Old IPAs - What to do about this problem?

Is there some kind of recycling program out there? Frat houses perhaps?

 

It sounds to me like there a bunch of beer freshness fanatics who should be learning how to hombrew.

 

The more expensive beers regardless of how well rated (Sculpin and FW for flagship IPAs) regardless of style don't move in volume compared to cheaper beers on most store shelves. Only where there are higher populations of beer advocates will the higher priced/higher quality beers move off the shelves quickly. Not talking whales or big bottle formats etc....just high quality flagships beers that are frequently stocked is what I'm referring to. Many places in the country they will become shelf turds.

 

I have already put in a 'plug' for homebrewing in this thread.

The other option for folks who don't want to take the plunge into homebrewing is to purchase fresh hoppy beer from local brewpubs (or breweries with tasting rooms)

Cheers!

 

There are WAY too many variables to consider to apply a blanket 40 day window to IPA freshness. As has been stated ad nauseum in this thread already, storage conditions, bottling equipment, handling and hop varietals and storage all play a major role in how much or how little beer hop aroma fades.

For most of our hop forward beers, we're comfortable with them being in the market at 100days hop-wise and think they're still "saleable fresh" at 150, although we acknowledge the flavor has begun to fade at that point. We do massive amounts of sensory evaluation at 3 days 5 days 10 days, 30 days, 60 days 90 days, 120 days, 150 days and 200 days. The longer dates are looking at rate of oxidation and hop impact, specifically myrcene levels and trans-2-nonenal. All packaged beer is in a constant state of degradation as soon as it is packaged, but some degrade much quicker than others (this is the shit that keeps brewers up at night, by the way.)
Personally speaking, I know which breweries I trust from a QC perspective to deliver the kind of quality handling and packaging to preserve hop flavor. What I don't know, (and can really never know) is how the beers are stored. Heat (above 55 degrees F) being the major culprit in rapid staling on the retail side, iron and oxygen on the production side.

Our sensory panels actually prefer most of our super-hoppy beers with two weeks of age on them (14 days) because at that point, some of the grassy vegetal character of the hops has faded and more of the citrus / tropical character has come into focus, so I'd be pretty disappointed with a two day old Torpedo.

Buy from a store that keeps small volumes that turn quickly. Buy from a store that refrigerates. Buy beers that come in many batches rather than a single release and you're more likely to find the quality you're looking for. Buy beers in closed 12-packs or 6-packs rather than singles.

-Bill

 

The problem begins at the brewery with producing more than demand can handle of certain brands, not putting bottle dates on their beer, and having over optimistic best buy dates. Next comes the distributor who may over purchase certain brands and ends up selling outdated beer to retailers. Some distributors may require retailers to carry more than they can handle of certain brands so the beer sits on the shelf for longer than it should. I think that distributors have a responsibility to check the stock in stores and remove out of date beer. Gussie Busch used to show up unannounced at retailers and distributors and pull the out of date stuff off the shelves and then run the distributor responsible through a meat grinder. Craft brewers can't do that but their distributors should check their stock. Today for most craft brewers once the beer has left the brewery, its like sending your kid to college in Europe - you have no control over what is to happen to them once they get there.

Retailers need to check what the distributor is putting on their shelves. I went to a Total Wine in Minnesota the week they opened and they had out of date stuff on their shelves. I suspect a distributor was dumping old crap on them. Then there are the retailers who don't check their stock, and finally people like you and me who go to the store, see a special beer and don't bother to look at the date and end up taking home a beer on social security. Almost half a century ago I worked in a small grocery store and every morning Cy the produce manager would go out and check his stock and cull the bad stuff out and throw it in the dumpster.

We need to be better consumers and point out out of date stuff to the retailer and we need to let brewers know that if they want us to buy their beer, we need to know when they bottled it.

 

Thanks.

Then if that is what he means all that Stone has really shown is that if you develop a really good marketing technique that specifically targets IPA lovers and rotate your distribution from area to area to help insure the old is gone in one area before the new is scheduled to get there, folks will buy it and think that's great. It might tell us what they think the shelf life of that particular beer is but doesn't help with all the other IPAs out there.

 

Bill,

Thank you for taking the time to make that thoughtful post!

I also appreciate you statement of: “Our sensory panels actually prefer most of our super-hoppy beers with two weeks of age on them (14 days) because at that point, some of the grassy vegetal character of the hops has faded and more of the citrus / tropical character has come into focus, so I'd be pretty disappointed with a two day old Torpedo.”

I have only had the opportunity a handful of times to purchase local hoppy beer just a few days from packaging (e.g., two times for Troegs Nugget Nectar). In every circumstance the beer was more enjoyable to drink with a couple of weeks from the packaging date.

Cheers!

 

Yeah it sure doesn't.

Something I posted previously in this thread:

"Stone Enjoy by has a best by timeframe of 35 days and by making the best by date part of the beer name (e.g., Enjoy By 09.02.15) they ‘manage’ the distribution/retail aspect; both the distributors and retailers make specific effort to sell this beer by the best by date.

If only other hoppy beers could be so well managed."

Cheers!

 

Brew it yourself. Only way you can make sure its fresh.
I also suggest picking up your favorite IPA (a few each week) and track how it tastes so you know when its just too old.

 

FWIW, this thread from last year covered the topic of beer freshness extensively and respected professional brewers weighed in from Victory, Sierra Nevada, Firestone Walker, and AB-InBev (starting around page 3). It's a good read if you want a better understanding of the technical aspects of beer freshness, packaging, and storage. Buying fresh beer is not as simple as checking a date or only buying cans, as so many around here seem to think.

http://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/old-ipas.177842/

 

35 days?
Honestly. If you want to treat this like the 3 pages of responses you have generated. Do good beer a solid.
Be pro-active with the breweries.
Both Ballast Point and FSW are big enough that they can tend to these issues.
Contact them so they can get their sales people out and pulling their out of date product and to also give you the low down on what is real to expect for freshness from their companies QA/QC perspective.
Smaller breweries who self distribute are able to attend to these problems because they see their product and how it is actually selling in real time when they go into the field. That's easier to do when you are the one sales representative and your brewery is five miles away. It's a whole lot easier to adjust your schedule when you are only brewing a few times a week versus everyday, so smaller breweries who self distribute can adjust their brew schedule accordingly a lot faster than a large multiple state brewer.
But, again.
This over stressing on freshness is its own worrying trend.

 

You're right; the increasing obsession with IPA freshness is irrational. Maybe we all need to just chill out.

 

Wanting fresh beer is admirable. Saying an IPA becomes a "malty mess" after 40 days is bordering on lunacy.

 

Ok.

 

Where did I go wrong when choosing an occupation? Let me count the ways at 3 days, 5 days, 10 days...

 

Tasting fresh, 7 days, 30 and 60 days has shown me that there is a tremendous amount of transformation a beer goes through in its life. I tend to like my IPA's at 7-14 days old but at 30 on up I pick up diminishing hop character and the malt presence and character changes as well.

 

OP, as a solution to your problem I'd like to suggest that you call, email or write a letter to the breweries that have old stuff on your store's shelves and suggest that they expand their distribution footprint to other states, Michigan for example (or should I say a strong suggestion rather than 'example' because our distro kind of sucks), so that your store's inventory will turn over more quickly with its smaller supply. There you go.... problem solved and everyone involved is happy.

 

Started home brewing and soon found that a juicy, aromatic DIPA is one of the easiest batches to make. The biggest challenge is drinking a little over two cases of it in 2-3 weeks. But, I am up to the task!

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and I respect them even if they are different from mine (and therefore obviously wrong). However, applying a broad brush to all ipas ("I don't drink anything more than 2 weeks old", "after xx days they are an oxidized mess") I don't understand. I completely agree that some great beers taste like crap after a few weeks, but in my experience there are far more that are just as good for months (if brewed and stored properly).


I have experienced the freshness factor myself quite a bit. Off the top of my head, Sculpin, Jai Alai, and Zombie Dust are a few hoppy beers that I think deteriorate fairly quick. So I am a believer, not a hater. However, I do think that we all misinterpret pallate change more than we realize. It could be another beer we have had recently, the food we ate, the food we didnt eat, fatigue, anticipation, allergies, colds, or variations in the batch from smaller breweries.


Not trying to educate anyone who has been drinking beer longer than me. Just my opinion. I feel there are plenty of 2 month old 6 packs in coolers that are just fine and end up in my fridge. I guess get rid of me is an answer to your question. Get in line