No love for Kolsch?

I have only tried 2 or 3 of them, but I haven't been that big of a fan. I would much prefer a Pilsner or Marzen.

 

Exactly -- if someone is really a beer aficionado, shouldn't he/she expect to find some beers refreshing?

Not a compliment? Please.

 

As far as widely-available kölsch brands go, Reissdorf and Früh are two of the best.

 

I hate to do this to a perfectly good thread, but is this stuff an ale or a lager? It can't be both, and it can't be neither. There seems to be a genuine debate and I don't get how that is possible. The only one I've had is Sierra Nevada's version and it was very good. It doesn't really matter which it is I'm just curious by nature.

 

Both!

Well, it really depends...

When you say Lager, are you refering to the Yeast species or the process of Lagering? If the former, then no, if the latter, then yes...

 

If you had to classify it as one, it would be an ale since it is brewed with a top-fermenting yeast. It is fermented at lower temperatures than most ales though and lagered for smoothness.

 

So it's an ale that is lagered? I didn't know there was such a thing, and now I'm starting to see where the confusion comes from. This is one of those stout/porter things that never has a resolution isn't it? It's good beer whatever the hell it is.

 

Yeah, pretty much. The confusion comes about because we have beer/ale/lager being brewed in multiple countries, under multiple terms, using multiple languages, over multiple millenia.

While the US / UK (and Aus) currently define a lager as being a beer brewed by a bottom fermenting yeast (specifically the strain Saccharomyces pastorianus), in Germany, they define a lager as being a beer that has been lagered. Throw in some stupidly ignorant legislation such as the now overturned Texas "Anything over 4% is an ale and not a beer" legislation, and people get even more confused.


p.s. The Stout/Porter thing isn't really that confusing. Stout used to just be a term that meant strong (and thus could be applied to not just Porters), but has now become a term synonymous with a 'Stout Porter', and thought of as a separate catagory by many/most.

 

Just had Victorys Kühl Kölsch tonight and really enjoyed it.

 

It's a Lager but it isn't an Ale. Pretty effing obvious, really.

 

Saint Arnold Lawnmower is a great Kolsch. We've won several GABF and WBC medals for it (selfish plug). Slightly hop forward than traditional kolsch.

 

See above. Nothing effing obvious so far.

 

Aw, that's not always the case - sometimes for the modern beer geekster, all a beer has to do is "knock their socks off". (Me, I can [still] take my own socks off, even after a beer or two, so it is not a requirement of my beer.)

Alternately, when a traditional beer style is too "tame" it turns out all a brewer need do is add some fruit or spices or both. Pils too bland? Add some pear! Kolsch too subtle? Try this mango flavored one! IPA's too common, too pedestrian after drinking them for the almost 1½ years since "discovering" craft beer? Hey, here's one with grapefruit added! Gose - it tastes like a slightly salty, spicy AAL? Here's one with oranges in it! Drinkers of Berliner Weisse traditionally add raspberry or woodruff syrup? Why bother with adding it yourself or limiting it to those two flavors - let the brewer do it for you and they pick the flavor and amount!

And, yeah, at least, over-hop it. And kick up that ABV while you're at it.

Funny that so many of the stereotypical craft beer geeks, who ridicule the (optional) lime in Corona or orange slice on the edge of a glass of Blue Moon "Belgian" White Ale, feel it necessary for brewers to brew fruit-flavored traditional styles to make them "acceptable" or move them into the most favored "innovative" class.

 

I've had lots of tasty US made "Kölsch style" ales but as many others here have posted, if you're adding fruit or making it more hop forward then why the heck are you calling it Kölsch? Balance is the very thing that defines the style. It would be like calling a beer that sits at 30 IBU an "IPA-style" ale because it comes out a copper color and sits at about 6-7% alcohol. Just call it "ale" and be done with it instead of adding some caché that doesn't actually apply.

 

Checked the top 250 list on this site lately?

 

As the top 250 list indicates, the BA audience in general has no time for anything but Double IPA's. I love a good hop bomb every now and then, but there's a time and place for everything. Eventually our palates will grow the hell up.

 

Mühlen Kölsch is my favourite. The beer that made me love the style.

I also had one from Northern Ireland from Northbound in Derry and it was lovely.

 

Harpoon Summer Beer

Then Trillium had Sprang and Big Sprang last year. But they have been absent in 2015.

 

Further proving my point, beer "aficionados" one and all.

If it doesn't slap me around, how can it be good?

 

Altbier is fermented and lagered the same way.