Refunds for 2015 Regular BCBS and 2015 Prop

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by GatorLCA, Apr 13, 2016.

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  1. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (459) Jan 7, 2011 California
    Trader

    lol. by all means carry on then.:grinning:
     
  2. nyrblue2

    nyrblue2 Disciple (340) Jun 9, 2012 New York

    Cracked another one from this batch tonight and felt like I was playing russian roulette.

    Still tastes wonderful :-)
     
  3. PsilohsaiBiN

    PsilohsaiBiN Initiate (0) Aug 10, 2010 New York

     
  4. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (459) Jan 7, 2011 California
    Trader

    of course. & i said that'd be the case or end result too, but was just clarifying that it wasn't a result of In-Bev divesting in the program. which that was a big speculative topic back then too.
     
  5. surfcaster

    surfcaster Zealot (526) Apr 20, 2013 North Carolina
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    GI needs to hire you, methinks.

    Have enjoyed the conversation. The "truth" may be relegated to the likes of a Leonard Nimoy "In Search Of" episode (for those that remember that). Or perhaps it is well known but in this era of an inability to really keep anything truly secret, I would guess if it is really pinned down, it will come out through some channel.
     
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  6. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (459) Jan 7, 2011 California
    Trader

    thanks. i don't think anything will be kept a secret other than they probably knew there was a bigger problem sooner than they were willing to admit. i suspect like the program has been supersized, the options leading to the source of the issues are probably too vast to really be certain: "This is exactly what transpired & why". instead, i won't be surprised if we wind up with an educated guess designed to close the chapter/book and move forward.

    if it is as many suggested, a simple but specific bottle feed or segment of equipment, then no problem, it'll be solved for the next release. if it's something more widespread & a complete warehouse issue, we may possibly see other forthcoming clues such as a very steep drop in allocations or no release at all.
     
  7. PsilohsaiBiN

    PsilohsaiBiN Initiate (0) Aug 10, 2010 New York

    Yikes. Second hand pre '15 BCBS will go through the roof.
     
  8. zappoman

    zappoman Initiate (0) Apr 29, 2014 Illinois

    22OCT15 bottled at 10:00. Tart and gross... the only bottle I had that was good was the fresh one I drank
     
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  9. Tucquan

    Tucquan Poo-Bah (3,342) Oct 11, 2007 Pennsylvania
    Society Trader

    Having a 20OCT2015 right now. There's an 1818 next to the date. Does this indicate the bottling time of 18:18 CT?. Tastes pretty good with maybe a smidge of tartness. Not gross by any means; fortunately.
     
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  10. Tucquan

    Tucquan Poo-Bah (3,342) Oct 11, 2007 Pennsylvania
    Society Trader

    BTW, this bottle has been refrigerated since I got it in Nov 2015.
     
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  11. zappoman

    zappoman Initiate (0) Apr 29, 2014 Illinois

    Mine was not refrigerated until a few weeks ago when I put the rest of my reg BCBS in the fridge :slight_frown:
     
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  12. bbtkd

    bbtkd Poo-Bah (14,615) Sep 20, 2015 South Dakota
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    Wonder if they were able to make changes to the process for the next batch (November 2016) before it was to late to change anything this year? How long is BCBS aged?
     
  13. pagriley

    pagriley Meyvn (1,032) Oct 27, 2014 Illinois

    Highly unlikely unless the source of infection is at bottling. The next years BCBS is going into barrels all through the winter - it is aged for ~10 months on average I believe, so everything would have been produced and in the barrel house aging months ago.

    I might have this wrong, but my understanding is as soon as they have cleared out and bottled the current batch they start filling and stacking the barrels for the next year - they fill the barrel room back up as quickly as possible to maximize the time in the barrel.
     
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  14. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    They could indeed. They will probably start to pasteurize the entire batch as well as using high end equipment to "filter" out some extra sauce.
     
  15. donspublic

    donspublic Poo-Bah (2,200) Aug 4, 2014 Texas
    Society Trader

    You know this is a great point, because surely they have proceeded to reuse these barrels. So if they haven't traced the source yet, then they potentially have already increased the odds that this will be a repeat if this isn't done.
     
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  16. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (459) Jan 7, 2011 California
    Trader

    i think this is correct. the thing is they've gone out of their way to indicate they're certain it's not the new bottles + explained some of their measures that, from what i got out of it, should mean it's unlikely the contamination originated at the bottling line/point. whether or not that's completely accurate i am not sure but am assuming it's not exaggerated or misdirection.

    at the very least, one glaring concern is 2016 Barleywine is maturing in emptied 2015 BCBS barrels. if this problem isn't isolated at a phase past barrel extraction, we already know at least some 2015 BCBS is out of bounds in terms of pH readings. if it's at the barrel level, you'd have to worry BCBW is marinating in potentially suspect vessels.

    not knowing exactly when they barreled versus when they really admitted to themselves they were facing an "unprecedented situation", i am wondering if pasteurization would save them the next release? also unsure on this - when does pasteurization occur? pre-barrel entry or after barrels are emptied? my guess was after. mainly, what concerns me is if the beer is already showing signs of off flavors, beforehand, i would guess pasteurization probably isn't going to correct that. does anybody know the answer to any these questions?
     
  17. donspublic

    donspublic Poo-Bah (2,200) Aug 4, 2014 Texas
    Society Trader

    Pasteurization occurs after bottling. From MicroMatic site
    Anchor uses a flash pasteurization process https://www.anchorbrewing.com/blog/ask-bob-brewer-pasteurizing-craft-beer/
     
  18. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (459) Jan 7, 2011 California
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  19. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    I admire your commitment to beating a dead horse!!!!
     
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  20. HopsDubosc

    HopsDubosc Initiate (177) Apr 24, 2015 Vermont

    Can this post just die already..... SMH
     
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  21. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    But why I just opened another bottle and its still Infected... :grinning:
     
  22. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    Pasteurization will kill any "bugs" that were picked up from the barrels. A local brewery had one of their barrel aged beers they brewed for years with no problem have issues like those described with GI. The beer was good when bottled but developed a sourish note over time.

    This brewery started to pasteurize their beer as well as using another piece of equipment to remove particles in the beer right before or right after barreling. The feedback I see about their stuff nowadays is "better then KBS" or "KBS killer" so it can be resolved.

    Edit: The peice of equipment I believe the brewery has been using to remove unwanted particles in the beer is a Centrifuge, and I imagine a very large one.
     
    #1302 FatBoyGotSwagger, Jun 27, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2016
  23. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    But would pasteurizing basically remove that little note on the BCBS Label. "develops in bottle up to 5 years"
     
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  24. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    It would still age the same. The barrel heat would fade with slight oxidation over time. It just wouldn'the turn sour.
     
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  25. Highbrow

    Highbrow Devotee (459) Jan 7, 2011 California
    Trader

    right. my understanding is Deschutes has pasteurized ever since the Abyss issue years ago (2009ish). but that wasn't quite what i was trying to get. pasteurization sounds like it works preemptively, so long as there is no off-ness by the time one reaches the dump & bottling stage. sounds like it is unlikely to fix/correct beer that has already drifted to discernibly off in barrels? is that correct?
     
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  26. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    If the beer is already noticeably off in the barrel it should be dumped/discarded before blending/bottling. The remaining stock that tastes alright would then be bottled/pasteurized to prevent/kill any small bugs that may not be noticeable to the taste during bottling.
     
  27. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    For example

    Green Flash Silva Stout-they dumped bad barrels into the blend, the beer was horrible immediatly.

    Goose Island Barleywine/Coffee this year-Small bugs unnoticed at first develop over time.
     
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  28. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    I know stuff can still age as Rodenboch Grand Cru is pasterized and still ages.

    Removing the Bottle condition and making BCBS Pasterized. The beer isnt really going to "develop" it will change yes like you said from oxidation.
    I can say if they go this route I will never age a BCBS ever again.
     
  29. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    the only thing bottle conditioning does is carbonate the beer, so if it is properly carbonated you won't notice a difference.
     
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  30. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    thats the only thing....

    So live yeast in the bottle compared to Bottles that dont have it you will not find a difference if properly carbonated?

    this has to be the most absurd thing i have ever heard on this page.
     
  31. FatBoyGotSwagger

    FatBoyGotSwagger Poo-Bah (2,017) Apr 4, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Society

    I did my research, I've aged beers and read the literature. Sure if you take some sugar out of a more refined style it will be advantageous over time but something as sweet as BCBS you will not be able to tell the difference. People buy these beers and expect them to age into flawless things but they just change. If you don't like big bourbon flavors and massive malt sweetness you probably shouldn't be buying these beers in the first place.
     
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  32. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    I can say I agree there. With the big bourbon and massive sweetness.
     
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  33. blue-dream

    blue-dream Initiate (0) Aug 22, 2013 Virgin Islands (U.S.)

  34. tmbgnicu

    tmbgnicu Zealot (509) Mar 15, 2014 Pennsylvania
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  35. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

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  36. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    2015's Label does'nt say "develops for up to 5 years" ...
    [​IMG]
     
  37. tmbgnicu

    tmbgnicu Zealot (509) Mar 15, 2014 Pennsylvania
    Trader

    The "Stout aged in scotch whiskey barrels" is new on Prop however...
     
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  38. blue-dream

    blue-dream Initiate (0) Aug 22, 2013 Virgin Islands (U.S.)

    "dude" you are correct.:sunglasses:
     
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  39. SteveSexton203

    SteveSexton203 Initiate (0) Feb 19, 2014 Connecticut

    People said the same thing last year. I highly doubt G.I makes that change...
     
  40. HouseofWortship

    HouseofWortship Meyvn (1,366) May 3, 2016 Illinois
    Society Trader

    "Develops off flavors for up to 5 years"...
     
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