VSS and BA Speedway release

Who fucking cares if its illegal. I'm not on this site much but the last two days all I see is you bitching about growler prices and complaining about the reselling of beer. Why the fuck do you care? I realize that this is a site dedicated to the discussion of beer but why take the contrarian view on every if not most things. It just seems pointless.

 

I've been to Del Mesa several times, the guys there are always pretty cool. Prices on majority of stuff is similar to other shops. The only times I have seen prices above other retailers, is when they have a release that everyone else is sold out of. Not sure about everyone else, but I don't mind paying a bit more to grab a bottle that I can't find elsewhere.

As far as the reselling of beer being illegal, I was certainly not aware. But then again, I always gift my friends beer and they donate money to me out of the goodness of their heart.

 

To be fair, the two or three times I've sent them an email/Facebook message asking a question, they sent an answer very soon, and were nice about it. And I do have to admit that when I saw the Parabola at 30 or so bucks, it was a few weeks after its release. I also like the fact that their beer basement seems to be around 60 degrees. Still, they should be careful what they broadcast, and when they do so. Email lists might be a little safer, if you get my drift.

 

Just fired off an e-mail ask about the legality of selling brewery only/non-distributed beers and selling beers not distributed to CA. I may or may not have given some examples of places. I also asked if this is even something they bother with or is a concern for them. No point in reporting places if ABC couldn't care less.

 

Based on my past experiences, I have serious doubts that government bureaucrats read anything you send them in any form.

 

Diana is super responsive. I've emailed her a bunch, as well as the primary ABC contact people. You will likely get a response in the next 48 hours.

Which is why all of this brewery and retail confusion is a big joke. People in the industry claiming ignorance are lazy fucks.

FWIW, this may help some people regarding the three tier system in California:

http://www.cbbd.com/threetier_drives.html

 

I got a response, but I had some follow up questions. I will see if things are cleared up and post their summarizedresponses.

 

Not trying to be ignorant but what about when a brewery directly drops off their beer to the retailer?

 

So the first response I got was: A licensed beer manufacturer in the State of California can sell their beer directly to retailers.

However, this does not exactly address the situation we are in, as Del Mesa bought this beer as a regular Joe and then sold it through their store. In other words Alesmith did not sell Del Mesa any bottles, they sold John Doe some bottles. I asked for clarification on this and on reselling Reserve society only beers. In addition, it sounds like selling any non-CA/non-distributed beer is completely against the law (hmmm, wonder if they will stop by some of the places I might have mentioned as examples of this?).

 

So it doesnt have to pass through the three tier system for them to legally sell it. I was just curious because I know Green Flash directly dropped off Silva Stout and Sleepin with Shaggy. Mother Earth self distributes along with Aztec. That link made it seem as if they werent supposed to do that.

 

The brewery acts as the distributor in some cases, so it's still compliant with the three tier system.

As to the other question, I'm not sure about retailers buying direct from the brewery, but they definitely cannot buy from another retailer.

35. Retail-to-Retail Sales
Retail licensees may not purchase alcohol for resale from another retail licensee. Licensees must
purchase alcohol for resale from a non-retail licensee only. Warehouse-type discount stores are
licensed retailers, and they cannot sell alcohol for resale to other retailers. For example, a retail
licensed store may not sell to the bar down the street who has run out of a certain brand of liquor.
It would be illegal for both the store and the bar to do so. The borrowing of alcohol between
retail licensees is an illegal, retail-to-retail sale.
Exception:
A licensee who has three or more
outlets licensed exactly the same may transfer products between that licensee’s stores.

Also, type
21 licensees may sell distilled spirits for resale to the holder of a Daily On-Sale General license.
(Sec. 23402 B&P)
http://www.abc.ca.gov/FORMS/ABC608.pdf

 

I think that the relevant issue here is whether or not there's a legal distinction between a sale that is available to the public and a sale that is not available to the public. The fact that John Doe Employee acts as a proxy or middleman in the sale is not necessarily (although might be) relevant since John Doe Employee is essentially just an agent of the retailer.

 

re·tail

/ˈrēˌtāl/
Noun
The sale of goods to the public for use or consumption rather than for resale.

I'm fairly certain Alesmith released these bottles with the intent they would be consumed not resold. If the ABC acts on the information/examples nanobrew provided I don't see it going well for those stores. I doubt the stores "middleman" declared they were purchasing the beers for resale. I'll grab my popcorn and enjoy now

 

What the dictionary says may or may not be relevant. What is certainly relevant is legal distinction.

 

thanks for the reminder to add another comment on FB linking alesmith, for some reason I was not able to link them when i was on my phone during the first few comments.

 

Given that we don’t have an expert on alcohol distribution here, we’re operating on a lot of assumptions, like that Retailer could have received the bottles directly from Alesmith (meaning, if Alesmith wanted to let a retailer sell bottles of VSS or BASS, it could simply sell them to the store for resale directly as a distributor). Assuming that’s true, what I would imagine is important to know is whether it actually matters whether Alesmith sells alcohol to Retailer in a specific context (as part of a distribution deal vs. a retail sale). Alesmith’s subjective intent isn’t necessarily something that matters because the law may merely say retailer has to receive the alcohol from someone it can lawfully be received from, which as we’re assuming above, Alesmith is.

It wouldn't surprise me in the least if the drafters of the law and/or any amendments allowing direct sales never even conceived of a situation in which a retailer could receive product from the distributor in a retail context (since normally, the distributor is insulated from the retail side).

 

well I got called a troll again, but it looks like they got rid of the comment. I know they are on BA as they referenced this thread and my comments. I don't think they know the definition of a troll. Someone who questions a company and states their displeasure is not a troll.

I am not a fan of places buying up these limited bottles and then selling them. They are trying to make extra cash by being a middleman (like ticket scalping companies) and trying to draw in business by advertising beers they know they shouldn't have.

To Del Mesa:

I do not buy this "we are trying to help our customers" bullshit. No you are not, you are trying to make money and get attention. These beers were announced in advance, they were put on sale in a easy to get way, and they were made available for pickup for an extended period. If one of your customers could not have picked up this beer within over the month period at Alesmith, how are they going to be able to stop by before your few bottles sell out? Please, Del Mesa BM or respond here, I will leave your FB account alone.

Also, to answer your questions (below), you said you are selling them to customers in one of your other comments. You hinted towards up selling for $10 when I asked what you were selling them for. And you are the one who posted them on your facebook page for all of your customers to see. I am not sure what ABC or Alesmith will have to say, hence why I asked them.

their comment that I am not seeing now:

Del Mesa Liquor wrote: "What I'm curious about is why you are still trolling, Brian? Do you see a for sale sign? A price sticker? Any statement that says this is available to all my customers? You think AleSmith is going to cut me off for posting a picture of their beer? And you really think ABC gives a fuck and will impose legal action over me posting a picture of a beer? I know at BeerAdvocate you thought I would delete this post but the reason I left it up is that so everyone there can click on the link you posted and see that it's all good over here. Judging by some of the responses, I'd say we're not doing too bad."

 

Wow with that response, I would make it my mission to find ways to bring them trouble....

 

He isn't doing himself any favors by this approach. I suspect we won't see this on their shelves, though - it will be one of those speakeasy things now.

 

Why does seemingly every thread on here devolve into finger-pointing and butthurt?