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Talking SMaSH

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by AlCaponeJunior, Jan 28, 2013.

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  1. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I want to make another SMaSH recipe.

    Feel free to discuss your best SMaSH recipes here.

    I was thinking of making something with pure 2-row and either Cluster or Cascade (I have both on hand). I've done tons of cascade recipes, who's worked with cluster enough to know if it'd be worth a dang in a smash?

    Also, I was thinking of kinda sorta hop bursting it, making it kinda IPA-ish or hoppy APA-ish. My first smash was willamette/MO and wasn't hoppy enough (it was bittered fine, just lacked hop flavor).

    With cluster, I was thinking...

    12 lbs 2-row
    1 oz cluster (8%) at 60
    1 oz cluster at 10
    1 oz cluster at 5
    2 oz cluster at FO
    2 oz cluster Dry Hop

    OG 1.063
    IBU 45.2
    SRM 4.4
    ABV 6.5%

    Now usually I just make stuff and take my chances, and don't ask around first, but I'm a little bored today :rolleyes:

    Whatever recipe gets decided will probably be brewed on saturday :cool:
  2. GatorBeer

    GatorBeer Feb 2, 2010 South Carolina
    Beer Trader

    I had a pretty successful SMaSH with golden promise and citra. ~5%, mashed 152F, all late hop additions in last 15 minutes. Nice and bright hop flavor and base. Not that complex, but thats what you pay for in a SMaSH I guess.
  3. clearbrew

    clearbrew Nov 3, 2009 Louisiana

    If I remember correctly, two row + cascade is the basic recipe for New Albion Ale. Not sure what yeast they use (and I don't feel like finding the article), but I think that is all that was in it.
    As for what it would taste like, I have no idea. I've never had New Albion.
  4. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I've heard good things, but haven't tried it so I can't say.

    Anybody have a specific yeast they like for smash beers? US-05 and Nottingham are cheep and available, I was thinking of just using Nottingham. However, I have a pretty good selection and could be convinced :cool:
  5. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    It looks fine. You could consider using a malt with a little more character, but I only say that to REALLY nit pick.

    I like my petite Saison smash. Pils/NZ Hallertauer/wy3711@64

    Edit: I changed citra to NZ Hallertauer.
    AlCaponeJunior likes this.
  6. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I have several malt choices. MO, pils, 2-row, 6-row, Vienna, maybe some others, I'm not completely sure what's in the LHBS on any given day.

    I've read some good things about Vienna ... anybody made a smash with it? I found a few threads on various forums, all of them said "awesome" or whatever degree of kick-ass.

    I could do a Cluster / 2-row smash and then a Vienna / Cascade smash on a big double-batch brew day*. :D

    *which saturday might turn out to be, starting at about 9am and going all day, Smash Saturdays anyone? :rolleyes:
  7. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    You think that would work with fuggles? I have plenty of them (leaf).
  8. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    I guess. I like the citrus of the NZ Hallertau with the pepper/phenol/dryness of 3711. Fuggles, whether US or UK will be noncitrus and more herbal. It would still be good. The worst well-made beer I've ever had was probably still pretty damn good.

    Unless you were talking about your recipe with fuggles. In that case it would be fine. I have been showcasing individual hops more and more lately.
  9. sergeantstogie

    sergeantstogie Nov 16, 2010 Washington

    My all time favorite beer (Old Stock Ale) is only Marris Otter and Fuggles. My local favorite when I am home is Fremont's Summer Ale which is just pale malt and Amarillo.
  10. SFACRKnight

    SFACRKnight Jan 20, 2012 Colorado
    Beer Trader

    I use the hell out of vienna (and munich) and enjoy the results. Just enough malt character to carry the hops, but I enjoy american pale ales like mirror pond, and boulevard pale over their dry and hoppy counterparts like sierra nevada pale ale. I'd run it with a high alpha american and see what turns out. I did a munich amarillo that turned out well. Yeah, I bittered with amarillo. Let the flaying begin...
  11. kjyost

    kjyost May 4, 2008 Manitoba (Canada)

    What does ~5% mean?
  12. GatorBeer

    GatorBeer Feb 2, 2010 South Carolina
    Beer Trader

    Sorry, ~5% ABV. I wanted a sessionable APA
  13. kjyost

    kjyost May 4, 2008 Manitoba (Canada)

    Gotcha. Thought it was some other non-SMaSH grain. :)
  14. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I've got belma, bravo, cascade, cluster, and fuggles right now. I'm about to make another bulk hop order, but for saturday, this is what I have. I'm not buying by the ounce from the LHBS, I only do bulk hops. Not that they don't have good hops or anything, I'm just cheep like that. :rolleyes:

    Bravo is 14.2% AA.

    Munich Bravo?

    Vienna Cascade?

    2-row Cluster?

    Pilsner Fuggles?

    So many choices :cool:

    I just did a Belma IPA so I won't do those.

    I think if I do 2-row I'll mash at about 155 to add body. The others probably 151.

    My bro and our friends have been liking the simple pale ales a lot. I'm kinda focusing on simpler beers and trying to improve process. These simple beers don't have much to hide behind tho. But I figure with a fair size hops addition, any minor flaws won't be noticed. :rolleyes:
  15. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    Oh I just noticed you bittered with amarillo. Oh. I see.

    Keep in mind everyone I give bulk discounts on torches for the heretic's flaying. :eek:
  16. sergeantstogie

    sergeantstogie Nov 16, 2010 Washington

    My vote is for 2 row pale and fuggles! Do a really REALLY long boil, like 3 hours. And boil the first runnings separately for some good carameilization. Delicious!
  17. psnydez86

    psnydez86 Jan 4, 2012 Pennsylvania
    Beer Trader

    My favorite smash was MO and amarillo and my least favorite was MO and Ahtanum. The ahtanum hopped beer has a soapy lemon rhind type hop flavor/aroma which is not what I expected at all.
  18. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I love mirror pond! and Boulevard pale ale is often the best one in their mixer twelveskies.
  19. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    Pils/Fuggles would be interesting
  20. SFACRKnight

    SFACRKnight Jan 20, 2012 Colorado
    Beer Trader

    Bravo is pretty close to amarillo in aau's, but I'm not too familiar with it. I would go munich and cascade just because I have used them sucessfully together before.
  21. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Aug 1, 2011 California

    I think munnich/ bravo sounds very promising.

    I haven't used Bravo yet, but the descriptions all seem to point to perfume/ apples/ spice along with the other typical citrus/ tropical thing that most high AA hops seem to have. I feel like a the perfumy/ apple part in particuar would be great over a maltier base beer.
  22. clearbrew

    clearbrew Nov 3, 2009 Louisiana

    Just so no one accuses me of being a half-ass BA, I looked up the New Albion clone recipe. It was actually in the current BYO, so luckily I didn't have to look very hard (or I probably would have given up).
    5 Gal Batch:

    11.5 # Great Western Premium 2-Row
    3.6 AAU (.6 oz @ 6% Alpha) Cascade (60 min), (30 min), (15 min).
    1 tsp. Irish Moss
    Wyeast 1026 (London Ale) or White Labs WLP013 (London Ale) Yeast.
    1.4 qt. Starter
    1 cp Corn Sugar (priming)
    Mash @ 140 for 1 hr. in 16 qts.
  23. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I have a pound of bravo that I haven't opened and haven't tried yet. I would like to try it and this sounds tasty. I am emailing the LHBS now to see if they have munich in stock. :D

    I'm waiting for phone text replies to see if we're doing a big double batch day on saturday. Sgt Stogie's fuggles special sounds tasty too. I don't know about a three hour boil, but longer than an hour would be no problem! But then the pils/fuggles sounds tasty too, clean and pilsy with a fuggly hop bite? So many decisions, so few batches!
  24. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    I knew you would. I expected nothing less from a Cobra Kai. A Cobra Kai never dies.
  25. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    The petite saison is also looking tasty. I haven't used 3711 before tho. My fermenting freezer usually runs about 66F. I would be brewing it with fuggles tho. I'm working on the new blog for the big SMaSH day but I won't make the final purchasing decisions till I'm ready to pick them up!

    It might partially depend what they have in stock too, for yeast and malts.
  26. scurvy311

    scurvy311 Dec 3, 2005 Louisiana

    For me, 3711 goes to 1.004-8 if I mash 147. I didn't like it at first until I started fermenting with it lower. I start at 62 and let it free rise to 68ish. 66 would probably be fine. Now I crave the peppery, spicy, tart phenols. That's why I really like pairing the NZ Hallertauer and pils malt.
  27. MontpelierArtie

    MontpelierArtie Jun 23, 2010 Vermont

    Enjoying a MO and EKG barley wine one year later. Boiled the first runnings to a syrupy consistency. Delicious.
    sergeantstogie likes this.
  28. barfdiggs

    barfdiggs Mar 22, 2011 California

    Sam Adams is rebrewing the beer with the original yeast, so you could culture it from the bottle.
  29. barfdiggs

    barfdiggs Mar 22, 2011 California

    Sadly all the Bravo single hop beers I've had have been disappointing.... never really got much in the way of flavor from them. Granted these were commercial pale ales, meant to be quaffed by the masses, and were not hop bombs FWIW.
  30. psnydez86

    psnydez86 Jan 4, 2012 Pennsylvania
    Beer Trader

    The can you brew it episode of Epic Pale Ale from Australia is not quite a smash, but they use only Cascade hops and Jamil could not beleive that the hop flavor profile was derived from a single hop, but they layered it in such a way, and did multiple dry hop additions to give one hop multi dimensions.
    AlCaponeJunior likes this.
  31. hopsandmalt

    hopsandmalt Dec 14, 2006 Michigan

    I vote for Vienna/fuggles to the tune of about 1.047 mashed @152, hopbursted with big additions at 30, 10, and 0 min., and fermented with London ale yeast.
    AlCaponeJunior and MrOH like this.
  32. jmich24

    jmich24 Jan 28, 2010 Michigan

    My next beer I have planned to brew is a MO and EKG SMASH.

    10 pounds MO mash at 152

    1 oz EKG @ 60
    2 oz EKG @ 15
    2 oz EKG Whirlpool

    4.7 % ABV and 35 IBU

    Keg condition with corn sugar and 1 oz EKG in Keg for a "Cask Effect"

    AlCaponeJunior likes this.
  33. yinzer

    yinzer Nov 24, 2006 Pennsylvania

    Has anyone done an Optic SMaSH?

    I've only used Optic once. As I understand it it's the malt used to make aromatic malt (??). I just did an Old Ale with 50/50 MO/Optic. I went that way because aromatic was too dark for what I wanted to do. Proper decision?? Don't know. It's still in the primary.

    But back on point. Does optic lend a special malt flavor, like Golden Promise is said too? Or is it more aromatic only?
  34. yinzer

    yinzer Nov 24, 2006 Pennsylvania

    Mash temps with session beers (not that yours is being that the OG is too high) is a hot topic. But FWIW I was at a beer fest and had a cast beer from Redemption Brewing Company. I felt that it was the best session beer that I ever had. It was 3.5% or 3.8?? , not sure but it was low. But it was good. And I've had beers from The Kernel and other UK cast beers. I was told that they mash above 160.

    If above 160 scares you, I understand. My take 149-153 is transition. Meaning 142-147 and 155-168 is relatively equal. As in the two zones are different but each zone has similar results.

    So how do you mash? If you don't do temp control try to hit the higher part with your strike water. With a session beer you don't want to mash at 154, stir and at 10 minutes later be at 150 and throw in boiling water. Much better to calculate 158 and wind up at 154 then throw in the hot water. Basically if you want to mash under 151 strike low and go up, conversely if you want to mash high - then go high and drop down.

    If you screw up or think that you might, hold back a pound of base grains. After things settle out you can throw then in and you'll get fresh enzymes.
    AlCaponeJunior likes this.
  35. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    If I do this one, it will be in a freezer with controller set to keep the temp between 64-66. That's my fermentation chamber right now. I like that temp because it's workable with everything I have brewed so far.

    Point taken on the bravo hops, if I do that one they will be added generously at flameout and 5 minutes, with a small bittering charge.

    I ordered 12 lbs munich for one of these beers. No reply from the LHBS yet. If they don't have munich I asked for Vienna. I should hear from them today. Other than that, I haven't really finalized saturday's brewday yet. :cool:
  36. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    Well I decided on the brews for big Smash Saturday...

    The first SMaSH beer will be a Munich malt and Bravo hops special.
    • 12 lbs Munich
    • 14 grams Bravo at 60
    • 2 oz Bravo at 5 minutes
    • 2 oz Bravo at flameout
    • 2 oz Bravo dry hop
    • mash at 151
    • OG 1.064
    • IBU 45
    • SRM 12.3
    • ABV 6.6
    The second SMaSH beer will be a pilsner malt and fuggles hops with saison yeast smash, with 3711 yeast. Thanks to scurvy311 on beer advocate for the idea!
    • 12 lbs pilsner malt
    • 1 oz fuggles at 60
    • 1 oz fuggles at 15
    • 1 oz fuggles at 5
    • 1 oz fuggles at 0
    • 2 oz fuggles dry hop
    • mash at 154
    • OG 1.062
    • IBU 27.8
    • SRM 2.7
    • ABV 6.9
    Fermentation temperature is about 64-66F.

    Mash temps usually start a degree or two high and drop a degree or two below by the end of 75 minutes with several stirs.

    ABV and OG are likely to be estimated high. I tend to come out a little low on both of those parameters. I haven't quite figured out why yet. Typically I've used 11 lbs of malts, between 7-8 gallons water, and come out with OGs between 1.046 and 1.056. I can still tweak the recipes if need be.

    I am hoping the bravo late additions will give me a good hoppy pale ale, and let me know what bravo hops taste like on their own. I'm not necessarily shooting for a full blown IPA type beer, I want a more hoppy/bitter pale ale.

    The saison-esque beer... No idea what to expect. Scurvy311... is that close to your recipe? Too much base malt? You said "petite" but I'm not sure of the specifics.

    Sgt Stogie... Your 2-row long boil recipe is in the queue. I am ordering more fuggles so I can certainly try that one! It looks tasty!

    Gonna be a wild weekend. Friday night, hockey game. Saturday, big double brew day. Sunday, band practice and superbowl! :cool:
    sergeantstogie likes this.
  37. ventura78

    ventura78 Nov 22, 2003 Massachusetts

    We're going to try this one in the near future. A De Ranke Guldenberg clone

    For 18 gallons

    48 lbs of Malteries Franco-Belges Pilsen Malt
    4 lbs of table sugar
    4 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker 60 min
    4 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker 5 min
    4 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker Dry hop
    Wyeast 1214

    Og 1.080
    Fg 1.010
    Alc. 9.3
    24.7 IBU
    AlCaponeJunior likes this.
  38. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Aug 1, 2011 California

    Rad! I'm really excited to hear how this one turns out as I have a vougly similar beer planned for the spring.

    What yeast are you using?? Also, I might suggest a higher mash temp to keep the FG up... seems to me munich would nice with a big malty finish. I reckon 151 for a 1.064 beer with US05 would get down to around 1.011ish on my system.... 1.014-1.015 sounds mo-beta for a redish pale.
  39. AlCaponeJunior

    AlCaponeJunior May 21, 2010 Texas

    I could bump the temp up ... say 154?

    I was going to use nottingham on that one.
  40. JimmyTango

    JimmyTango Aug 1, 2011 California

    Word up.

    What can I offer you in exchange for one of these once they're ready?
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