VSS and BA Speedway release

Right, so the basic rules of supply and demand don't work on "beer nerds." I'll keep that in mind for the future.

Let me add that I think I misunderstood what you meant by "taking beers out of the market and putting them back at markup." I merely meant that pricing beer at whatever price you want is legal. Its certainly not legal to just buy beer at retail and resell.

Not sure what you mean by ticket scalping being illegal in a lot of ways. As far as I am aware, scalping is only illegal in California is if you attempt to sell it for higher than face value at the site itself.

 

Really? Enlighten us, and if you are game, let us know your credentials while you are at it.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand

You don't need credentials to know that increasing the price of an elastic good (which beer certainly is) reduces demand. This is literally week 1 econ 101 stuff.

 

This so overly simplifies the situation that it is laughable. To start, a controlled substance is *not* an elastic good. But I probably digress.

The problem here isn't that there is too much demand for BA Speedway; the problem is that there are rules laid out for how it gets distributed, and there are people that choose not to follow the rules. People that choose to follow rules often get pissed off that people that don't. If DelMesaLiquorGuy doesn't like the rules, he should change them, not choose to ignore them.

 

What in the bloody hell are you on about? I was referring to the statement that increasing the price from $30 to $75 wouldn't change the demand, when it very, very obviously would. Also whether or not a substance is controlled has 0 bearing on its being elastic or inelastic. Elastic means "sensitive to price changes" which beer consumption demonstrably is.

 

To answer your first question, I guess I was following your post to its natural conclusion, which was "they should make more BASS or raise its price". That is a very loose definition of "elastic", too.

Sorry if you think I sound antagonistic. When people say "bla bla bla 101", it hits on one of my red buttons.

 

That's not the natural conclusion of anything I've said.

And that really is econ 101. It's about as "101" as anything will ever get.

 

Well, then - let me ask you this. Let's say that Alesmith raised the price of BASS to $50/bottle. Would they still sell out? Certainly. Is BASS elastic in that range?

But now, let's say that because they've raised the price, a few locals don't buy the bottle, but a ticker from LA does. No problem, right? Well, maybe that local used to go to the tasting room 2 or 3 times a week, spending at least 10 bucks every time they go. They stop going, because they feel abandoned by Alesmith. That ticker buys the bottle, but are they loyal customers otherwise? Does this increase in price of the BASS increase or decrease the net revenue?

 

Can you really say with certainty that it would sell out? You really don't know that.

You also don't know this. It's just a bunch of speculation.

Finally, I continue to be goddamn baffled by your replies to me. I never once said that increasing the price would make Alesmith more money, I never once said that they should do it, I never said anything about locals. Stop putting words into my mouth, stop arguing against straw men, just stop it.

 

It would, unquestionably. At 35 bucks a bottle, it sold out in an hour or two.

As far as being baffled by my responses to you, it ain't a straw man when somebody else in the same thread actually makes the suggestion: http://beeradvocate.com/community/threads/vss-and-ba-speedway-release.106115/page-8#post-1610600

If you want to whine about misattribution, fine. But when you make an "Econ 101" post that is remarkably similar to somebody else's point, you really shouldn't be surprised if people are assuming you are making the same point.

 

I don't agree with mules or reselling limited/brewery only releases. But I do think the 3 tier system is bullshit and having to pay a markup to a distributer who is owned by BMC is a shitty option.

 

There is probably still a huge market for BASS at $50 even in San Diego. If there wasn't these stores wouldn't be spending their resources getting them and those that did would lose a lot of money doing it and it wouldn't be a problem for long. But would there be a market for BASS at $1,000? Probably a few bottle would be sold but not many. So there is a price point that exists.

Alesmith probably might have to worry about losing some customers who feel abandoned but it could gain some from those who couldn't get out of a 10 AM meeting the day it went on sale. It would get those that bought at grey market stores. Or maybe Alesmith uses the extra $20 a bottle and puts it back into their BA program and makes more BASS the next time or a new product which is popular and expands their base with that product.

My question is why does everyone here want to see the grey market disappear?
Is it simply because it's illegal and the law should be followed to a T? If that's the case I hope no one here speeds or talks on their cell phone while driving. At least with those laws have a good reason and lives are endangered.
Is it because it's taking beers out of the hands of "the fans"? People who are dropping $50+ on a bottle of Speedway Stout are obviously still fans.
Is it to level the playing field for those bottle shops which don't sell bottle illegally? If that's the case wouldn't dropping the secondary distribution laws level the playing field just as equally?
Or is it simply because it limits our chance to get one below what would be the value of the beer on the free market as we have grown accustomed to?

 

Perhaps somebody could explain something to me concerning Alesmith. I don't pay much more for their beers at Whole Paycheck that I would picking them up at the brewery. So, are they marking them up on the premises, or are they using a lower cost approach to getting the beers to the stores?

Thank you - I'll hang up and listen.

 

"Whole Paycheck" has the best pricing on beers I've seen. Seems kinda funny that you'd reference one of the cheapest sources for craft beer out there as Whole Paycheck. That said, WF likely uses their craft beer as a loss leader. I'm sure they get great prices for the volume they purchase across their entire chain, but the prices are ridiculous. We pay $21 for a bottle of Bois at WF, and that's after a 3000+ mile trip from the west coast to the east coast
. It was $24 for Hoarders Society Members, and that's after a 20% membership discount, and before having to pay shipping to get it here.

 

Irony is my name. It's more of an old joke than anything, and you are probably dead on with the loss leader point.

Still: $21 for Bois? I know we were close to $30 at ours. Grrrrr...

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_good

 

To me it's two things. It's what you listed above, and it's pricing. I won't go into a huge diatribe about it, but retailers pulling this kind of shit drives up prices. Yes, so does the hoarder mentality. It's a pain in the ass for those of us who actually like to drink our beer and don't immediately flip it for walez bro. It's no secret I'm a cheapass and would rather have American beer priced similarly to Germany or Belgium (even if I have no idea why the beer is cheaper there.)

Breweries sell their beer at huge discounts to distributors. As much as 50 or 60% off the price you see at the brewery. The distributors get to then turn around and sell it to retail outlets at a markup, which is often lower than the consumer price at the brewery itself. Retailers can then raise the price as they see fit. Beer can be cheaper in other states due to taxes, too. Deschutes beer is regularly cheaper here in California than up in Bend.

 

Crazy thing is its been brought to theis attention as a pricing error several times and they maintain it's the correct price. They've restocked the shelves with it a few times already. It's actually amazing how long it hangs out on the shelf for.

 

How many times are you turds going to argue about the same tired sh#t?

Good lord.

 

I see a lot of different topics being covered in this arguerant - you must be too lazy to read through all of them (or, maybe, have a real life ).