How important is being "Craft" really?

I think it's pretty obvious that Greg was talking about the recent AB acquired breweries like Blue Point, Elysian and 10 Barrel, that have been dropped from the B.A.'s "Craft Brewer" list. They "left" by selling out to AB. (Goose Island was not "B.A.-craft" at the time of their AB deal, then being 40% owned by the non-craft Craft Brewers Alliance). Haven't checked lately, but many "BA non-craft" breweries still belong to the Brewers Association (inc. AB, MC and their subsidiaries) - so they only "left" the "Craft Brewers" listings not the group.

As I understand it from Jace Marti's comments re: the B.A.'s "Craft v Crafty" press release in 2012, Schell voluntarily left the newly formed "Brewers Association" before or during the merger process and the debate over the "Craft Brewer" definition.

Yuengling did not belong to either of the pre-merger small brewers groups (BAA and AoB) but did voluntarily join the Brewers Association in 2011, with the full knowledge that they would not be considered "craft" at the time. Of course, with the recent change to the "Traditional" part of the B.A.'s "Craft Brewer" definition, both brewers are now considered craft - although Schell has not, to my knowledge, (re)joined the group. Yuengling remains a member and, given the B.A.'s decision not to count BBC's cider and FMB production (putting their total production at well over 4m bbl), is #1 craft brewer according to the Brewers Association.

 

Interesting claim that expansion leads to decline in quality, given that neither Founders (eg KBS) nor Goose Island (eg BCBS) seem to have lost their ability to be reviewed with praise and even given across the board 5s for ratings.

 

We already have a brewery with the esteem and scope of Duvel Moortgat , Sierra Nevada.

 

Drink what you like, and if you like what your local brewer is making, support him/ her too.

 

The red herring here in this thread is the discussion of membership in BA and the good the BA does for the "craft brewers". It is, though, apparently at least partially successful in diverting the discussion, as all successful red herrings do.

Goose Island still makes craft beer as far as the vast majority of beer consumers are concerned. So does Blue Moon. I'm not so sure Yuengling's majority of customers consider them "craft" more than "traditional", but I don't live in their area, so IDK. Schell's advertises themselves as "German craft", an "in your face" move against the BA's idiotic (IMO) original decision to kick them out of the club (meaning the list, not the BA itself).

And, I fully expect the BA to keep cooking either the definition or the numbers to keep BBC in the "club".

In an age where McDonalds can sell an "artisan" sandwich, the attempt by the BA to "own" the words "craft brewer" as if it was some kind of trade name will not fully succeed (has the lawsuit against Blue Moon been thrown out yet?) and it does a disservice to the beer consumers, IMO.

I understand they are not representing the beer consumers, and that they fight the good fight from several perspectives, but that does not mean that everything they do is beyond criticism.

The BA's definition of "craft brewer" is a political definition, not a marketing definition, and should have no bearing on what beer consumers consider to be good beer. The BA's attempt to make it a marketing definition by re-inventing the definition of the word "crafty" is almost humorous in its irony (what is the actual definition of "crafty"?).

Presumably, the brewers who fall under the umbrella of the BA's definition have common interests in matters of production practices, distribution, tax laws, and the like, that are not shared by the macro brewers. That is what trade associations are for ... they are organizations of businesses with common interests.

 

I think it's a two-edged sword. While on one hand, I do like supporting the little guy, the local guy (that is still producing great beer; I won't buy lousy stuff just because it's local) there is nothing inherently wrong about big companies - who among us does not shop at Target, Walmart or Amazon rather than the local mom-and-pop shops - it is in how they produce and market their products. I don't care for Budweiser, Coors and especially their "light" products - I can deal with MGD if the choice is that or dehydration. I think what the OP is really wondering is about the craft breweries that have been bought by the big guys - Goose Island, Blue Point, Elysium and so forth.
I normally don't buy any of those, with the exception of BCBS/BCBBW and the varients if I can find them, and very occasionally the Sisters series.

 

Spot on. And yes, the whole "craft vs. crafty" was pretty silly stuff. Beyond silly, really.
Good beer is good beer, regardless of the source.

One beer blogger has suggested that we are entering the "post craft" era of brewing and even though I have been a fan of the small brewers since the very beginning, I fully agree with his assessment. And I don't view 'post craft' as a negative thing, either.
I'll repeat what I have been saying for a number of years now: Once the conversation begins to focus on beer quality (rather than the hype or concern about the size of the brewery that produced it) the beer world will be a much better and certainly a much saner place. I'd vertainly like to hope that the "craft" brewers (the handful of really good ones, anyway) will continue to outclass BMC.
But as far as the BMCs are concerned, there's no question that while they still have a ways to go in catching up with the unique distinctiveness of products from the best of the independents, there are definitely some top class products emerging from the mega kettles. And that's good too.

Fortunately, it's become clear that at least some consumers are beginning to see through some of the smoke and mirrors coming from both sides of the brewing industry.

 

To me it does. Craft beer is an art and an actual craft. The brewers respect the product and the consumers who drink it. To them the beer is the priority, while the profits are secondary in nature. Macro brewers produce cheap crap for people who really don't care about the quality of the beer. Their priority is making lots of money. So drinking from craft breweries is important!

 

Mnale

Thanks for clarifying that this is not about Schell or Yuenling It is about Goose Island and Blue Moon In that sense what Stone Gregg said about BMC trying to now profit from a movement they fought seems spot on to me. Now of course many consumers do not care about rewarding that behavior, but only about maximizing their pleasure from drinking relative to price paid. I don't think many such consumers are put off by the use of the BA Def of craft, judging by sales (though imo at least the Blue Moon consumers are making a mistake - I have not yet tried GI si I can't say about that)

 

By the way, as far as I can tell the artisan sandwiches have not helped Mcd's much. They are about to net reduce their number of restaurants in the US for the first time in 40 years. Consumers are not so always so easily fooled. Similarly the growth of GI has not stopped the overall volume decline faced by ABI in the US, IIUC.

 

Lusk us

We are not post craft when the majority of beer sold in the US is BMC (not even counting macro imports) When the largest beer brands are sold in campaigns that do not emphasize taste, but for example Bud's status as an "American icon" ( Which is a disgusting claim, putting a branded consumer product in the same category as the flag or the statue of liberty, and is only more absurd because AB'S post war expansion meant the death of numerous traditional American regional breweries, and that Bud is now owned by a foreign multinational )

 

Jack

To me it is. I fully recognize that there is some economic activity that requires large multinational corps. But their dominance of consumer products, especially food and beverages, has grown excessive imo. Beer, even more than many other categories, it is possible to choose smaller over larger, and/or local over non local, with minimal sacrifice in QPR. I do not expect everyone to make that choice, and I will not 100 % of the time, buy I do want the vocabulary to make that choice. While there is much more to it than the word craft ( I do consider BBC craft for good reason - it has long fought the good fight ) it is not as small as say Crooked Run where I had a beer today, nor is BBC local to me as Crooked is - still for many purposes the word craft is useful.

 

Jack

For the folks who despise BBC it is. I think BBC is craft, in ways that AB and MillerCoors, and Pabst are not. So I am fine with the barrel limit.

Things could get interesting if Pabst continues to decline in sales.

 

Taste does not mean intensity of flavor. Well, on BA it does, but in the real world, no.

And larger "craft" beer brewery expansions will probably mean the same thing. It's a business, and that's what happens. Or do you still think we're all sitting in a circle singing Kumbaya?

 

At some point, the decline become inevitable. Founders is in a good position, I like it a lot. I'm guessing so is Bourbon County for now, being still relatively hard to locate. Once someone gets their hands on Goose Island's expense sheet though, and sees potential to expand aggressively, watch as they start cutting out the pricier ingredients and costs, here and there. That's just the way business moves, when you move into the large mainstream. At some point, mass volume comes into play, and there's just no way to make things on so high a level, at THAT quantity.

Here's a related topic: Have you been to Din Tai Fung the dumpling restaurant? The flavor has very subtley become more and more light tasting, and they weigh each dumpling with a calculator. So the older diners recognize it, but the mainstream ones can't tell. They never knew the original.

 

So how many years does it take for "the inevitable?" GI has been on a steady growth curve since their purchase without decline in quality. Founders has been on a continuous growth curve for over 10 years without decline in quality. Sierra Nevada has seen steady growth curve for over 20 years with no decline in quality. Duvet Mortgat has seen steady growth for well over 10 years with no decline in quality while buying breweries, some of which have have also seen improvement in diversity of offerings and quality. When does that inevitable kick in?

Edit: Pretty sure ABInBev had the GI balance sheet before the acquisition and still has access to it.