The 750 Saison

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by zid, Jun 26, 2016.

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  1. MacMalt

    MacMalt Grand High Pooh-Bah (7,322) Jan 28, 2015 New Jersey
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    I agree with those who says saison is underrated as a style. It is a great style to introduce a macro drinker to the world of craft. It's reasonably light in feel and ABV but it is so much more complex than some nondescript AAL. It's a good style for identifying the different flavors - fruits, spices, etc. I also like the 750 format because it promotes savoring rather than guzzling.
     
  2. lic217

    lic217 Pooh-Bah (2,090) Aug 10, 2010 Connecticut
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    It is a great time to revisit, because they just moved Sorachi Ace to 6 packs (priced at $9.99). Best 6 pack of Saisons in that price range. I remember when it was $8 a 750ml bottle, which made it hard to purchase with so many similiar priced Saisons. It's a great saison, but not my favorite. now it's a steal at $9.99 a six. Similiar to founders Porter at $9.99. Hard not to have them in my fridge. Sorachi Ace goes great with a lot of chicken and fish dishes...
     
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  3. TongoRad

    TongoRad Grand Pooh-Bah (3,884) Jun 3, 2004 New Jersey
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    Ironically, I've been drinking it a lot more lately in the 750ml bottle. We have a small liquor store in town that carries it as one of their few 'fancy' bottles, so I'll just grab one if I'm not in the mood to go running around. Not only has it done the trick, but it's grown on me a lot. Still, that sixer deal would be a whole lot better. Thanks.
     
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  4. donspublic

    donspublic Grand Pooh-Bah (3,552) Aug 4, 2014 Texas
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    Ok those haven't made it to Texas yet. They are still selling it only in 750 and 4packs here. I would love it if it came in 6 packs. This beer was one of the first Saisons I had and made me love the style and the Hop. I always have some of these lurking in my fridge.
    @Urk1127 are you sure it isn't the Sorachi Ace hop that made you not like it at the time. That is a love it or hate it hop.
     
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  5. bluejacket74

    bluejacket74 Grand Pooh-Bah (5,305) Jul 4, 2005 Ohio
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    Earlier today I finished a bottle of Stone's Enjoy After 07.04.16. I know it's not technically a saison (Stone calls it a Brett IPA), but when I was drinking it, it seemed saison/farmhouse-ale like to me. I noted that in my review, too. And since it comes in a 750 ml bottle, if you can get an aged bottle (or maybe one close to the Enjoy After date) it might be worth trying along with the other traditional saisons.
     
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  6. Urk1127

    Urk1127 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,790) Jul 2, 2014 New Jersey
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    @TongoRad

    As far as i know, it was more of a very astringent flavor maybe i drank it too cold not knowing how to appreciate the style. I'd love to revisit my store has bombers so some time soon in the next few weeks. Off topic the only hop i don't like is lemondrop so if sorachi is simlar to lemongrass im negative toward that flavor but regardless, saison is now a favorite style so it must get a revisit.
     
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  7. HorseheadsHophead

    HorseheadsHophead Grand Pooh-Bah (3,732) Sep 15, 2014 Colorado
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    I think they already are. Most breweries I see nowadays have a saison in their lineup. Even Stone made one. Dry-hopped ones are especially popularly, of course.

    Oh, and Allagash Saison is dope. I got one at a bar for the first time a couple weeks ago and I had to order a second.
     
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  8. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    [​IMG]

    Brasserie a Vapeur - Saison de Pipaix

    I knew the odds were against me with picking this bottle up. This is when beer shopping feels a little like antiquing. There aren't a lot of bottles of this out there. I was going to include this one no matter what. There's too much quirky history here and it deserved a chance.

    The brewery building dates back to around 1890. It used to be the Biset-Cuvelier brewery. The recipe for Saison de Pipaix supposedly dates back to 1785. In 1895, the brewery was modernized and outfitted with a steam engine. In 1914, the occupying German military attempted to take the steam engine for its metal, but they failed to do this for whatever reason. Brasserie a Vapeur translates to steam brewery.

    Here's a video of some equipment in action:



    Around 1985, the brewery was purchased by history teacher Jean-Louis Dits who wanted to preserve it. He was tutored by Marc Rosier from Dupont.

    The importer, B. United claims that this is the only brewery in Europe that still uses steam powered equipment. I'm not sure if that's exactly true. Hook Norton's steam system dates back to the same era, but to be fair, I don't know if they really put it to much practical use anymore... but maybe I'm wrong. @herrburgess , I remember you posting a pic from a Franconian brewery that used long belts. Was that steam driven?

    Saison de Pipaix is known to have some iron in its taste. This used to come from the old brewing equipment, but today, the iron taste just comes from the water... and it's reportedly much more subtle now. It's considered one of the archetypes of the modern spiced saison. Black pepper, orange, ginger, star anise, and lichen are all used in the beer.

    So, how was my bottle? It gushed and gushed. (We're in sync @utopiajane ) I did manage to salvage some drinkable beer though. It was quite sour. I've had this beer before and I didn't remember it being this sour, so afterwards, I checked Phil Markowski's notes on the beer. He described it as having a "dryish sour backdrop" and also claimed that it had a lactic sourness especially when aged in the bottle over time. Both of these notions fit my beer. "Dryish sour" is a great fit, but in my case it was no longer a backdrop. It obscured all else. The spices were not detectable (but they also might be subtle in the fresh beer). I wasn't thinking of iron either, but I wasn't looking for it, and if I was, I don't know if I could recognize it. There was a woody quality that came through though. What was really surprising, was that the beer actually reminded me of Rodenbach. I still enjoyed this beer and found it quite drinkable despite the circumstances.

    Check out how beautiful that bottle shape is... with that skinny neck. Any attractiveness of the bottle was quickly subverted by the nasty sludge that was under the bottle cap. It's the beer equivalent of looking at the dirty critters under a pretty rock.
     
    #148 zid, Jul 10, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2016
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  9. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    Regarding Sorachi Ace, I've had bad luck with this beer. First time I had it, I suspected dirty lines. Second time I had it, it had a very unpleasant chalkiness. I've also gotten the same chalkiness in bottles of Brooklyn's 1/2 Ale. Given the respect this beer gets, I'll have to give it another shot. Third time's a charm.
     
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  10. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    Yeah, it is. I think it deserves more attention.
     
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  11. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    That's a fantastic thought. Did you find the beer to be dry? If so, would you guess that it was inherently dry, or would you guess that the brett dried it out?
     
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  12. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    [​IMG]

    Brasserie Artisanale de Rulles - Estivale

    This beer is listed here as a Belgian Pale Ale and not a saison. The line between these groups will be quite fuzzy and it's a brave person that tries to keep these things cut and dry. I thought it was good to include this particular beer in the thread. It's worth noting that Rulles has a different beer that they call a saison. At 5.2%, Estivale is considered the low ABV beer in the group.

    Rulles was started by Gregory Verhelst in 1998. Their beers are known for being dry and bitter. The yeast Gregory uses is from Orval. The brewery uses shallow open fermentation vessels.

    [​IMG]

    The brewery's mascot is named Marcel. Marcel and the bottle labels are drawn by the artist Palix.

    [​IMG]

    On this site, Belgium is naturally associated with beer, but cartooning and comics have been a major component of Belgian culture. Many Belgian beers have labels that reflect this part of their culture.

    Despite the head in the pic, the carbonation in this beer was very low. I don't automatically dislike low carbonation in the beers I drink (including saisons, despite the modern idea that a saison needs to be highly carbonated), but in this particular case the beer was just too still. It's a very dry beer. There's a bitter finish and it's very, very earthy. There's a strong green apple/fruity quality that sits on top of that.
     
  13. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    [​IMG]

    Mystic Saison

    I knew in my gut this was a bad bottle. I don't know if Mystic even makes this beer anymore. I've had previous bad fortune at the store where I grabbed this.

    The beer was badly oxidized. It was quite sweet in comparison to the other beers in the thread. I think this was a result of the age. It even tasted hot. If I ever say a beer has an apple quality, that's usually a good thing. If I say it has an apple juice quality, that's usually a bad thing. This was the latter. This bottle was a poor representation of Mystic.
     
  14. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    [​IMG]

    Mystic Saison Renaud

    This beer keeps things simple in order to showcase Renaud - the brewers' yeast. It's pils malt and Saaz hops - a wonderful combination for a pilsner :wink:, but in this case, Renaud crashes the party. There's a clarity to this beer that's striking compared to others in the thread. It's quite spicy and very peppery. At times, some fruitiness and lemon comes through. A great beer and a much better example of what the brewery is capable of.

    @bleakies , so regarding the Mystic beers with the old labels, I'd say thumbs up to 2 out of 3. The two good ones were kept refrigerated in the store, the one bad one wasn't.
     
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  15. Jacobier10

    Jacobier10 Grand Pooh-Bah (3,102) Feb 23, 2004 New Jersey
    Pooh-Bah

    I was able to pick up a bottle of Mystic Table Beer on a trip to Massachusetts a few weeks ago. Tried it the other night for the first time.

    [​IMG]

    Had a glass of wine with dinner before opening this up, so into the oversized wine glass it went. Different label on my bottle but I believe it's the same beer. My photo makes the beer look much darker than it actually was, though it still seemed a shade darker than your photo. Whereas a lot of saisons have a spicy quality to them, this was more mellow and earthy. Great balance between the malt, hops, and yeast. Very dry finish which kept me coming back for more. Just like you, this disappeared way too fast from my glass. This beer is welcome to my dinner table anytime. Excellent!
     
    #155 Jacobier10, Jul 10, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2016
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  16. Spindletop

    Spindletop Zealot (559) Jun 4, 2003 Massachusetts

    The last time I had Pipaix I recall really enjoying it. No gushing, and the flavor was similar to the standard Fantome saison, which makes sense as Dany Prignon supposedly learned to brew from the Vapeur guy.

    It's been years since I saw Pipaix on a shelf though. Is it even being brewed anymore?
     
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  17. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    I haven't seen it in years either. My last experience wasn't as extreme as this one, but I do seem to recall it being a bit of an oddball. I think this last bottle was a victim of its age.
     
  18. bleakies

    bleakies Maven (1,355) Apr 11, 2011 Massachusetts

    I'm a bit surprised they or (2 of 3) held up so well; I didn't notice when the brewer began using the new labels but I don't think I've seen the old ones for six months, at least. Glad you liked 2/3 though. That Renaud's one of my favorites from Mystic.

    (And here's to hoping the Paquettes get back into the swing on a regular basis. I ran through the last of my Jack D'Or a long time ago and just have a few of their big stouts and a single bottle of the barleywine tucked away.)
     
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  19. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    Do you know what the size of that bottle was?
     
  20. zid

    zid Grand Pooh-Bah (3,132) Feb 15, 2010 New York
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    I'm in the same boat. I have one Fumapapa that I'll open later this year and one Our Finest Regards that I'll keep shut for a long time.
     
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