The #MeToo Movement Is Coming To Craft Beer...Will It Arrive Before All The Women Leave?

Discussion in 'Beer News & Releases' started by PNW, Mar 6, 2020.

  1. PNW

    PNW Initiate (155) Dec 23, 2019 Washington
    Society Industry Trader

    Just read this excellent article from Tara Nurin on Forbes about sexism in the beer industry. Progress is slowly being made, but the beer world still has a long way to go before it's considered a fully welcoming and safe place for women. Dudes, we have the chance to help transform the beer culture and be a part of the solution. Be an ally, treat women like you'd want to be treated yourself, consider their perspectives, talk about and support them, and of course don't f'ing ask to see their damn tits. :poop:

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/taranu...r--will-it-arrive-before-all-the-women-leave/
     
  2. woodchipper

    woodchipper Meyvn (1,174) Oct 25, 2005 Connecticut
    Society

    It's everywhere. Why would craft beer be immune?
     
  3. JrGtr

    JrGtr Devotee (412) Apr 13, 2006 Massachusetts

    Not saying it doesn't happen - OF COURSE it does, but IME, craft beer is generally more accepting of women and POC than many other hobbies I'm into.
     
  4. sharpski

    sharpski Meyvn (1,167) Oct 11, 2010 Oregon
    Society Industry Trader

  5. TrojanRB

    TrojanRB Poo-Bah (1,534) Jul 27, 2013 California
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    What a trash article.
     
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  6. beertunes

    beertunes Poo-Bah (7,019) Sep 24, 2007 Liechtenstein
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    How so?
     
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  7. PNW

    PNW Initiate (155) Dec 23, 2019 Washington
    Society Industry Trader

    I’m sure it does seem that way to you, but I’m guessing you aren’t a POC or a woman so maybe we should listen to what they’re saying.
     
  8. unlikelyspiderperson

    unlikelyspiderperson Meyvn (1,247) Mar 12, 2013 California
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    what are the other hobbies?
     
  9. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (1,970) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    I find it interesting that it appears that some women (including the author of the piece) seem to prefer the term gender-specific "brewster" for women brewers, kind of in opposition to the decades long movement to make job titles gender-neutral. I understand the need and desire for solidarity among any minority group within a larger community, just find it unusual.

    Some entomology sites suggest that "brewster" as used centuries ago did not necessarily only refer to women in the trade:
    and that the suffix "ster" was and is not always gender-specific, and is still found today in terms such as "hipster" and, even within the brewing industry -"maltster".

    In the '60s, I knew a young woman in college taking chemistry courses whose father worked at Pabst and he (or she? I forget) used the term "brewmistress" for a female brewmaster. But, I guess, that one brings some other cultural baggage with it - altho', conversely, I gotta admit, when I hear or read "brewster" I think of this guy - "Brewster, the Goebel Rooster" (who, it should go without saying, was male :grin:).

    Well, as I noted above, I came of age during the '60s during an earlier era of feminism (which, at times, could clash with other 60s cultural beliefs regarding dress and image, etc) but when I read this warning and then look at the two photos of that "beer influencer" (yeah, it's already a cliche but I gotta add - :rolling_eyes: ), my first thought was, "It appears you don't have to ask....".

    Sure, people can dress anyway they want to but, unfair or wrong as it might be to judge someone's image, you've also got to expect the stereotypical "male" reaction to it. (I'd think there are a whole lot of women who'd also raise an eyebrow at those shots given the topic...)
     
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  10. mrmattosgood

    mrmattosgood Initiate (139) Nov 6, 2010 Monaco
    Trader

    Yes to all of this.

    However, while the golden rule is great, the platinum rule might be even more appropriate here: Treat others as they would like to be treated.
     
  11. TheIPAHunter

    TheIPAHunter Poo-Bah (2,367) Aug 12, 2007 Pennsylvania
    Society Trader

    Let's be honest here. That beer influencer knows exactly what she's doing. We can't sit here and pretend her influence has anything other than to do with her image. I found that article to be ironic as f*ck. Cheers.
     
  12. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (1,970) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    Yeah, but I also have to wonder why the author - or more likely the editor at Forbes? - chose to have two pictures of the "influencer" to illustrate an article that only briefly mentions her, 3/4's of the way through the article.

    I mean, I find that pic of her in the pool absolutely disgusting!
    "Who in their right mind DOES that!?"
    But, then, that's always my reaction to photos of beer exposed to bright sunlight :grin:.
     
  13. hopfenunmaltz

    hopfenunmaltz Meyvn (1,491) Jun 8, 2005 Michigan

    Glass in a swimming pool? If it breaks the pool has to be drained, and the pool cleaned. Not good practice.
     
  14. FBarber

    FBarber Poo-Bah (3,168) Mar 5, 2016 Illinois
    Society Trader

    I did find it interesting that the author even said that she's been critical of the "beer influencer" scene and the often overt sexual tones of these influencers ... not that that is anything unique in beer advertising (because lets be honest, all these influencers are is a form of beer advertising).
     
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  15. PNW

    PNW Initiate (155) Dec 23, 2019 Washington
    Society Industry Trader

    What exactly is ironic? Did you actually read the article? Just because a woman has cleavage, and chooses to show that cleavage, that doesn't mean she should be open to being sexually harassed by men, especially coworkers. Here's a crazy thought, women can be smart and have boobs too. Grow up, dude.
     
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  16. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (2,359) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    Do that a public place, guess who gets the bill?
     
  17. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (2,359) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    I love a good social warrior.
     
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  18. TheIPAHunter

    TheIPAHunter Poo-Bah (2,367) Aug 12, 2007 Pennsylvania
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    Excuse me? Yes, I read the article. Cheers.
     
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  19. ScaryEd

    ScaryEd Poo-Bah (2,377) Feb 19, 2012 New Hampshire
    Society

    A large percentage of craft beer drinkers are fat neckbeards (like myself) so this isn't surprising.
     
  20. JayWhitson

    JayWhitson Crusader (760) Feb 25, 2015 Montana
    Trader

    I think part of what he was referencing is that Instagram is a primarily visual medium.
     
  21. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (2,359) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    This stuff is always directed at men, but women in general couldn’t possibly be a part of the problem too right? Nah..
     
  22. JayWhitson

    JayWhitson Crusader (760) Feb 25, 2015 Montana
    Trader

    I wasn’t trying to point fingers at anyone. Just pointing out the irony that Hunter was referencing.
     
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  23. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (2,359) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
    Society Trader

    I understand, I probably shouldn’t have quoted you there, I just piggybacked it. But my point stand separate from that, I think it’s valid that women are very critical of other women. Especially one who pointing a finger at someone or anyone while wearing anything close to provocative. It’s always a man that’s a pig, but that’s certainly not true, but it’s where that article points. People being people I’m sure both might be true to some degree.
     
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  24. sharpski

    sharpski Meyvn (1,167) Oct 11, 2010 Oregon
    Society Industry Trader

    Sure, she can be knowledgeable about beer and have boobs. I don’t think anyone would argue that the addition of sex to her beer photos is unintentional, though. So it seems strange to take an article arguing that women should be taken seriously as industry professionals and include not one but two photos of an industry professional who chooses to make her body a significant part of her persona. Lots of other women in the industry who are more consistent with the article text who did not get featured. But the editor wants clicks, even if the images seem to undercut the author’s message.
     
  25. JayWhitson

    JayWhitson Crusader (760) Feb 25, 2015 Montana
    Trader

    I see your point. Look at the magazines at the store (while they still exist in this digital world). Who is traditionally on the cover of both Playboy and Cosmopolitan?
     
  26. brandnewcardock

    brandnewcardock Initiate (86) Aug 23, 2017 New York
    Trader

    I love that anytime there's a thread about this topic the same group of guys crack their knuckles and proudly rush to share they're very enlightened opinions.

    [​IMG]
     
    #26 brandnewcardock, Mar 9, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2020
  27. BirdsandHops

    BirdsandHops Poo-Bah (2,698) Apr 14, 2008 Oregon
    Society

    Wait, what do insects have to do with this? :wink:

    People who can't distinguish between entomology and etymology bug me in ways that I can't put into words.
     
  28. HouseofWortship

    HouseofWortship Crusader (776) May 3, 2016 Illinois
    Trader

    There are more women in craft beer jobs and consuming craft beer than ever before. I think they'll be okay. If men don't turn women off from men, then I can't see men turning women off of craft beer.
     
  29. John_M

    John_M Poo-Bah (6,552) Oct 25, 2003 Oregon
    Moderator Society Trader

    Yes, but apparently you didn't have the correct reaction or response when you read it. That's key when it comes to reading this type of article.


    (and yes, there might be a touch of sarcasm in my comment)
     
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  30. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (1,970) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    :astonished: What bugs me when people rely on Spellcheck, too.
    Even more so when I'm the one who did it....
    (but I guess the fact that I linked to https://www.etymonline.com/ means something).
     
  31. Hoppsbabo

    Hoppsbabo Champion (890) Jan 29, 2012 United Kingdom (England)
    Trader

    BirdsandHops
    Your username takes on a whole new meaning in British English :-D
     
  32. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,936) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
    Society Trader

    Not sure about the rest of the country but the breweries around me and pubs etc. are packed with women. Any time I hit up my local places its a fantastic mix of all people for the most part and I am happy to see it.
     
  33. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (2,359) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    I bet Red Oak is close to 50/50. Sometimes there’s more women here than men, and they come in groups too, and it’s a place run by mostly women outside of the head brewer. How many brewers they have I haven’t a clue. But they do allow dogs, and they have food trucks etc, a huge outdoor sitting area, real nice place imo.
     
  34. skelliott

    skelliott Initiate (76) Jul 2, 2013 California

    LOL @ "the addition of sex to her beer photos." A woman takes a picture of herself next to a beer and suddenly she's using sex for attention? Do you think the same thing when you see a picture of a man with a beer? Just because you're attracted to breasts doesn't mean she's putting them out there for you to gawk at. They are literally just a part of her body.
     
  35. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,936) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
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    That's awesome! I love the diversity here in AZ. The breweries are a great time, loads of people from all walks of life, women all over, dogs, kids, etc. I always have a fantastic time when out and meet some amazing people who are just good people. I hope its spreading across the country more and more because in my eyes it makes for a better experience. I love seeing groups of women come in ordering flights and stouts, etc. It's cool to see how the love of beer is just not a guy thing anymore. Times have sure changed from the old days at the bar with my buddies smoking cigarettes and drinking in some dim lit crap hole.
    Cheers
     
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  36. sharpski

    sharpski Meyvn (1,167) Oct 11, 2010 Oregon
    Society Industry Trader

    Dude, you’re really trying to defend that her photos are just “a picture of herself next to a beer”? We could debate elements of her photo composition, but on the most basic level she posts some pictures of herself without beer but no photos of beer without herself. Her body is in more of her beer photos than beer is, so please drop the argument that she’s not intentionally making her body a significant element of the photos.

    I’m not saying she can’t/shouldn’t do it, just that hers is not the best example to use in an article arguing men should stop treating women in the industry as sexual objects.
     
    #36 sharpski, Mar 9, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2020
  37. JayWhitson

    JayWhitson Crusader (760) Feb 25, 2015 Montana
    Trader

    It really wasn’t in the same vein as the rest of the serious article detailing criminal behavior.
     
  38. skelliott

    skelliott Initiate (76) Jul 2, 2013 California

    I'm not denying that her body is in these photos. My point is that her body is not inherently sexual, it is simply her body. The fact that she has breasts and they are a visible part of her body does not mean that she is intentionally introducing sex into her beer photos.

    On that point this is a very good example of how men should stop treating women in the industry (and in general) as sex objects. Unless you'd rather just keep blaming her for being sexually harassed.
     
  39. JayWhitson

    JayWhitson Crusader (760) Feb 25, 2015 Montana
    Trader

    I don't believe she was the one being sexually harassed. She was facing blowback from the rest of the women who wanted to be taken seriously as brewers and members of the craft beer community, while not posing with beer in their hands in swimsuits.

    Not that I believe their is anything wrong with what she is doing. But as far as I’ve read Instagram influencers make money off how many followers they have. And I did read her reviews and don’t believe that’s why she has that many.
     
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  40. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (2,359) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
    Society Trader

    The old time bars I grew up in were shit holes for the most part, funny no TVs then unliked now, guys huddled over their beer and maybe a shot of cheap whiskey like Fleishmans or Calvert, .50 Cents for both. Places like Red Oak and Resident Culture are definitely everyone friendly, as are most of the craft beer bars I’ve been in as well. Those old Smokey rum dum bars went the way of the dodo bird, there’s just better places that appeal to everyone and you don't need a gun to get in or out.
     
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