Berliner Weiss Recipe Critique (Sour Mash)

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by Lukass, Feb 12, 2015.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    Ok, another Berliner Weiss thread, I know.. but I could really use your guys'/gals' help on a recipe I've concocted from various methods and sources that I've been doing some research on. I really want a refreshing Berliner Weiss for the spring/summer, so I want a fairly quick turn-around on this, and don't want to wait a year for this thing to sour up. I've found that the sour mash method works best for a quick, sour beer with a good lactic, lemony bite.

    So, here's my game plan for this one. Is there anything you guys see that looks off? Anything I'm missing? I've done 30+ all-grain batches, but this is my first sour attempt. Just wanna try and nail this recipe for the summertime so that I have enough time to try another batch if this one ends up sucking.

    Berliner Weiss

    5.25 gal batch

    Ingredients:
    4.0 lbs. German Pilsner malt
    4.0 lbs. White Wheat malt
    4 oz Acidulated Malt (for mash pH correction)
    Separate 8 oz Acidulated Malt (added during 156° F rest to acidify sour mash - post sugar conversion)
    Separate 6 oz uncrushed pilsner malt for wort inoculation
    0.25 lb Rice Hulls (added during lauter, after souring of wort)

    Mash:
    Boil strike water to remove all oxygen.
    Cool down to strike temp.
    Rest at 148 °F for 60 min
    Rest at 156 °F for 10 min
    Mashout at 168 °F for 10 min

    Sour Mash:
    After mash regimen, cool mash to 120 °F. Do not stir or aerate.
    Add 6 oz uncrushed pilsner malt to inoculate.
    Place saran wrap directly over mash, and seal cooler with lid.
    Wrap mash cooler in blankets and keep in small refrigerator to hold temp as much as possible.
    After 3-4 days, stir in rice hulls and begin lautering into boil kettle. Collect 5.5 gal wort. Sparge if necessary.

    Boil:
    .75 oz Willamette hops @ 15 min
    1 tsp Irish Moss @ 15 min
    1 tsp yeast nutrient @ 15 min

    Chill, and pitch a starter of Wyeast 1007 German Ale. Aerate well by splashing back and forth between 2 buckets a few times.

    Leave in primary fermenter for 2 weeks at ~65 °F

    Cold crash for a few days at 32 °F, then bottle

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

    I don't see anything wrong with the recipe. I think you'll find you'll find you want to do a hoppy version in the not too distant future.
     
    #2 jlordi12, Feb 12, 2015
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2015
    Lukass likes this.
  3. jlordi12

    jlordi12 Pooh-Bah (1,856) Jun 8, 2011 Massachusetts
    Pooh-Bah

  4. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Initiate (0) May 29, 2011 Florida

    Biggest thing in sour mash is oxygen ingress. A method that could help is getting a quick disconnect hookup of CO2 into your mash tun spigot. Initial burst of CO2 for like 30 seconds to purge out O2 & then just everyday for the 3 or so days you sour mash just hit it twice a day with a quick CO2 purge.
     
    inchrisin and Lukass like this.
  5. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    Cool, thanks. Is there a certain way to doing this? I don't keg (yet), so I'll need to get a tank, with a way of dispensing it. Laying a blanket of CO2 on top of the mash, and then sealing the lid right away should keep the lacto from having too much contact with O2 then, correct?
     
  6. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Initiate (0) May 29, 2011 Florida

    Roughly, in theory gassing in from the bottom purges the mash of O2 as well whereas gassing in from the top just gets the headspace.
     
    Lukass likes this.
  7. primrose54

    primrose54 Initiate (0) Apr 7, 2009 Ohio

    I personal like 66% Pilsner and 33% wheat. I also like pitching Brett C. However, there is nothing wrong with your recipe. This is what I like to do! Cheers!
     
    Lukass likes this.
  8. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    I've also heard that topping the mash off with some seltzer water can purge the mash of O2. Then if I were to quickly cover with saran wrap (right at the surface), and seal the edges against the inside of the cooler with some heavy-duty clear tape, I'm wondering if that would work.. I may try it this way first, and if tastes like bile/puke then I'll know I did something wrong and get a CO2 tank :slight_smile:
     
  9. hoptualBrew

    hoptualBrew Initiate (0) May 29, 2011 Florida

    @Lukass , that sounds good to me!
     
    Lukass likes this.
  10. FATC1TY

    FATC1TY Pooh-Bah (2,564) Feb 12, 2012 Georgia
    Pooh-Bah


    Or you could sour wort it... and not have an issue with the puke/vomit/fecal smell.
     
    GeoSteve and bushycook like this.
  11. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    True. I'm over-thinking it at this point, ha. I'm torn between both methods. Sour mash, or sour wort...
     
  12. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    Wait, really? Why is there less risk of puke/vomit/fecal smell when sour worting?
     
  13. FATC1TY

    FATC1TY Pooh-Bah (2,564) Feb 12, 2012 Georgia
    Pooh-Bah


    Well for one, most homebrewers don't have a set up to sour mash ( and honestly, kettle sour ), and keep oxygen and other unwanted microbes from their grist.

    Read around, and while many have success, you find more failure in a sour mash than a sour wort method. Probably with the fact people can't seal up their mash tuns well enough and can't keep out the oxygen as well.

    The grain and the space in the mash gives more room and headspace for something to go wrong. Sour wort method, I've had better success doing in a closed up better bottle with some un crushed grain and purged with co2. @VikeMan sours his in purged kegs with temp control, which is honestly, about the best way to avoid most of the issues with spoilage and the nasty crap you can make doing a berliner.

    To each his own though
     
    Lukass likes this.
  14. minderbender

    minderbender Initiate (0) Jan 18, 2009 New York

    I see. So you still need to keep oxygen away, it's just easier to do in a container other than a mash tun. Makes sense.
     
  15. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    I also hear with the sour mash method, the mash can get real sticky after a few days of souring.. so a lot of rice hulls will need to be used to avoid getting a stuck sparge.

    @FATC1TY did you just run your wort off the mash directly into the better bottle, before you tossed the grain in for souring? Isn't there a lot of O2 exposure to it at that time?
     
  16. FATC1TY

    FATC1TY Pooh-Bah (2,564) Feb 12, 2012 Georgia
    Pooh-Bah


    Yeah, right from the mash tun, into the better bottle. I pulled at mash temps, and then allowed it to sit and cool to 120 before adding the grain. Added some lactic acid to drop the pH, and then got the grain and flushed it all.

    I'm sure there was lots of exposure, but the lacto hadn't started working. Honestly don't know WHERE the point of no return is in keeping O2 away, but I know that I haven't had a problem, so I feel I must be doing something right, or holding my mouth just right.. something!
     
    Lukass likes this.
  17. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    Well, whichever method I end up doing, I'll be sure to report back! Thanks for all the info/advice on this. I may start this thing in a few days. Whenever I get an evening free..
     
  18. FATC1TY

    FATC1TY Pooh-Bah (2,564) Feb 12, 2012 Georgia
    Pooh-Bah

    I brew weekends only.. So I do it on a Sunday.. sour for the week.. and boil it on Sat. Works out really well with that schedule.
     
  19. Lukass

    Lukass Pooh-Bah (2,891) Dec 16, 2012 Ohio
    Pooh-Bah

    Cool. Mashing tomorrow (Sunday) now. I've got the CO2 setup so am planning on flushing the wort with CO2, putting an airlock on it, and letting it sit in my mini fridge for 5 days. Am hoping to find an aquarium heater for cheap so I can try to keep the temp at least in the 80-90 range for that length of time. I'm hoping it's plenty sour by next Saturday.
     
  20. FATC1TY

    FATC1TY Pooh-Bah (2,564) Feb 12, 2012 Georgia
    Pooh-Bah


    Try a heating pad under the better bottle too.. Turn it up on high , have a towel on the floor to insulate, and have the carboy stay warm. Wrap it up too, and keep it that way from the hot mash.

    If you have some lactic acid, or acid malt, use it. You want to lower your pH early, helps ward off the junk too. I think it's an important step overlooked.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.