a substantial amount of negative feedback. Many people would claim "price gouging", they would ignore what you are trying to accomplish and focus on you increasing the price to make more money. Others who miss out are going to find reasons to complain simply because they missed out.

    The idea may work to some extent but is it worth the whining and complaining that would come with it?
    FriarTuckInLuck and Barrelsnbeer like this.
  19. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    if you have 12-24 friends willing to go out of their way to go to a store and buy beer for you with out wanting said beer then rad! you've just brought 12-24 customers to me that may or may not have been in before, and since they are buying you beer (which they wont be drinking since your trying to score the special release case for your self) they may purchase something else on my shelf for themselves. its a win for everyone!

    thank you for actually seeing the point in this, i have no issue with the hoarding, this in turn stops the truck chasing and need to call a bunch of people to help you out, you can have as much as you want with for a price, stick to the bottle limit though and you'll pay the same price as everyone else and no one gets gouged. each person gets to personally feel the effects of their greed on their own wallet instead of spreading it to every single consumer there after in the ensuing prices increases that will inevitably exist the next time it comes around
  20. JmH

    JmH Initiate (0) Jun 6, 2012 Illinois

    lol at hoarding Enjoy By -- joke's on the guy who cleaned out your shop
  21. MostlyNorwegian

    MostlyNorwegian Zealot (519) Feb 5, 2013 Illinois

    To go dick move on people. Membership has its privileges. i.e. get one of those card things that is trackable for purchases. that's the first wave for special releases and set up for a per customer limit. second wave is for the general public. i.e. membership is useless and still up to a per customer limit.
    Barrelsnbeer likes this.
  22. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    more so on the people that came in after him and now have to pay more than they should have <- which is essentially what i wanted to stop
    Beerontwowheels likes this.
  23. BeastLU

    BeastLU Disciple (326) Dec 20, 2012 Virginia

    I believe this would be illegal in some states. As for alcohol, If you offer certain prices to some customers you have to offer them to everyone regardless of the about I think.
  24. xnicknj

    xnicknj Initiate (0) May 25, 2009 Pennsylvania

    Interesting idea, but something that does work is exactly what your store did.

    People will go crazy when they see jacked up prices, creating ridiculous "proice grouging!! rabble!" threads all over the place and writing two sentence, one-star Yelp reviews, but higher pricing that reflects demand usually keeps limited beers around longer.

    I don't want to pay more for beer, but there are plenty of examples of limited beers that linger on shelves because of their higher tags, thus making it easier to find if you're willing to pay more. See: Eclipse, Old Stock Cellar Reserve, Rasputin Anny beers, BA Avery, BA Arcadia, BA Stillwater, etc.

    Obviously this isn't effective with everything, and some beers will still fly off the shelves at $50+ each (See: Fou Foune, Stille Nacht Reserva '10, Rare). There's definitely a line between a moderate markup to prevent people from buying a whole case and putting out $100 bottles of Iris, but I'd honestly rather pay a little more than waste 4 hours driving around trying to find something. If I can't afford it, then I just won't buy it.
  25. SomethingClever

    SomethingClever Poo-Bah (2,358) Feb 22, 2013 Ohio

    I don't understand the definition of hoarding on here... is the guy still a dick if he buys it to drink over the next few days or is hoarding just the act of buying it all? As it stands it sounds like you are assuming he is just going to sit on it in a beer cellar maybe he is going to get blind drunk on it instead.
    fujindemon74 likes this.
  26. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    essentially you would be offering the same price to everyone. its exactly the same as bulk discounts but in reverse. if i go to the grocery store and pay for one candy bar i get it for 1.69 but i get two for .99/ each hell they do the same with cigarettes so im sure it would be legal.

    bulk discounts work to move slow product, why not bulk price increases to distribute a product to more people since the product is going to move regardless. the aim is not to make more profit but to put product in more different consumers hands.

    id love to hear from a brewery owner about how they would feel about this
  27. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    hes a dick because he subverted the bottle limit to keep for him self. doing so, in turn, raised the prices for the next customers who were able to get what was left. i dont care if he butt chugs the brew or builds a massive shrine to the full bottles. im just pissed that it jacked the price up for everyone else and severely limited the amount of people in the area that will get to enjoy the beer.

    he paid a lower price jacked most of the supply now everyone else gets screwed, the ones who do get it pay more and ones who cant get it miss out.
  28. ShogoKawada

    ShogoKawada Meyvn (1,247) May 31, 2009 Pennsylvania

    PROTIP: find a favorite beer that isn't a limited release.
  29. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    not my favorite beer, im just trying to put "hard to get" beer in more peoples hands and stop those that want it all for themselves from screwing everyone on the price the next go round.

    this is pure "beer advocacy" economics
  30. aasher

    aasher Poo-Bah (2,572) Jan 27, 2010 Indiana
    Beer Trader

    The beer itself isn't rare and comes out every few months. He isn't a hoarder.

    The blame should go to the store for increasing prices.
  31. Thickfreakness

    Thickfreakness Initiate (0) Oct 2, 2010 New York

    You're an idiot! No offence. That is such a dumb idea, that I got stupider reading it. Pay more for buying more? How anti-American is that? Sorry you were lazy and smoked pot all day and couldn't make it to the release party of beer X... we saved some for you 'Cause you are so AWESOME!!! Get the fuck up off of your Mom's couch, and go get your own beer DICKHEAD! Just FYI... You are NOT entitled to enjoy, drink, or cellar said beer. If I work harder than you, and make more $ than you... I can buy what I want... even if it means all of something that you want. Sorry... That is the American way!
    youbrewidrink and Benny3000 like this.
  32. beergurujr

    beergurujr Aspirant (230) Oct 27, 2003 Illinois

    Just enjoy the beer you CAN get. Don't worry about some D-bag with Mitt Romney-type money who buys everything and has people on the payroll to buy up all the limiteds. Wine drinkers gave up on this "entitlement" shit years ago. It's about time we in the beer community did the same. There's always going to be those with the connections, resources and $$$$ to get the beer THEY want. Don't play the 1% vs 99% game. Plenty of great beer readily available all the time. Live life, not resentment. Peace out
    Zimbo, TMoney2591 and c64person like this.
  33. GennyCreamAle

    GennyCreamAle Initiate (0) Feb 25, 2009 New York

    I agree, but can't the same be said for the individuals purposefully circumventing bottle limits and brewery release ticketing?
    beergurujr likes this.
  34. mattfitz

    mattfitz Initiate (0) Jan 26, 2009 Connecticut

    I thought demand increased price due to the increase in production driving up costs. This sounds like a store - who is not a producer of anything - increasing price because he thinks people will pay it. Shady, but it is his prerogative.
    Jslay013, dan027 and priwen like this.
  35. 2beerdogs

    2beerdogs Poo-Bah (1,883) Jan 31, 2005 California
    Supporter Subscriber Beer Trader

    Revolutionary, thought-provoking, but...I really think it will never happen.
  36. BlackDragon

    BlackDragon Initiate (0) Feb 16, 2013 Michigan

    Instead of complaining about people who break the rules and stores that raise prices how about complaining to the breweries that don't make enough of something good if a beer is always in short supply the brewery needs to do 1 of 2 things either raise prices and make more money which will bring down demand or make alot more product and sell it for the same price either way the brewery makes more money and more people get the beer they want I swear so many brewers must have failed business 101
  37. Jake1605

    Jake1605 Initiate (0) Nov 24, 2009 Missouri

    I remember a few years back when I was at a local beer store that keeps special limited releases behind the counter but in view. I drove there for that particular beer, and the couple in front on me bought he last bottle because it looked neat & they've never had anything "covered in wax". I hope their Blue Moon sample pack & Leinenkugel's Berry Weiss tastes like poo after that Abyss.

    Limited releases should be kept in the back & priced accordingly. As much as I hate limits, I respect them & understand the purpose. I consider myself an active beer enthusiast, I have no problem driving around to several stores & paying the cost for cases. I do not resell beer. I will buy rare from an individual for an upcharge. If I want the beer, I'll get it but it gets hard at times, but it's worth it. I love aging beers I love & having them at home available to drink. I like to trade a few to get beer I can't get around here. I don't make a ton of money, i do ok, but beer is my only money spending hobby. Often I find myself thinking that if some of the limited releases were twice the cost I would be able to buy more. If you really want something bad, you will pay for it. Problem improved.
  38. Barrelsnbeer

    Barrelsnbeer Initiate (0) Oct 6, 2012 North Carolina
    Beer Trader

    Sir your rant here illustrates clearly the points im making. In this certain pricing structure because you work more and make more money you have the ability to purchase as much as you want. The extra your paying is the fee to release you from the bottle limits. This is in fact extremely american since those that work hard to make a bunch of money can now buy the store out you just have to pay the extra for being a complete dick head towards your fellow beer drinkers. Remember if you stuck to the bottle limit you'd pay just as much as every one else. The price increase is there to set the bottle limits. This seems to be a very weird place to get angry at some one who wants more people to drink great beer.

    P.s. saying no offense before attempting to offend some one doesnt work Mr. Bobby.
    With all due respect, go fuxk yourself :wink: <---- see how that didnt work
  39. TMoney2591

    TMoney2591 Poo-Bah (6,694) Apr 21, 2009 Illinois

    1) A store that raises prices on a product because it sees a bunch of people (un)expectedly more than willing to buy it in bulk is jut trying to maximize profits. I personally find this sleazy, but, hey, greed runs the world, so be it. But let's not call it anything more than that, like a method of behavior modification. It's just squeezing as many red cents out of people as possible.

    2) The argument that breweries should just brew more of the usually-limited, high-demand stuff is short-sighted at best. Shit, from their own mouths, Three Floyds could brew nothing but Gumballhead or Zombie Dust 'round the clock and still not be able to satisfy immediate demand, much less any potential increase therein. Moreover, this mentality reeks of, for lack of any better word at this particular moment, entitlement. "We like this stuff a lot, but there's not enough of it to sate our desires, so just make more, m'kay?" Deal with the fact that there isn't as much around as you'd prefer, 'cause, well, unless you're the fucking sun or the black hole at the center of the galaxy, the world don't revolve around you, mate, even if such ideas would seem to make nothing but economic sense.

    3) Though kzoo said it well enough above, it bears repeating: It's not for stores, distributors, or even breweries to change the behavior of beer geeks/nerds/idiots (whichever, given the circumstances). We all need to look at ourselves in the mirror and remind ourselves that this isn't liquid platinum, it's not going to raise us to the next step of human consciousness or evolution. Limited releases only have the power and value we ascribe to them as a group, so if we knock off the in-fighting, the excessive salivation, the need to have everything that could ever hit a market at any time, and following the allure of limitation. You enjoy beer? There's plenty out there. Take it from an avowed ticker: there's always other beers out there, with the same wavering quality as the limited shit. I have yet to set foot in a liquor store and not find something I haven't had yet, and I've had quite a few in my day. Knock off the "OMG, I FEKKIN' NEED THIS BOTTLEZ NOW!!1!" bullshit whenever something "rare" or "limited" or what-have-you comes a-knocking, and, even more, knock off the "Hey! I didn't get any (or as much as I wanted)! Unfair! Do something, somebody, to make sure I never feel this despair ever again!"

    Until we sort these issues out, we're gonna keep reliving the asininity of limits, hiding, price fluctuations, and ill will in this community of ours. Be the change, people...
  40. Premo88

    Premo88 Meyvn (1,445) Jun 6, 2010 Texas

    While I agree with all of what TMoney2591 says, Barrelsnbeer's original idea for the thread is quite genius. It really does in one simple plan solve the problem of special edition hoarders.

    I say we enact Barrelsnbeer's idea while doing what we can to adobt the behavior modification method TMoney rightly suggests. "Be the change" needs to be on a T-shirt. F-ing double genius ...
    Barrelsnbeer likes this.
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