Hill Farmstead Everett Clone

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by koopa, May 28, 2013.

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  1. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    Hey All,

    From the label we know the following:

    This Porter is crafted from American malted barley,
    English and German roasted malts,
    American hops,
    our ale yeast,
    and water from our well.
    It is unfiltered and naturally carbonated.

    Ingredients: Pale, Caramel, and Chocolate Malt, Roasted Barley, Columbus hops; Ale Yeast, and our Well Water.

    21ยบ P
    7.5% ALC/VOL



    So I'm going to take a stab at it with the following 10 gallon recipe I put together:

    76% brewhouse efficiency
    67% mash extraction efficiency (might spike this, but sometimes I get lower extraction with darker grain bills so I usually plan for it and add more sparge water if I'm wrong)

    22# 8oz pale malt (70.9%)
    3# caramel 80 (9.4%) (was also considering 2# c80 + 1# carapils)
    1# 8oz chocolate malt (4.7%)
    1# 8oz roasted barley (4.7%)
    1# 8oz flaked barley (4.7%) (personal choice)
    1# 12oz lactose (5.5%)
    3oz columbus @ 30 minutes (46 ibu's)

    1.087 OG
    1.031 FG
    7.45 abv
    WLP002 English Ale Yeast (since I don't have fresh HF dregs)

    Mash around 154F
    90 minute boil

    RO water with salt additions that favor a malt forward flavor profile.

    Thoughts?
     
    #1 koopa, May 28, 2013
  2. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    I want lots of body, a smooth mouthfeel, a strong chocolate presence, and just the right amount of lactose to soften the roasty edge.

    Some things I was considering and would love to get some feedback on:

    1. Do you think I should go with the 3# of C80, or 2# of C80 + 1# of carapils?
    2. Instead of C80, should I go with 3# of C60 or 2# of C60 + 1# of carapils?
    3. Am I adding too much chocolate malt? Maybe I should dial it back to 1# instead?
    4. Should I maybe reduce the flaked barley to 1# and add 1# of flaked oats as well?
     
    #2 koopa, May 28, 2013
  3. brewsader

    brewsader Initiate (0) Dec 7, 2012 New York

    having only had this beer twice, i can't consider myself a source of profound insight on the recipe itself but I can tell you that HF's water is a large part of why their beer tastes and feels like it does. i would see if you can get an actual profile, as "malt-forward" water might not be crisp enough for what you're looking for.
     
    #3 brewsader, May 28, 2013
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  4. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    Hill Farmsteads water is fairly soft and they add brewing salts to it. So the local water profile is useless and the treated water profile isn't disclosed. No offense, but there is nothing "crisp" about the mouthfeel of Everett (it's silky smooth, borderline creamy, and has a fairly thick body).
     
    #4 koopa, May 29, 2013
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  5. quirkzoo

    quirkzoo Initiate (0) Jul 7, 2011 Colorado

    Very inexperienced opinion here but I would go with:

    2# C80 + 1# carapils

    I brewed Janet's Brown and really liked what carapils brought to the mouthfeel. I have only had Everett once but I feel like the mouthfeel is what really sets that beer apart. My understanding is that carapils will help build up that body that you are looking for.
     
    #5 quirkzoo, May 29, 2013
  6. barfdiggs

    barfdiggs Initiate (0) Mar 22, 2011 California


    Lactose will help with creamyness, which is something I remember being a distinct trait of this beer. You could pick up some creamyness with the flaked barley, but its grainy flavor contribution may be out of place (although at 8 oz, might not be noticeable).

    I don't get much pruniness from this brew, but I do get a definite burnt sugar & caramel flavor so C80 seems reasonable to me. From IPA by Mitch Steele he seems to use a lot of different caramalts in his beers, so might not want to limit it to just one, maybe a touch of caravienne for a little extra sweetness/maltyness.

    From memory its very clean, super malty with a restrained roast that comes across as big time chocolate and a touch of coffee. That being said, you could drop the roasted barley to 3% and make up the difference in chocolate malt.

    Malty dark water profile with some pickling lime or baking soda to offset some of the dark grain acidity (to hit proper mash pH, maybe toward the more basic end of the spectrum) might help, as I remember this beer not having much acidity, which is in contrast to a lot of the commercial robust porters I've had.

    Don't remember much of an ester profile, so maybe ferment pretty cold with a d-rest, although maybe someone else who's had this more recently could comment.
     
    #6 barfdiggs, May 29, 2013
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  7. brewsader

    brewsader Initiate (0) Dec 7, 2012 New York

    i guess compared to my water it's a bit "crisp." and are you sure they add brewing salts to it for this particular beer? having sipped their water at the brewery in between samples, i could tell it had a unique character that was reflected in the beer.
     
    #7 brewsader, May 29, 2013
  8. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    I'm not sure of anything they do water wise other than when Mr. Hill mentioned in an online article that he favored calcium chloride over gypsum for his hoppy beers.

    Did that unique character of the water you picked up on in the beer taste anything like allure by chance? :wink:
     
    #8 koopa, May 29, 2013
  9. Drucifer

    Drucifer Initiate (0) Apr 16, 2012 Illinois

    I remember seeing somewhere that the IBUs on this beer are in the 20s, but I could be mistaken. Also, to finish at 1.031 I would expect this thing to have a high percentage of unfermentable malts.
     
    #9 Drucifer, May 29, 2013
  10. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    RECIPE UPDATE: Eliminated the flaked barley, raised the chocolate, lowered the roasted barley, and lowered the ibu's. I like that I have equal parts caramel malt to dark malts (9% to 9%) and I'm guessing it's a good platform to allow the lactose to add that sweet touch to the flavor profile. Thanks again to everybody for the suggestions and considerations contributed so far!

    76% brewhouse efficiency
    67% mash extraction efficiency (might spike this, but sometimes I get lower extraction with darker grain bills so I usually plan for it and add more sparge water if I'm wrong)

    pale malt (76.7%)
    caramel 80 (9.0%)
    chocolate malt (6.0%)
    roasted barley (3.0%)
    lactose (5.3%)

    2oz columbus @ 30 minutes (31 ibu's)

    1.087 OG
    1.031 FG
    7.45 abv
    WLP002 English Ale Yeast (since I don't have fresh HF dregs)

    Mash around 154F
    90 minute boil

    RO water with salt additions that favor a malt forward flavor profile.
     
    #10 koopa, May 29, 2013
  11. Keyes88

    Keyes88 Zealot (634) Jul 19, 2011 New Jersey

    That's a lot of chocolate. A little bit goes a long ways.
     
    #11 Keyes88, May 29, 2013
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  12. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    I was typing my last reply while you posted this. I actually lowered the ibu's to 39 (from 46) and was wondering if I should go lower. I know the 9% dark malts will add some bitterness and the sweet lactose and chocolate flavors are very up front on this beer. So you might be onto something here with the ibu rating being much lower. I think when I initially decided on 3oz of columbus at 30 minutes for 46 ibu's, it was because that was towards the high end of the robust porter style range. Reflecting on what I tasted when I drank a growler of Everett last month, I didn't notice much of a hop bitterness jumping out of that malty milky deliciousness. I'll knock it down to 2oz of columbus at 30 minutes for 31 ibu's. I might even make it 1.5oz at 60 minutes to reduce hop "flavor" a bit.

    As for the unfermentables, yes the lactose, the caramel malt, the dark malts, the 154F mash temperature, and the low attenuating yeast should get me there.
     
    #12 koopa, May 29, 2013
  13. brewsader

    brewsader Initiate (0) Dec 7, 2012 New York


    that makes a lot of sense. i just remember being there and thinking "this water tastes just like the beer, minus the hop, malt and yeast characteristics..."

    ^^nailed it.
     
    #13 brewsader, May 29, 2013
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  14. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    RECIPE UPDATE 2: dialed back the chocolate malt and ibu's a bit more

    76% brewhouse efficiency
    67% mash extraction efficiency (might spike this, but sometimes I get lower extraction with darker grain bills so I usually plan for it and add more sparge water if I'm wrong)

    pale malt (78.2%)
    caramel 80 (9.0%)
    chocolate malt (4.5%)
    roasted barley (3.0%)
    lactose (5.3%)
    1oz columbus @ 60 minutes (28.5 ibu's)

    1.087 OG
    1.031 FG
    7.45 abv
    WLP002 English Ale Yeast (since I don't have fresh HF dregs)

    Mash around 154F
    90 minute boil

    RO water with salt additions that favor a malt forward flavor profile.
     
    #14 koopa, May 29, 2013
  15. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    Have you checked your mash pH? If that's good, the only other thing I can think of to explain lower mash efficiency with darker grain bills would be erroneous (high) assumptions about theoretical maximum yield (i.e. PPG) for one or more of the darker grains. (I'm assuming your darker grain bills are not also Bigger grain bills.)
     
    #15 VikeMan, May 29, 2013
  16. BearsOnAcid

    BearsOnAcid Pooh-Bah (2,239) Mar 17, 2009 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    Maybe it's just me but Ive always found this beer to be somewhat hoppy. Maybe there is some dry hopping involved? I know it's been said the finishing gravity is somewhat the same as ten fidy. That's like 1.032ish?? The caramel malt is used heavy handedly. I'm not sure about using lactose. Maybe more grain and a hotter mash?
     
    #16 BearsOnAcid, May 29, 2013
  17. VikeMan

    VikeMan Grand Pooh-Bah (3,067) Jul 12, 2009 Pennsylvania
    Pooh-Bah

    [​IMG]
     
    #17 VikeMan, May 29, 2013
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  18. Keyes88

    Keyes88 Zealot (634) Jul 19, 2011 New Jersey

    Any updates on this?
     
    #18 Keyes88, Aug 1, 2013
  19. koopa

    koopa Initiate (0) Apr 20, 2008 New Jersey

    Not yet sorry. Probably won't brew it until next month.
     
    #19 koopa, Aug 1, 2013
  20. brewtechnik

    brewtechnik Crusader (468) Aug 31, 2011 New Hampshire
    Trader

    Just curious about the lactose addition...why add additional body (sweetness) to a 1.030+ finishing beer??
     
    #20 brewtechnik, Aug 10, 2013
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