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Discussion in 'Mid-Atlantic' started by HokiesandBeer, Feb 5, 2013.
ah yea, you're right...nevermind my post then haha
Magic Man was the one that was proud to show his perfect growler fill... by turning down the flow rate to a trickle. =/
I think it might be a business/understaffed situation. The way they do it now to handle the amount of growler fills and beer glass fills is they sit the growler on an angle under the tap and walk away to do something else so that they can keep it moving. If you use a hose, etc. you can't just walk away. You have to stay there and hold the growler the whole time.
I've never had such a growler fill from TH that I felt like they had a problem although I tend to go when they aren't as busy. Maybe they have more time to pay attention to my fill instead of multitasking?
All right All right All right. Where to begin? It seems that we are swimming in a sea of misinformation here...
For starters, growlers are best consumed within 48 hours. Period. Let's be frank here: We are filling a jug with beer from the tap. I'm not saying that this is a poor method of transporting beer to and from the brewery, because it's not. It's just intermediary and immediate. Instead of taking all of the time/space/resources (that we don't have) and individually counter-pressure filling growlers, we choose to fill from the tap, like most brew pubs. We fill a lot of growlers, and I don't disagree that a counter-pressure filling device would be a great idea, but this is just impractical for now.
Secondly, we work very hard to keep co2 in our beers as it transitions from our serving tanks into your glass/growler. We utilize beer pumps, and flow control faucets to ensure that we are able to precisely monitor/control the amount of co2 that is leaving our beer upon pouring. Lauren, you had mentioned that Magick Man was proud to show you the "perfect fill". That is awesome. He was doing precisely what I trained him to do for a proper fill: Increase restriction of the beer coming out of the tap considerably (to the point where it is not throwing a head in the growler) and fill slowly down the side of the growler. You see, the increased restriction coming out of the tap, and the lack of head coming out of the beer as we fill it in the growler (which would be co2 leaving the beer) is essential in keeping co2 in solution.
Thirdly, we do get very busy, especially on the weekends. As a result, a growler may be filled a little too fast from time to time. This is truly unfortunate, and I apologize if this has happened to any of you. That being said, I truly do feel that we owe much of this traffic from interest generated from you fine folks. A good problem to have!
I hope this has helped. Please drink our beer fresh unless we bottle it. Thank you for your continued support. You guys shred.
Drink the yeast, Eat the rind.
Jean Broillet IV
Thank you for the clarification, Jean.
However, one side tells me that cutting down the flow rate in a growler fill is what you should do. Another side tells me that's absolutely not what you should do. Can I get some sort of concensus here? haha. argh.
I'm not sure if this is where the opposite advice is coming from, but there are situations where low flow rate could mean a bad fill carbonation-wise. In the case I'm thinking of, however, it would be a symptom rather than the actual problem. If someone is turning down the pressure on the keg rather than using a flow restriction tap, then over time the lower pressure in the keg would allow CO2 to escape from solution and the beer would seem less carbonated.
However, if done just in the short run, even something like that wouldn't matter. On the homebrew side, the operation of a bottle filling device like the Blichmann Beer Gun is to turn the pressure way down on the keg. This is only done for a short time so there's no worry about long-term CO2 escape. Once this is accomplished, you can fill a bottle through a device that helps restrict the flow. In combination with the lower pressure pushing the beer out, the liquid comes out slowly, forming no head inside the bottle. CO2 does not escape from solution.
That was likely far, far too much information, but perhaps a bit helpful in one way in which reduced flow could signal carbonation issues without necessarily being the cause.
I only had one growler filled by Tired Hands (and it was fine and consumed that night) as I usually drink my beer there, but I've had so many bad growlers in general that I basically don't even attempt to let it go past the night after the night I fill it, but prefer to drink the night of. They are just way too fragile. That said, I'd have an issue if they weren't even lasting until the next day.
Since the introduction of the 1L swing top style growler, I've had virtually zero issues with lack of carbonation in any of the various beers. In many instances, the growlers have been consumed in the 6-10 day window, and they've been carbed beautifully. I've had a couple that were flat, but they've been few and far in between. All of the growlers I speak of were CO2 purged, and of the 1L variety. The screw top 64 oz growlers, I've had greater instances of them going flat over similar time frames. Sometimes, however, they simply can't be gotten to for consumption any sooner. I do understand fully that any shortcomings these beers have after an extended period of time are largely end user induced.
TH doesn't put a hose/tube in the tap to fill growlers?
wow, don't think I've ever seen/heard of that before...
Magic man is really good with the growers
When you go to go victory they have a large hissing machine that fills growers at the push of a button, no hose required.
I'd prefer a hissing Magick Man to a hissing machine any day.
neither does hill farmstead.
Holy crap. I didn't see this the first time I saw this thread. I was already thinking this would be a worthwhile place to check out, but I may just have been won over a little more.
There is a metal tube that goes into the growler at Victory in their counterpressure fill machine.
The counter pressure machine would be great, but I have inquired before and heard it costs something north of $25K. Given that people won't flock there just to see the cool machine and that it's not a huge time saver, I just don't think it's realistic to expect them to make such an investment. It's not like they have a ton of room behind the bars there, either. Maybe down the road...
a $1 investment in a tube or 2 to place into the tap faucets for bottom fills would help to dramatically improve quality of growler fills
I don't disagree.
Hill Farmstead doesn't use a tube, as mentioned in a post above. Makes you wonder what their secret is.
Again...I've noticed the swingtops on a CO2 purge have kept things carbed quite nicely for upwards of a week.
indeed, their growlers stay nicely carbed.
a properly filled/stored swingtop, even without CO2 purge, will be good muuuuuuuuuuch longer than a week before opening (with the appropriate beer of course).
opened a HopHand growler last night (filled 3 days prior). fantastic Pale but low on carbonation. was going to wait to open the Perfect Touchdown growler next weekend when some friends come in from out of town but am fearing that may be low as well and will open this weekend...
1 thing I did notice, the rubber grommet on the swing top wasn't laying completely flat against the mouth of the growler like I'm used to seeing on swingtops; it sat at a slight angle (higher on 1 side compared to the other side). maybe this is the cause of the carb loss?
I could see an improperly seated grommet as an issue.
Holy cow, it is 2013 and still much growler confusion an misinformation.
For the brewery, sure the beer is better fresher but that should not be an excuse for undercarbonated beer. the beer should not lose carbonation in the growler in 2 days or ever.
AS for the flow control faucets, they are absolutely awesome and I fill growlers at the bar all the time. No beer loss and no carbonation issues.
If there are carbonation issues, I would not blame them on the pour at all. We have all had plenty of beer poured into growlers foaming all over the place. If you cap on foam and the beer was properly carbonated in the first place, the beer should be fine.
Slowing down the flow is absolutely the right move. That is how you do not waste beer whether pouring into glasses or into growlers.
If anyone is interested in trading some Tired Hands brews/growlers for MI brews/growlers, drop me a line.
If the beer is foaming all over the place CO2 is coming out of solution and the resulting pour will be less carbonated or even worse flat. This why many brewpubs and homebrewers lower their flow rate when filling a growler.
I'm sad none of the Singel Hop Saison's made the list. Just had a few of the Amarillo. What a great series!
Just there as well. Ego is awesome!!!! Amarillo, Saison was excellent!!!! MotherAnimal was thin, didn't get much vanilla.... PerfectTouchdown was good, not their best IPA. StrangeOwl was ok....
I'm wondering if they're having some kind of CO2 issue in general right now. Just got back from my first visit and the beers on tap were sort of flat, the house soda even more so - flavored water.
Did anyone more familiar with the place find them "off" this weekend? I hate to be the lone detractor, but I was sort of disappointed after the anticipation I'd built up prior to my pilgrimage. The ones mentioned in the OP are unfortunately in the past, and out of HopHands, FarmHands, MotherAnimal, Ego Disillusionment, and Whatever Nevermind; W,N was the only one I really enjoyed.
Damn, the ONLY beer I didn't/haven't tried....
Well there goes my excuse for iconoclasm then... I guess they just aren't my cup of tea.
Looks like you have plans for tomorrow, then. Very citrusy.
Was there yesterday to meet a friend from out of town and everything was well carbed. Got a few growlers to go to take to a friend's house, and while we drank them within a few hours of having them filled, they held up well.
Great input. The beer out the tap was well carbed and growler held up for 2 hours. :rolleyes
Jean, first and foremost let me tip my hat to you and say you brew some damn good beer. However, it takes more then that to grow as a successful brewery. So far, it looks like your doing very well and I wish you continued success.
Speaking from the experience of running a successful business doing international commerce, My first note of advise is to listen to your customers and use the feedback to improve your business as you grow. It is easy to say we are doing everything right and place the blame on something else. However that is not how you keep or improve your reputation. People like confidence, however most are turned off by a strong ego. You have to think outside of the box and make changes that fix any weak points, rather then denying any problem exists in the first place. As a frequent patron, I can provide you with a long list of your strong points and weak points as an establishment, but you would probably not care to hear it.
To be fair, people were just complaining that they didn't think the beers were carbed properly over the weekend.
Looks like another bottle release on Sunday. Here's the text for those without facebook.
edit: Looks like they already have a couple reviews too. Guess some people got samples a little while ago.
Looks like the base never got an entry if it was ever for sale though.
This Sunday we will offer two bottles for sale:
Guillemot Nebula - 50/50 blend of Jim Beam and Chaddsford red wine barrel fermented Guillemot.
$8/375ml bottle. Limit 4/person.
Guillemot Prunus - Jim Beam barrel fermented Guillemot. Single barrel bottle/not blended. Fermented atop 45lbs. of local tart cherries
$15/500ml bottle. Limit 1/person.
Guillemot is our dense, dark Saison. 8.5% abv.
We should also have 2-3 new beers on by this weekend. I hope to see you here!
Just saw that. I wonder what the bottle counts are.
Having had Tired Hands both on tap and in growlers(somewhere around 30 growlers so far) one of the things I love about Tired hands is that their beers are not aggressively/over-carbed. Im sure some people have had straight up flat growlers but maybe some people are expecting more carbonation when its not really there. Maybe we have gotten used to aggressively/over-carbed beers and when we have anything less its "wrong"