What's Up w/ Pliny?

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by chipawayboy, Apr 20, 2014.

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  1. OPJohn

    OPJohn Initiate (0) Oct 5, 2013 Florida

    You make my point for me. BTW, I've recently acquired some Thomas Hardy and that has to be a top 3 lifetime beer for me.

    Probably not IMHO. I've had it as fresh as I can get it (apparently not fresh enough for some but meh) and I think it's an over-hyped beer. It has no flaws, but the several dozen times i've had it, it also had very little character. I prefer Blind Pig to Pliny. I prefer heady topper and white oak jai alai to those and actually prefer my own house brewed IPA with conan yeast to all of them.
     
    #121 OPJohn, Jun 10, 2014
  2. chipawayboy

    chipawayboy Pooh-Bah (2,181) Oct 26, 2007 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    OP u r makin' my point too. You acknowldge hop character changes starting the day it leaves the bright tank. For the real big boys -- it drops off rapidly. If you have one week old HT in your tasting session/knitting circle -- don't you think it would rank higher when compared to other brews vice it being 3 months old? I understand it's impossilble get all super fresh IPAs/DIPAs all the time (although my Cali source has been consistently getting me HT/Alpine/Noble/Beachwood HBs that are all under 10 days old) -- but the rapid drop off in hop character makees side by sde tasting/comparison of beers from 1 week to 3 months old pointless. Seriously though -- 3 Month old HT or ZD or 2XS? That IS drain pour material.
     
    #122 chipawayboy, Jun 10, 2014
  3. Roguer

    Roguer Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,811) Mar 25, 2013 Connecticut
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    No, not according to John Kimmich. Hoppier doesn't necessarily mean better. There's no argument that the hops will start to fade, but there's also no argument that brewers anticipate that people are not drinking right out of the tank. There's a distribution network - a lot of it, unfortunately, likely unrefrigerated. If they didn't expect that you're not pouring it into your gullet the day it's bottled or canned, then they, as brewers, failed. Period.

    That doesn't mean it doesn't degrade; it does. That doesn't mean that 3 month old PtE is somehow better than 3 week old PtE; it isn't.

    But 3-month old Heady Topper = drain pour? Others might be making your point for you....but that's because someone has to. 3 month old HT is delicious, and anyone who thinks it deserves a drain pour doesn't deserve to have Heady at any age, at all.
     
    #123 Roguer, Jun 10, 2014
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  4. Roguer

    Roguer Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,811) Mar 25, 2013 Connecticut
    Mod Team Society Pooh-Bah Trader

    I have the great fortune to occasionally get my hands on a bottle of PtE, courtesy of a generous CA BA. Trying it always fresh, but always shipped cross-country, and only every couple months or so, here's what I've noticed:

    Is every bottle the same? No. The first PtE I ever had was phenomenal; it remains my only perfect 5.0s across the board. Is it always, every time, that perfect beer? No; no beer can, in fact, especially a hop-forward beer shipped cross-country. Sometimes I'm *gasp* a little disappointed.

    Know what? The PtE I downed this afternoon was beautiful, a great reminder of just how good this beer really can be.

    So, does it change that much each time? Personally, I doubt it. (Refer to the Enjoy By threads if you really want to see people complain about monthly "recipe changes.") I would blame the week or so it spends un-refrigerated, plus my own palate and experiences, for any perceived "disappointment."

    If you think your palate, and your personal perceptions, have zero effect on your enjoyment of a beer, then I - and the rest of the world, really - have nothing for you. You live in a different world, with different rules, than everyone else. (That's not directed at anyone in particular, for the record.)
     
    #124 Roguer, Jun 10, 2014
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  5. musicman7070

    musicman7070 Initiate (0) Aug 26, 2012 New Jersey

    That's pretty much spot on, with what I was thinking. It's probably the most close to perfect IPA/DIPA that I've ever consumed.
     
    #125 musicman7070, Jun 10, 2014
  6. Stevedore

    Stevedore Grand Pooh-Bah (5,096) Nov 16, 2012 Oregon
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Last time I was in LA to visit family (January), I had a 5-day old Pliny out of the bottle and it was as good as I remember it from 2 years ago. I think people are just looking for certain characteristics that have gotten more popular lately in this particular subgroup of the craft beer community.
     
    #126 Stevedore, Jun 10, 2014
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  7. chipawayboy

    chipawayboy Pooh-Bah (2,181) Oct 26, 2007 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah Trader

    Truth be told -- I've never drain poured an HT. That over embellishment was not necessary. I will say I much prefer a fresh HT to one that is not. I've been fortunate to have it in my fridge constantly for the last 2 and a half years.
     
    #127 chipawayboy, Jun 11, 2014
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  8. cavedave

    cavedave Grand Pooh-Bah (4,157) Mar 12, 2009 New York
    In Memoriam Pooh-Bah Trader

    Time to drink it don't you think? :slight_smile:
     
    #128 cavedave, Jun 11, 2014
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  9. OPJohn

    OPJohn Initiate (0) Oct 5, 2013 Florida

    This.

    Also this. We all can't be fortunate enough to drink from the brite tank. I can remember one of the episodes of Can You Brew It with Jamil Zainasheff back in the day when they took on Lagunitas's Brown Shugga'. They had it on good authority (basically, straight from the brewer's mouth) on the right ratio of hops for an 'x' sized batch (beer brewing is scaleable, so really all you need is a percentage of the ingredients in the grain bill to brew whatever sized batch you want) straight from Lagunitas themselves.

    So, they brew it, and then they have the good fortune of being able to have the brewers of Lagunitas themselves evaluate the clone. They were worried that it tasted way way too hoppy and believed that they hadn't successfully cloned the beer. They were worried and a little embarrassed to present the beer to the Lagunitas crew because they felt like they hadn't gotten the flavor properly as it was too bitter and hop forward.

    That's when the Lagunitas brewers told them, nope. This is what it tastes like right before it goes into the bottles for distribution. They had the cloned recipe dialed in perfectly without understanding the extra hops were necessary for the average shelf life of their beers.

    Basically, it comes down to that. It's incredibly lucky for a brewery to have a whale. Especially a whale that's in demand across an entire region (much less nationally). The rest have to contend with shelf life and the sweet spot for a lot of IPA's that brewers would prefer you consume their beers in is within three to six months.
     
    #129 OPJohn, Jun 11, 2014
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  10. Jewmagic151

    Jewmagic151 Aspirant (289) May 31, 2013 Kansas

    Chillwave, hop slam, enjoy by, dirt wolf, ruinten, any pipeworks dipa!, hoptologist, can't name 10 true double IPAs without getting into imperials. And I do agree Pliny is not very balanced and very carbonated! Great beer but it's a perfect example of hard to get making it higher rated than the actual taste! Outside of Cali good luck getting Pliny unless u have a good trader
     
    #130 Jewmagic151, Jun 12, 2014
  11. norcalhophead

    norcalhophead Initiate (0) Jan 28, 2010 Wisconsin

    Was at the brewpub last Thursday and Pliny tasted like it always does - on draft it is such a drinkable DIPA with so much character & balance. For those of you that haven't to the brewpub in Santa Rosa, it's like going to see an NBA game at the old Boston Garden - the MECCA!
     
    #131 norcalhophead, Jun 12, 2014
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  12. Crash_Hop

    Crash_Hop Initiate (0) May 2, 2014 Illinois

    Wouldn't a NBA game at an old MECCA be Milwaukee?
     
    #132 Crash_Hop, Jun 12, 2014
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