Will this ever be possible, or should I move on?

Discussion in 'Homebrewing' started by 76da42, Jul 11, 2015.

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  1. 76da42

    76da42 Initiate (0) Mar 21, 2015 Michigan

    I can't get my 1 gallon partial extract Imperial Stout recipe to finish fermenting properly. I've already posted here and here and tried all your suggestions. Is there something I'm missing? Is it just not going to be possible with a one gallon batch? Is it a mistake with my recipe, rather than the process?

    The readings from my latest failures:

    Batch #7
    OG 1.096 (June 21)
    FG 1.045 (July 10)
    ABV 6.69%
    Batch #8
    OG 1.098 (June 22)
    FG 1.050 (July 10)
    ABV 6.30%

    I've already posted my recipe, but here it is again:

    Imperial Stout
    2.00 lbs. Briess DME- Golden Light
    0.25 lbs. Caramel 90L-Briess
    0.25 lbs. Chocolate Malt-Breiss
    0.13 lbs. Roasted Barley-Briess
    0.13 lbs. Smoked Malt (Briess, cherry wood)
    0.25 oz. Northern Brewer- US (60 min)
    0.25 oz. Northern Brewer- US (30 min)
    Fermentis US-05 Safale American Ale (1/2 packet)

    1. Steep @ 152 degrees in 1 gallon water, 45 minutes.
    2. Sparge .75 gallon @156 degrees
    3. Boil 60 minutes
    4. Rapid cool in ice bath.
    5. Pour into primary (2 gallon plastic bucket). Oxygenate 60 seconds with pure O2 and stone
    6. Add rehydrated yeast, store at 68-70 degrees in the dark.
    7. Oxygenate 60 seconds again 12 hours later

    I've tried adding yeast nutrient. I've tried adding more yeast. I've tried adding the entire packet of yeast in primary. I've tried both LME and DME. I wrap my containers to try and have a more stable temperature.
     
  2. CurtFromHershey

    CurtFromHershey Initiate (0) Oct 4, 2012 Minnesota

    That seems like a lot of specialty malts for a one gallon batch to me. That will greatly impact the fermentability of the wort. Also, how are oxygenating the wort before you pitch the yeast?
     
  3. ryane

    ryane Initiate (0) Nov 21, 2007 Washington

    I dunno if I agree with the specialty amounts comment above, in a 5 gal batch that would be about 1.5# crystal, ~2.25# roasted grains and .75# smoked, so not totally out of line for an impy stout

    Your OG seems a bit out off though, even at 100% eff, with those grains at 1gal you can only get 1095.

    As to getting a lower FG, couple things not mentioned

    1. In your PM, I would include some base malt to get adequate amounts of enzymes in your mash, the smoked malt does have a decent amount but its a relatively minor component of your mash. Everything else will not be able to convert starches, however limited they may be

    2. A bit of sugar might be useful to you in drying the beer out

    3. when you measure your FG do you degas the sample? If you dont shake the hell out of it to remove CO2 you get elevated readings

    4. Why not do a mash for the whole grain bill?? Its pretty small after all

    Why not try
    3# Pale malt
    4oz Choco
    4oz 90L
    2oz RB
    2oz Smoked
    4oz Sugar

    at 65% eff you'd get 1098 and you could mash low to get your low FG
     
    telejunkie likes this.
  4. inchrisin

    inchrisin Pooh-Bah (2,013) Sep 25, 2008 Indiana
    Pooh-Bah

    Gallon growlers cost a few bucks. Buy another, make another batch, and blend them together. The next one needs to be very dry. Lots of RB and maybe some simple sugar.
     
  5. 76da42

    76da42 Initiate (0) Mar 21, 2015 Michigan

    Thanks guys. I'm still pretty new to this, so have a few questions:

    1. Making it drier will lower FG? Why?
    2. How much simple sugar do I add? Is it added at beginning of the boil?
    3. Could I get the same result from increasing one of the grains? If so which and how much?

    My recipe is actually 1.25 gallons, and I use a refractometer to do my measurements. I'm steeping grains in a grain sock.
     
  6. MarriedAtGI

    MarriedAtGI Zealot (569) Feb 26, 2013 Illinois

    What were your refractometer readings and are you adjusting for alcohol? If you had initial reading of ~24 and final reading of ~12, that would mean an FG of ~1.017 per the BrewCipher calculator. But an unadjusted reading of ~12 would appear to be ~1.047.

    If you have been adjusting and final reading was ~15, then fermentation would indeed appear to be stuck.
     
    CurtFromHershey and JackHorzempa like this.
  7. Brew_Betty

    Brew_Betty Initiate (0) Jan 5, 2015 Wisconsin

    Can you explain why you are still using enough O2 for a 5 gallon batch in a 1 gallon batch?
     
  8. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    It will be interesting to see the response to @MarriedAtGI query. It just may be there really is no problem here with the beer; perhaps the beer did reach a final gravity around 1.017.

    Cheers!
     
  9. 76da42

    76da42 Initiate (0) Mar 21, 2015 Michigan

    Uh-oh, maybe this is the problem. I'm using THIS model refractometer. It has a built in conversion for SG, but I just read I have to do some calculations in order to get a correct FG. I can't believe I overlooked this. Can someone point me to the right place to calculate correctly? If my error is the mistake, and I've not really had a problem with FG, I've been throwing out a lot of good beer...
     
  10. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Are you rehydrating your yeast in water prior to pitching? Rehydration in wort creates osmotic stress on the cells. Rehydration in high gravity wort cannot be good.
     
  11. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Are you throwing our beer only based on the gravity? You got to taste it, man!
     
    MarriedAtGI and JackHorzempa like this.
  12. 76da42

    76da42 Initiate (0) Mar 21, 2015 Michigan

    I was tasting, and it tasted too sweet to me, so I assumed the readings were right. What a goof, time to bottle these two batches!

    Using some online calculators these are my CORRECT readings (I think):

    Batch #7
    Brix: 22.9, SG 1.096 (June 21)
    Brix: 11.2 (July 10)
    FG 1.013, ABV 10.372
    Batch #8
    Brix: 23.3, SG 1.098 (June 22)
    Brix: 12.4 (July 10)
    FG 1.020, ABV 9.487
     
  13. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    These last two batches read like "success" to me.

    Cheers!
     
    MarriedAtGI likes this.
  14. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    Perhaps you should use a hydrometer to do final gravity for a few batches. I know it is a substantial volume sacrifice if you are only brewing 1 gallon batches, but if you check your hydrometer FG against your refractometer fg, it may give you the peace of mind to move forward with reliance on the refrac. Just a thought.
     
    CDennyRun likes this.
  15. ChuckHardslab

    ChuckHardslab Maven (1,251) Jan 25, 2012 Texas

    That's why I use a high resolution hydrometer to check FG. I'd rather calculate minor temperature density offsets.
     
  16. ChuckHardslab

    ChuckHardslab Maven (1,251) Jan 25, 2012 Texas

    I don't sacrifice my wort when I test. I sanitize everything and use a thief with valve on the bottom.
     
  17. JackHorzempa

    JackHorzempa Grand Pooh-Bah (3,375) Dec 15, 2005 Pennsylvania
    Society Pooh-Bah

    The good news is that you now know how to properly use your refractometer?

    Cheers!
     
  18. ChuckHardslab

    ChuckHardslab Maven (1,251) Jan 25, 2012 Texas

    I think you're replying to the wrong person.
     
  19. pweis909

    pweis909 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,250) Aug 13, 2005 Wisconsin
    Pooh-Bah

    I was suggesting that the OP compare his refrac samples to a hydrometer sample. I guess you were suggesting that an alternative is to sanitize everything, use a thief to pull a hydrometer sample, check gravity, and than pour it back? Sure, it could be done this way. I think there is some additional exposure to oxygen, but maybe not a big deal if it is a small batch that will be consumed relatively quickly. In the long run, if he continues to small batch, I think using the refrac is the way to go, easy to do, minimizes exposure of the beer. He just needs to learn whether or not he is making the best corrections to his FG reading.

    Or maybe I don't understand why you are explaining that you use a thief...
     
  20. ChuckHardslab

    ChuckHardslab Maven (1,251) Jan 25, 2012 Texas

    I was just commenting on your relative volume loss statement and how I avoid that.
     
    pweis909 likes this.
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