Churchill's Anny 2014

How about everyone just follow this rule:

Don't be fucking drunk, entitled asshole and we'll all be fine.

 

That is exactly my point. I don't think there is anything wrong with camping out in front of a bar. It is the beer drinking in line that I think is out of place.
You seem to think that if you are allowed to be in line for beer, you should be able to drink some while waiting. And that a "beer geek" or "beer nerd" or whatever you call yourself, can't be trusted to stay in line without pulling a growler out of your jacket to pour someone a taste.
Is it fair to say that you simply think that the rewards of bottle sharing outweigh the consequences? Because that make more sense to me than "well, we are all here for beer right?" or "hey it's their fault cuz if they wanted, they could do BPT, cheers!" or the "do you speed?" lol!
I get it, I like beer too. But I just think that people in line should be expected to act like adults and have some restraint.

 

If you are of legal drinking age, you are not a little kid anymore. If you know you aren't supposed to drink while waiting in line, and you can't resist the temptation, don't bring any beer. This is not difficult.

There is nothing inevitable about a bottleshare. It happens because people make a conscious decision to do what they want to do, even if it is illegal.

 

If your problem with drinking in line is that it's against the law, and you don't like to break the law, then fine. I get it. I mean, I don't really, but I at least understand your argument.

But if you're ok with speeding because it's a harmless crime, then why do you care if folks have a few drinks in line overnight? I get that some people get too drunk and are obnoxious, etc - though I honestly don't see that much at shorter line-shares. Not sure how drinking a bottle or two would make me less of an adult?

 

if you are a business with an license to sell alcohol, if there are people drinking within 100 feet from your establishment, you are responsible for that, and its illegal. so thats why the bottle sharing isn't okay, its an issue with his license and it could get revoked if a cop decided to come and act upon it.

 

It's not that I think drinking in line makes you less adult. It's the reasons people give to justify it. And I really don't care all that much, outside of reading and replying on this thread.
If you say that since I speed while driving I shouldn't care about people drinking in line, then that's what I mean about not being adult like.

 

There is a difference between speeding and drinking in line.

If a person gets caught drinking in line the consequences are dealt with by:
A) The offender (open container or drunk in public ticket)
B) The establishment (fines, or even the loss of liquor license resulting in the end of Churchill's)
C) The patrons of the establishment

If a person gets caught speeding the consequences are dealt with by:
A) The offender

The city where the speeding took place isn't responsible and if too many people get caught speeding it doesn't lead to the closure of the street or freeway. Other people can still use it.

Yes, speeding can lead to accidents but so can drinking in line. I'm just talking about non-injury legal consequences that are likely to happen.

 

Some of us know who Ryan is, and all of us know what a growler looks like.
I agree with you on the little kid reference.
Ryan said that he didn't care about this issue because he wasn't lining up this year. But I say he didn't care when he did line up last year.
And like you said, many people don't care about the possible consequences, and I'm not saying they have to. They can say "I will bring and /or share beer in line in spite of what can happen to me or Churchills" and they would be very honest people.
Again, what I think is immature, is the reasons some bottle sharers give to justify what they do. They blame Churchills for selling bottles the way they do, or they say "you brake laws, why do care man?"
So I ask once more, is it that the rewards of bottle sharing outweigh the consequences?

 

People keep bringing this up in the thread. Can you please point me to cases where the business was fined because someone was loitering on it with alcohol not sold from the establishment?

Are you telling me it's as easy to shut down a bar/bottle shop I don't like as paying some bums to go drink 40s in front of it?

 

The rewards probably do outweigh the consequences (at least he likelihood of the having any consequences) or people wouldn't do it.

The chances someone gets in trouble are very small and for the person who does get in trouble the consequences aren't great. Considering how much time people spend in line and how much more enjoyable it is to drink good beer I would say that for most the rewards outweigh the consequences.

That being said, I wouldn't do it because I am afraid of getting in trouble.

 

Here, I got curious and went and looked it up. Subject to city ordinances of course, which I didn't bother with.

Source: http://www.abc.ca.gov/questions/enforcement_faq.html#Q. 62.

So two things. 1st, encouraging hundred of people to line up in the wee hours of the morning threatens to fall into the disorderly house scenario - though as written it certainly seems worded more for repeat offenders.

2nd, I think the "upon notice" is a big part of nuisance conditions. I.e. if I line up in line at 2:30AM, crack a beer and get busted for it while all employees/owners of the bar are asleep, they're not responsible.

Again, if there are examples out there to the contrary, I'd love to see them.

 

I think you're pretty much spot on with all that you wrote.

 

That's a fair point, my issue is really just with people using Ivan's release method as a cover for bottlesharing after he asked people not to. In a perfect world, he'd find a way to release the bottles that didn't require lining up and rewarded his regulars, yet still dovetailed with the anniversary event. It seems like he's at least exploring BPT, which is a step in the right direction.

And that's where it has the real potential to cause a problem, as a police officer would probably be fairly confused by several dozen people sitting in a parking lot at 4 AM passing beers around. At best, the officer is incredibly cool and overlooks it. At worst, they hand out open container citations like candy, tell the crowd to disperse, and it leads to some very uncomfortable issues for Ivan to deal with, as well as a general negative outlook towards craft bars and breweries from local law enforcement and governments. Licensing issues are already hard enough for new breweries, the SDPD/SDSD don't need further ammunition.

Agreed, and ultimately we're arguing towards the same goal in different ways. I hope that I'm just being overly pessimistic.

 

Actions speak louder than words. If he didn't have a problem with it, he'd figure out a way to eliminate the line. Dozens of places in San Diego have figured it out; if he hasn't he either is too stubborn to go that route, or he likes the hype and just is giving lip service (as Xul speculated).

As for San Marcos, if their restaurant revenues that weekend are significantly higher than they are on a normal weekend, they likely are telling the police to not do anything as long as there are no fights breaking out.

 

That's not what I said. I said that he probably realizes people are going to do as they please, so he may as well make a CYA effort. There's a huge difference between condoning it and accepting the fact that he has limited means to control everyone's behavior.

1) The San Diego Sheriff's Department services San Marcos, so the law enforcement exists at a county level, not a city level. I'm sure there's communication, but I doubt it extends to the level of telling the sheriffs department to look the other way because of a marginal increase in tax revenue for the weekend.
2) You're far more optimistic than I am about how patient a deputy will be if they get called to a parking lot because of a disturbance and find 50 - 100 people sitting there drinking. Seriously, this is the same county where law enforcement will give you a ticket if they catch you sitting or walking on the beach with an open beer, minding your own business, and you think they'll just look the other way if they get called out to the parking lot at 4 AM?

 

You people take life too serious.

 

This may be the root of the problem. It is only beer.

 

I take it too seriously, myself.

[snicker]

 

I hope the beer lineup turns out to be just as good as this thread... My God.