What type of seal could the Brewers Association offer to entice you?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by stevepat, Jun 10, 2019.

  1. stevepat

    stevepat Zealot (598) Mar 12, 2013 California
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    Given that nearly 90% of respondents to the poll said they either don't look for the 'independent craft' seal or don't know what it is, I got to wondering what sort of labeling the BA could provide that would get you to take notice.

    For me, something that identified breweries that worked to be good ecological stewards (supporting small toxin free farmers in ingredient sourcing, diverting mash waste from landfills, using water conservation techniques, etc...) OR something that identified breweries that were especially positive economic actors. This second is already (i think) somewhat covered by the certified B Corp logo but I only know of one brewery that sports that (NothCoast brewing) but given threads like the one about trilliums labor practices it seems there is some room for improvement in the working conditions/compensation department in the brewing industry.

    Is there any labeling addition that would make a difference in your purchasing decisions? Or is it just about the liquid in the vessel?
     
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  2. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Savant (978) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts

    Just about the liquid in the vessel for me.

    And to be honest, I find the constant advertising of the "seal" to be annoying. But, I get it and why they do it.
     
  3. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,636) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
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    I would be game to see a symbol that the brewery acts as a good steward. A handful of my local guys are big into this especially Arizona Wilderness which is one of my local favorites.I think when companies spend more and do more they should be recognized for such efforts, etc.

    On the flip side I cannot see the industry going down this road, sadly I think the politics involved would result in gridlock on the subject.

    Usually I read about the breweries I enjoy and their mission statements etc so I get a good feel for what they stand for and all. Plus visiting them and knowing the folks helps determine a lot. I like to support folks who support the local community and give back etc.

    Cheers
     
  4. joerooster

    joerooster Initiate (31) May 15, 2018 Virginia

    A seal with the bottling/canning date on it, mm/dd/yy (or similar) format.
     
  5. BayAreaJoe

    BayAreaJoe Champion (867) Nov 23, 2017 California
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    Yes, some kind sustainable practices seal, although I'm not quite sure if the BA would be the one to administer it.

    Of course beer quality & price remain two leading factors - but with those being nearly equal, I think a seal denoting good stewardship/practices is more meaningful than the "independent" seal.

    Separately, I think we're getting to the point where we need a *Lactose-Free* seal.
     
  6. dcotom

    dcotom Poo-Bah (2,129) Aug 4, 2014 Iowa
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    This. I care only about what's in the container, not what's on it.
     
  7. AlcahueteJ

    AlcahueteJ Savant (978) Dec 4, 2004 Massachusetts

    If breweries contract brew, should we put a "dependent" seal on the beers?
     
  8. MNAle

    MNAle Meyvn (1,445) Sep 6, 2011 Minnesota
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    They should just quite wasting their time and money on this falderol. If it does not pertain to the liquid in the container, it won't affect me one way or the other.
     
  9. Giantspace

    Giantspace Crusader (707) Dec 22, 2011 Pennsylvania

    I would like to see what is in my beer. I don’t want lactose in my beer and some beers don’t tell you this or it’s so small and hidden.

    I list of ingredients would be a good starting point. Calories , sugars , carbs etc on the can would also be great.

    I don’t care if a canned on or best by is used but state BB x date or canned on X date, not just a date I need to guess about. DFH uses canned on but the packaged on date is different than the cans in the pack and that is annoying. Use the oldest can date on the mix pack box.

    Enjoy
     
  10. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (4,012) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    A seal like @joerooster stated: “A seal with the bottling/canning date on it, mm/dd/yy (or similar) format.”

    But in addition a message like: “If this beer is x days past the packaging date please call us at 1-800-xxx-xxxx and we will promptly remove this old product from the retailer.”

    Cheers!
     
  11. dennis3951

    dennis3951 Champion (887) Mar 6, 2008 New Jersey

    I don't care about the seal at all, it's about the beer and nothing else.
     
  12. rgordon

    rgordon Savant (931) Apr 26, 2012 North Carolina

    The seal on the North Coast Red Seal Ale has always lured me.
     
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  13. sharpski

    sharpski Meyvn (1,125) Oct 11, 2010 Oregon
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    The seal is for beer drinkers who don’t spend time on a beer forum, it’s not for us.
     
  14. matthewp

    matthewp Initiate (176) Feb 27, 2015 Massachusetts

    Certainly the majority of people on beer forums know who is and who isn't independent. The question is whether anyone outside of people who hang out on beer forums cares if the brewery is independent or not. The conjecture of the seal is that if people knew that a craft beer wasn't an independent brewery that the purchaser would not purchase the beer. I'm not really sure that matters to non beer geeks. Its unclear how much it matters to beer geeks either. I'd guess they never really put any market research into this...
     
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  15. drtth

    drtth Poo-Bah (3,851) Nov 25, 2007 Pennsylvania

    There are market research data that show that at least one major demographic of buyers uses independent as one factor in their beer buying choices.
     
  16. DIM

    DIM Poo-Bah (2,661) Sep 28, 2006 Pennsylvania
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    The only seal I look for is a very prominent packaged on date.
     
  17. matthewp

    matthewp Initiate (176) Feb 27, 2015 Massachusetts

    Certainly there are demographics of people who use independent as one factor in their beer buying choices but the question is whether that group of people looks to the seal or knows who is and who isn't an independent brewer with or without the seal. If you are preaching to the choir then putting a seal on is useless and you don't really have market research data (or at least not the proper data). A majority of the beer I purchase has the seal, probably 99% of the beer in fact but the seal isn't a factor in my purchase. I kind of doubt that a high percentage of people who are educated enough to know that the seal exists are unaware of which breweries are truly independent.
     
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  18. WillieThreebiers

    WillieThreebiers Poo-Bah (4,316) Apr 26, 2012 Connecticut
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  19. PapaGoose03

    PapaGoose03 Poo-Bah (2,413) May 30, 2005 Michigan
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    You and several others have commented about this version of a seal, but in reality it could cause us to put that bottle\can back on the shelf because the date is too old. And we all know that maybe half of the beer on store shelves is older than what we'd like it to be.
     
  20. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (1,767) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    But if we "know" it, that must mean it is already date-coded, isn't it? (I posted in this thread earlier but somehow most of those posts by me and others were deleted, I guess?)
     
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  21. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,636) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
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  22. PapaGoose03

    PapaGoose03 Poo-Bah (2,413) May 30, 2005 Michigan
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    Yeah, if we know it, I agree with your point. But my point is that the deal could have the opposite desired effect with old dates. Not much of a plus for a marketing effort.
     
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  23. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (1,767) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    Huh? But...but that's what this thread is about, too :rolling_eyes:
     
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  24. stevepat

    stevepat Zealot (598) Mar 12, 2013 California
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    Maybe a seal that carries a packaged on and best by (based on the beer inside) date as well as indicating that the brewery was following some kind of best practices to ensure fresh beer was on the shelves/old beer was removed. Maybe accompanied by some phone number to call or instruction to alert the store staff if the beer had passed code
     
  25. jesskidden

    jesskidden Poo-Bah (1,767) Aug 10, 2005 New Jersey
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    Other businesses (bakery, dairy, etc) are able to survive without depending on selling old product.
     
  26. rudiecantfail

    rudiecantfail Zealot (573) Aug 9, 2011 Pennsylvania
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    Maybe a seal worth 25% off.
     
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  27. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (4,012) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    Needless to say but I agree with this (as posted above):

    "But in addition a message like: “If this beer is x days past the packaging date please call us at 1-800-xxx-xxxx and we will promptly remove this old product from the retailer.”

    Cheers!
     
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  28. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (4,012) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    Like a peel off coupon?

    Nice!:slight_smile:
     
  29. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,636) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
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    LOL
     
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  30. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (1,810) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    No, there’s not much they could do to make me only but their label. Some of the best beers I’ve ever had are small craft beers, the counter to that is some of the worst beers I’ve had has been small craft beers. Macros imo are kinda neutral, they serve a purpose and I like them in their place, but there’s no way in hell they could wow anyone over the age of 15. That said I buy what I like regardless of who what where.
     
  31. stevepat

    stevepat Zealot (598) Mar 12, 2013 California
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    yep, I meant to cite you as the source of that. Seems like the BA could be uniquely positioned to conglomerate these small independent brewers' freshness programs. A central contact point for customers to report out of code beer that may allow the BA to exert some pressure on the worst offending retailers
     
  32. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Poo-Bah (4,012) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
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    At the risk of being a 'downer' - don't hold your breath here. The Brewers Association does not have the intestinal fortitude to take on the effort of improving beer freshness at beer retailers IMO.

    Cheers!

    P.S. I would be delighted to be proven wrong here.
     
  33. bbtkd

    bbtkd Poo-Bah (2,431) Sep 20, 2015 South Dakota
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    Since a useful date is crucial, it should follow stringent standards;
    • Bottling date preceded by "Bottled on". If optional consume-by date is included, it must be preceded by "Consume by"
    • In a standard prominent location.
    • In a standard font in a standard point such as Times-New Roman 10pt bold.
    • Black printed on a white background.
    • In a standard date format such as mm/dd/yy (too bad for Europeans).
    • Solid printing, not dot-matrix.
    This leaves no ambiguity, and ensures readability. Some brewers seem like they don't want consumers to know the bottling date.
     
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  34. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,636) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
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    What I enjoy more is when stores scrape the codes off and place them into the singles section. I see beers there all the time I know have/had dates and magically they are missing. You can walk over to a pack and see the dates same beer a few feet over missing lol.
     
  35. KarlHungus

    KarlHungus Poo-Bah (3,075) Feb 19, 2005 Minnesota

    This exactly. Too many breweries make no mention of the inclusion of lactose on there packaging.
     
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  36. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (1,810) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    Damn, that’s the last time I’d shop that store.
     
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  37. PapaGoose03

    PapaGoose03 Poo-Bah (2,413) May 30, 2005 Michigan
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    Stupid fat fingers! I was trying to say the seal would have the opposite desired effect (of promoting the brewery) if it is the reason for non-sales.

    Edit: the text inside the parenthesis were just added to further clarify my point.
     
  38. AZBeerDude72

    AZBeerDude72 Poo-Bah (1,636) Jun 10, 2016 Arizona
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    It is one of my local grocery stores and a local Total Wine. I was checking out beers I am pretty familiar with and could not find dates. I know they have them and was thinking man this is odd. Checked more and all missing. Seems like the motto is have someone do this, place in singles row, and folks will grab. Its sad the lengths some will go to in order to confuse/mislead paying customers.
    Needless to say I don't buy much beer from them anymore since I am not too thrilled to know this is their practice. Could have been a certain employee and maybe management did not know but that seems weird, I would think it came from someone who is concerned with the bottom line.
     
  39. nc41

    nc41 Poo-Bah (1,810) Sep 25, 2008 North Carolina
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    Wow, that’s just a sad state right there. An employee could care less, only the store manager would give two shits, and would benefit.
     
  40. Bitterbill

    Bitterbill Poo-Bah (6,568) Sep 14, 2002 Wyoming
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    And everyone seems to have their own definition of old. IPAs older than 1or 2 months, hard pass.
     
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