USA #1 in beer?

This is ignoring one very important factor that many people (a couple of whom have already posted in this thread) consider to be a country's specifically appealing attribute in regards to beer...the environment.

England's pubs
Germany's biergartens
Belgium's cafes
America's...?

The beer-drinking culture of the countries listed is something very near and dear to some people's hearts (not to get too nostalgic).

 

I think what rollom (and I) is/are saying is that perhaps the best measurement of a nation's brewing greatness is the viability (and to a degree, longevity) of its overall beer culture. This would include some of the things you mention (# of breweries per citizen, beer consumption per capita, traditions, geography, agriculture, etc.) The U.S. has been at a major disadvantage here historically, owing primarily to Prohibition. But the nascent "craft" culture of the last 30 or so years has made major strides and contributed some new, potentially world-class styles -- as well as a "take on the world" mentality that, while having led to some spectacular failures, has also produced some great successes. Where the U.S. falls short still is in the overall viability of "craft" within the greater culture; we are still very much a nation dominated by the macros. And while there are pockets of culture in places such as Portland, San Diego, Asheville, and, perhaps SE PA, where the majority of beer consumed could be considered "craft," these are still (very) few and far between. In such cases, our sheer geographical size and diversity might necessarily prevent the development of a single/central beer culture like you find in Europe (UK: pub culture; Belgium: cafe culture; Germany: tavern/beer garden culture; Czech Rep.: beer hall/tavern culture). So IMO it will take a while for our "typically American," variegated beer culture landscape to develop and mature. But we are well on our way.

EDIT: meant to add that once a place has achieved its fullest potential given all of the above variables, the factors that went into that are so different that comparing the resultant cultures in terms of a "contest" makes basically no sense (as LambicPentameter pointed out below).

 

In the sense that beer is a product, then yes, it's always a competition to some degree. But I see two issues with that philosophy:

1) The concept of leading a market isn't really a simple one, at which your subsequent response hints. You can lead in overall production, in production per capita, revenue generated, revenue generated per capita, revenue generated per unit sold... and then there's the whole notion of market segmentation to complicate things futher (not to mention the trickiness of defining craft beer in the first place). Craft beer is a segment of beer, which is a segment of alcoholic beverages, which is a segment of beverages, which is a segment of food & drink. Even craft beer can be sub-segmented, depending on brewery size and types of beer, brewing traditions. I don't bring this up because soft drinks have anything to do with becoming #1 in beer, per se, but to point out that it's just too multifaceted of a topic (imho) to really be *able* to declare a leader, unless you want to put some highly specified qualifications. And that seems to defy the spirit of the question "who is #1 in beer?"

2) Even if it were easier to identify a leader, or we had taken the effort to clearly define what is meant by leadership, how much value is there in identifying that leader? As a discussion-generating topic, sure it can be fun, but in that case the point is the discussion, not the answer. As a beer drinker, I don't know or particularly care who is leading. Which is not to say it's not okay for others to wonder--it's just not something that matters to the things that I enjoy about beer.

To use a hamfisted analogy, I liken the "race" to win beer to a race where a basketball player, a sprinter, a cyclist, a soccer player and a swimmer are all competing in a potato sack race while blindfolded. Sure, there will be a winner, but what does the winner really mean/say about the competitors? Nothing really--they all certainly have athletic skill and can find some measure of success at performing a physical activity, but the point of the race wasn't to see which random athlete was the best at jumping around blindly in a potato sack. Rather, the point of the race was to experience the enjoyment/entertainment of watching them try to succeed.

 

Well, I wasn't trying to make the point that America has NO beer culture, just that the other countries have very specific ones that appeal to people in immeasurable ways, a je ne sais quoi, if you will.

On the contrary, I would say that America's beer culture is becoming the brewery tasting rooms themselves. Come to Denver and go brewery-hopping if you want to see what I mean.

That said, it's nowhere near what the other countries have.

 

If you're measuring based purely on variety, then, yes, the U.S.A. definitely "wins." That said, if places like Franconia adopted U.S. "craft" style marketing tactics, they could easily divide up something like Kellerbier into 100 different "styles." Maybe our marketing is our most powerful/valuable contribution/export?

 

I know one thing is for certain, for how small a country Germany is, they sure have made quite an impact in the beer world (not to mention the business/manufacturing world). If a German read this thread, I would surmise he/she may look down on this topic as nationalist sentiment. But, this is just me thinking/writing "out loud".

 

I think we should celebrate that we live in a world that is great for beer drinkers, and getting better every day. It's not a competition. The USA is a great beer country for many reasons, Germany is a great beer country for many reasons, Belgium is a great beer country for many reasons, the UK is a great beer country...etc, etc, you get my point. A competitive, us vs them mentaliity isn't great, in my eyes. I think more beer knowledge and technique being shared between countries is what we really need.

 

One aspect that I greatly enjoy about craft beer is the wonderful variety of tasty beer styles available. As to whether this should be the metric for determining a 'winner' I am unsure but I will state that variety is something that I personally greatly appreciate.

Cheers!

 

I agree with what your saying but I think the USA has all these things except the size of Biergartens that are in Germany.

 

For me, much of what many here consider "variety" is nothing more that marketing gimmicks.

 

Sounds like I need to visit MI then, because based on my experience in the US I'd have to disagree.

 

I agree, I think there's very much a quantity over quality theme running in America at the moment. If you're talking say, IPAs, we're quite dense in quality for that style. Pilsners? Not yet, perhaps eventually. We're woefully lacking in quality Belgian beer, lagers in general, English styles (and cask overall).....and that's ok. I'm not going to find 200 quality IPAs in Munich either. Simply because a variety of styles are attempted in the US does not make variety it's greatest strength.

Being the forerunners in everything and anything IPA would be one strength I can get behind though.

 

What are some examples you'd give of marketing gimmicks, rather than "variety"?

I'd agree that a lot of US craft is all about marketing, calling everything an IPA, inventing new styles that don't really need to be a new style, etc, etc.

But in the end, I don't care what the beer is called, or marketed as, as long as it tastes good. And there really is a large amount of beer in this country that tastes quite good.

EDIT: I see @AlcahueteJ answered the question above, I'm guessing your answer is probably similar to what you would say.

 

Because having the same "variety" available in every country has been shown to dilute the local, traditional, viable beer culture that developed over centuries. Most place like the UK, Belgium, and (to a much lesser extent) Germany and the Czech Republic will tolerate some variety, but not at the expense of their cultures and traditions. This, to me, is a very good thing. If I want 1000s of takes on hoppy, bold styles, I'll travel the U.S. If I want traditional UK cask, Belgian Lambic, German lager, or Czech pils or tmave pivo, I'll have to go there. As much as America want to be all things to all people, there is no substitute for the real thing at the source. Nor should there be.