Recipe critique for an "xtra"IPA...

If you want it dry, why not use some sugar to help dry it out. Along those lines, if you want the beer to very hop forward, why add the other malts. Make a "small" DIPA with mainly base malt and some sugar and mash at the higher end to get body, if you want it.

As for the hops, based on the amount used, you could run the number and add the 60 min Sorachi and 15 min Citra as a first wort hop. I don't think it has been proved but seems to give a smoother bitterness but will add much more flavor than just the 60min addition. You can still achieve your IBU range just in a smoother delivery.

 

I like the FWH Idea and plan to try it myself real soon.

 

There's also hop bursting. Essentially, you're adding all your hops at 30 minutes and later. (some say 15 minutes or later). Obviously you'll need to use a great deal more hops to get the same IBUs, but the beer ends up full of hop flavor and aroma. You could even use FWH and then hop burst everything else. One thing: In my opinion, this works better with lower cohumulone hops. Not everyone agrees.

 

Since probably last fall, all of my hoppy beers have been FWH and 15, 5, 0, DH. I really dig that approach, dunno, maybe it's psychological and I have no hop science to back it up, but I do feel like this achieves a smoother bitterness. Some of my family members haven't always been fans of hoppy beers, but the response to the FWH APAs has been great.

 

I'd be willing to bet you're not alone in that belief. Hop bursting is pretty popular, at least when hops aren't $6 an ounce. The one time I know I've tried a commercial hop bursted beer was an imperial pils from Old Dominion quite a few years back. It tasted great, with a smooth even bitterness, and I literally could smell it when they poured it, even from all the way across the room.

 

Gotta start buying by the pound if you're going to hop burst! Just got a pound of Nelson Sauvin in the mail for $27 shipped. Buying that in two-ounce bags would have cost me $56 easily. I guess I'm not truly hop-bursting since I'm using a FWH addition, but that's just to get a chunk of IBUs taken care of with a relatively small addition so that I don't have to go quite so huge on the late additions to get to like a 50 IBU beer.

 

I liked your first schedule better. If anything, I would make Amarillo the dominant hop, as I love it. Citra and Sorachi work well together at about 2:1 Citra to Sorachi. I do agree that you should be careful with all of these hops if you are brewing for non-hop heads, especially the Citra and Sorachi. I would use Centennial to bulk it out if you want to lay off the more divisive hops.

 

I did a DIPA 3-4 months ago with nearly the same hop schedule/combo as your second proposition. it was fantastic. Slight lemon and pine and huge citrus notes, really refreshing. I think you'll be fine.

 

Simcoe works very well with Citra; I tend to bias towards more Simcoe, less Citra in IPAs containing both hops, as I like the tropical fruit flavors from Citra in the background with the pine and fruitiness of Simcoe more forward.

I might drop the Citra a little in the second dry hop to 0.5 oz and up the Simcoe to 1 oz; a while back I tried out a matrix of double dry hop combos and found that even as little as 0.25 oz of Citra mixed with 3 oz of Amarillo in the dry hop, still almost overpowered everything else.

 

Barfdiggs stated: “ …found that even as little as 0.25 oz of Citra mixed with 3 oz of Amarillo in the dry hop, still almost overpowered everything else.”

In the previous thread entitled Citrus hops tips/tricks I posted:

“I made an all Citra hopped IPA last year. I really liked it. It produced tropical fruit flavors/aromas to my palate. A number of friends who drank this Citra IPA perceived cat pee when smelling this beer; I didn’t perceive the cat pee.

Just a word of caution if you reconsider on Citra: this hop is EXTREMELY POTENT. I only used 3.5 ounces for late additions/dry hopping and I had to let these beers ‘mellow out’ for several weeks in the bottle before I could really drink this beer. I drank one beer after the two week carbonation/conditioning period and that beer was INTENSE; I had a hard time finishing that one beer.”

So, Jimmy, I think you have been ‘forewarned’ on multiple occasions that Citra is:

· A very, very potent hop

· Some people (maybe you?) perceive Citra as cat pee

Your latest hopping schedule is:

“1.5oz Simcoe 15min

1oz Citra 15min


1oz Amarillo f/o

1oz Citra f/o

.5oz Sorachi Ace f/o


2oz Amarillo DH 10 days


1oz Citra DH 5 Days

.5oz Simcoe DH 5 Days”

Permit me to do the math: you have 3 ounces of Citra for your late hoping schedule (15 minutes to end of boil and dry hopping). THAT IS A LOT OF CITRA HOPS!

Jimmy this is your beer. If you want your beer to be extremely ‘expressive’ (and run the risk of cat pee) then by all means follow you latest hopping schedule.

To demonstrate that I can be a ‘nag’ below is the hopping schedule I originally recommended in your other thread to achieve a citrus first, floral next and pine last of all flavor/aroma scheme.

“If I were to brew this IPA my hopping schedule would be something like:

· @ 15 minutes of boil: 1 ounce Centennial

· @ Flameout: 0.5 ounce Centennial & 0.5 ounce Amarillo

· Dry hop a total of 2 ounces equally divided amongst Centennial, Amarillo, and Simcoe”

Best of luck in brewing your ‘new and improved” ‘xtra’ IPA.

Cheers!

 

A word of caution on the Sorachi - I used it once in a Golden Ale hoping for some good citrus notes but it gives more of a lemon rind type flavor than citrus like you get from Centennial or Cascade, which I didn't really dig but it may just add some complexity when used alongside the other hops.

 

I feel confident in stating that your beer will certainly meet the “massively” criterion. Whether you achieve “approachably” is highly dependent on your taste buds.

Please report back your impressions on this beer.

Cheers!

P.S. I recognize that you have a time ‘constraint’ here: “ready to go by the first weekend in Aug for a family vacation.” If the beer comes out to be ‘very intense’ you can ‘manage’ this through aging of the beer (permit the aroma hops to mellow out). This aging may not be consistent with your vacation plans but it is an option (if you need it).

 

May I suggest changing your calculation system? Instead of Tinseth (which most calculators default to) try Rager or Garetz. Tinseth and rager can be fairly close, depending on boil, etc. Garetz can differ widely. While I've never spent the money to have a beer I brewed analyzed, I use Garetz, as it seems to my palate to much more accurately match what my system produces. An example: A beer recipe of mine using Tinseth shows 94 IBUs, under Rager, 92 IBUs, and under Garetz, 54 IBUs (!). When I finish it and taste it, I can tell you there aren't 94 IBUs in that brew. It's much, much closer to 54. So I set ProMash to Garetz, and I have never looked back.