Bottle Logic's Fundamental Observation

You do realize VR isn't even the highest ISO for it yet. I've seen multiple posts FT: FO X2 ISO DDG.

Besides, obviously there are tons of people like me on this site and we all do the same thing. We get there early, we take our allotment, say thank you and go on our way. I actually didn't even take my full allotment (bought 5) and I did some smart trades in line to get some additional bottles.

As always, butthurt people are gonna be butthurt. Sorry you didn't get any bottles, next time come early like the rest of us.

Bottom line, this was a well advertised event and everyone had weeks to plan. Yes, it sold out quicker than most of us imagined but if you really want bottles, you should have shown up early OR gone to the dinner that had unlimited bottles available for purchase.

 

I actually did see a lot of this. I was maybe 80 people back when I got there at 330 and I saw countless people show up and cut.

 

I don't see how BPT isn't the better route for releases like this, unless I'm missing something. It provides for a more prominent market presence; allows more time management for the consumer.

 

Ummm dude. Take a look at where I live. I think you've completely missed the point that I made.

Your comments about mules and "setting the trading bar high" are what make you a shitty BA. Not the fact that you're posting your beer FT for a Vanilla Rye.

 

Why should I not trade a high value beer for another high value beer? Do you think everything should trade $4$? I do 90% of my trades $4$ but not everything falls into that boat. I've yet to see someone trade a de garde for $8 worth of beer. It just doesn't make sense. So yeah, I am setting the bar high and it looks like everyone else is as well. Everyone should value good beer at a higher rate.

 

The trading bar high thing is not something that makes him a shitty BA IMO. California has had a history of underselling our beers for midwest or east coast beers while beers like VR have shot up to almost impossible trading values. I'm happy t see people asking for other world-class beers because this is a damn good one. I'm very hesitant to trade mine now since I enjoyed it so much but I definitely agree with Josh. It's not about screwing people over for trades, it's about establishing a solid foundation from the go.

 

I'm sorry man, but you're totally clueless. I'll try to explain this one more time. Read your previous statement again:

The reason this pisses people off (myself included) is that you're basically saying you're looking to maximize your return on your beer. That isn't ADVOCACY. You're saying that you basically need to ask for something unreachable so that becomes the norm in the trading forums. Then once people realize those people are douchebags, the value will fall a little, but will still be at a level that you're happy with. Why not just ask for a beer that you think is fair to begin with? Why try to manipulate things by "starting the bar high"? I'll say it once more - that isn't advocacy.

 

The more he posts, the more he proves your point.

 

It's a pretty simple concept: supply and demand. The reason Vanilla Rye trades high is because people want it. Bourbon County beers have a great pedigree, great ratings, and it's tough to get a quantity of them. You compare that to a new beer with no track record and people walking out with cases....inherantly there will be less demand for that beer.

To clarify though, I'm NOT comparing beers here. I could care less about either or their trade value relative to one another. I also don't care if he completes that trade for Vanilla Rye 1:1. None of this is about the actual beers to me. It's about his comments and mentality regarding beer trading, which I think sucks.

 

You probably shouldn’t have made that comment Josh. You’re already getting shit for it and I can see why people would be rubbed the wrong way by it. Most traders would rather see the trade value of a beer grow organically, meaning they would like to see the demand rise to the point that people start offering their more valuable bottles. Reasons for this should include: taste, ratings, word of mouth, etc. What your comment seems to represent is a forced approach where traders with bottles demand only the top shelf items in everyone’s cellar.


I get where you’re coming from because I’ve also been frustrated at the lack of value placed on many of the west coast releases. What really needs to happen is traders with bottles need to hold some bottles while drinking, rating and sharing. Let the beer speak for itself! Once everyone catches on, more people will be ISO. In a quick search of the trade forums, I counted 18 ISO’s and 12 FT’s. If that ratio keeps moving in the right direction then it will be easy for Midwest and east coast traders to hand over their whalezbro.


And btw, I got no bottles so I have no skin in the game.

 

Next time can we have a line for people who want 1 bottle so we can.... you know...drink it?

 

Well-said, and spoken more eloquently than I.

 

Would love to trade for this

 

You're right, many people/regions do this. But that doesn't make it right, and that doesn't mean it should be tolerated.

I really appreciate your offer - that's very generous of you. But I'd rather you send it to someone else - maybe a new BA or something. I just want to make it clear...none of my comments have anything to do with me being butt-hurt. I'm not posting ISO's for this beer, and I'm not interested in it honestly. And for all you Cali guys - I truely hope this is the next "waelz bro" beer and you can land beers with it that you've been dying to try. I have no opinion whatsoever about the trade value of this beer - present or future.

I just wanted to call out what I saw (and it's clear many others agree) as intolerable mentality and trading practices. And with that said, I think I've made my point.

 

Your point is a good one, if this were 2002. Beer "advocacy" was something of the early 2000's. It's not the current state of affairs. Craft beer is here, everyone knows about, the people on this site by and large are not here to advocate for craft beer. They are here to hoard/tick/get whales/be the coolest guy on the block drinking every top 250 beer/etc.

 

Didn't get a chance to get a bottle before they sold out and I dont have much in my cellar but looking for a bottle myself. So PM if you have one to trade.

 

Bottle Logic Gate 2015

 

...and there is me, who wants all the Fundamental Observation to drink by himself Maybe share some with friends. Maybe. Some.
Honestly, I really wished the beer was released quietly so that everyone could buy it and decide for themselves without the hassle of yesterday and the whole "trading games". Of course, that's not 2015 anymore, as someone else mentioned before.

 

You do realize that advocating for arriving early exacerbates the problem, right? This forces folks to arrive earlier each time. Do you enjoy having to take time off from work and family to queue up with neckbeards?

 

On a positive note (and more of a positive for early customers and NOT Bottle Logic): I did here of a few people, that maxed out, help others who weren't able to get bottles with at least one. I was to upset to even try, but I liked knowing that there are nice people out there who know they will not drink 6 bottles and would rather brighten up the day of a local than an east coaster