Jester King moving towards green bottles for packaging

I didn't plan on interjecting, as I'm inclined to let our Head Brewer Garrett Crowell's points (which I fully support) stand for themselves. However, I cannot sit idly by while someone calls our motivations into question and implies we're experimenting with green bottles because there's money to be had. The notion this has anything to do with money is ridiculous, and would go against our entire company history/track record for anyone who's paying attention. Our business model has always been to make the beer that, in our opinion, is the best it can be, regardless of the cost, then to charge our customers what we need to in order to make it viable.

We pay $1.00 per pound for local malt from Blackland's or $1.08 per pound for organic pilsner malt from Weyermann. The latest pricing I have on conventional base malt, which admittedly is a little dated but you'll get the point, is around $0.60 per pound. We pay $14 to $15 per pound for organic hops from The Oregon Hophouse, as opposed to around $6 to $9 per pound, depending on the variety, for conventional hops. Most importantly, as we've stated many times before over the years in the Southwest Forum, the most expensive ingredient in our beer is time. We could make about 35 times the amount of beer that we currently make (~1,400 bbls in 2014) in our existing brewery with a 30 bbl system and 11,000 square feet of space, if we did two week tank turns made possible by pure culture fermentation with brewers yeast from a lab. But we choose not to because this isn't what interests us, and is not the beer we want to make. In fact, right now, we have about 25% or so of our fermentation space taken up by spontaneously fermenting beer that's anywhere from six months to two and half years old at this point. This space would be better served from a financial perspective by making beer that doesn't take nearly as long to sell.

To your precise point, we paid $0.67/bottle for green bottles from United Bottles and Packaging, compared with $0.69/bottle for brown bottles from the same source. Because of the experimental nature of this project, as opposed to it being a cost savings measure, we have only purchased 8,736 green bottles from United to date, as compared with our normal order of 27,104 brown bottles placed every six weeks or so. A quick calculation reveals that even if we put our entire 2014 annual production (~1,400 bbls) into green bottles instead of brown bottles, we'd only save approximately $4,381. A cost savings of this magnitude has no bearing on the way we make our beer. Again, as we've demonstrated time and time again, our entire model is to make the beer we want to make, regardless of the cost, and to charge our customers what we need to in order to make it viable.

- Jeff Stuffings / Founder

 

hey @kojevergas

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_burn_centers_in_the_United_States

 

Green bottles are why I stay away from that Cantillon crap, all just marketing bullshit.

 

Awesome stuff Jeff. Taking a stable successful product and experimenting with major variables really shows a dedication to innovation and improvement. Can't wait to compare LPP in green vs. brown glass.

You know what would be really innovative? Putting Foudreweizen in cans year round. Please. So good. (only sorta serious)

 

Thank you.

Not putting Foudreweizen in cans is a good illustration of my point (i.e. making the beer we want, regardless of cost, then charging what we need to). Given the five month fermentation time for Foudreweizen between brew day and release, it would amount to a very expensive six-pack. We charge higher prices for our beer, precisely because our beer making process isn't driven by cost savings.

 

Hi all,

Truthfully, Czech Pilsner is my favorite kind of beer in the world, which is pretty much the epitome of regiment and structure. One can absolutely be creative in the pursuit of brewing Czech Pilsner. I also really like Pacifico.

My opinions stated in the announcement are personal and I'm glad they're being challenged! I don't feel that every other brewery out there is making the same, cookie cutter beer though I can now see why it may be perceived that way. My main point is, there doesn't have to be a right and a wrong when making beer. There is a fun, and a not fun, and that's up to whoever is making or drinking the beer to decide.

 

ok, le petite prilzner urquel

 

Man, you wouldn't believe how often I've passed up Drie Fonteinen and Fantome because of those damn green bottles. That light-struck Golden Blend tastes like shit. And don't even get me started on that skunky-ass Fou' Foune.

 

We are not denouncing Garrett's opinions as personal ones. What Garrett wrote has the backing of Jester King Brewery, including its Founder.

- Jeff Stuffings / Founder

 

Apologize, as I don't frequent the SW forum super often, but I gather you're Garrett? If so, thanks for the additional thoughts/context, and my apologies as well if my initial post came off too strong and/or personal. I think I can see now that the above bolded was really the driving theme of the press release, and I definitely respect that (and agree). I may disagree with the particulars, but I dig what you're getting at. Hope the greens work out like you hope!

 

Last time I had Saison Dupont, it was a brown bottle, and fantastic. I can't remember the last time I had a skunked Saison Dupont, brown or green bottle, just saying...

 

My expectations are high for this post...

http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/24018/159551/?ba=kojevergas
http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/35016/161083/?ba=kojevergas
http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/1170/124806/?ba=kojevergas

You demean and degrade Texas, Texans, and Americans at almost every chance you can while writing the most pretentious dribble. Since I don't want to get a warning or banned I'll kindly hang up, ignore your content, and take everyone else's call off the air.

 

Exactly which beers have goat sweat in them? That might increase their trade value.

 

Who cares about the color of bottles? This thread sucks

 

ISO clear bottle Atrial Rubicite aged w/ goat sweat

 

I particularly like this bit about Meta Modern:

"The blueberry from the mosaic is nice, but otherwise there just isn't much going on here . Like I imagine most Texan suitors are, it's somewhat shallow and very average."

 

Will all my brown JK fruit sours be walez once green bottles take over?

 

Thanks for taking the time to respond, in very specific detail, to a post that didn't merit a response.

Keep doing what you're doing - a whole hell of a lot of us appreciate it. I don't love every beer you guys have made, but I'm damn sure willing to trust what you're doing and try them all. You've earned at least that much.

 

Bring on the JK pils in green bottles

 

I wouldn't take it personal. Taking a quick look at the reviews, he basically dislikes most of what he drinks. Or at least rates it lower than everyone else. I can only wish my palette could be that refined.