German craft beer

Um.......wouldn't a "return to normality" for pilsner mean ~40 IBUs and 4.4 abv.?

 

German "craft" may be remaking the bottom and the "norm" in its own image.

 

Permit me to offer a suggestion here. There is vitriol exhibited towards German "craft beer" since it is not traditional. I doubt that there is more to this than that.

Cheers!

 

It's not a dislike for this new craft scene as much as it's a dislike for how it may kick the ages old beer culture, and its beers, to the curb and be lost to history.

 

I don't get it either.I think Regular Beer and craft Beer can coexist very well together.

 

Well this "hate" is easily understandable when you look at the Pils example, isn't it? It's not towards the bigger or established breweries now making "craft" like Riegele, Schneider and so on, or also not about breweries that do a good job with their modern ales like Crew Republic and Camba.
No. The "hate" is because there is a general arrogance in the scene itself in which traditional beers (see the Augustiner and Kölsch hate in the german craft beer facebook group) are dismissed, while many (not all!) new german craft bewers demonstrate that they can not get a Pils right at all,yet still charge 3-4 times the money of non craft pilsners for their sour, borderline undrinkable mess.

As I have said now and will say again: Though I can not speak for others, I myself really like and enjoy the aviability of locally made ales and such. I consider it a GOOD thing. What I dislike is the arrogance in the scene, the crappy lagers they more often than not make, the lack of real diversity(for the most part). For me, it has nothing to do with "tradition", that's a very loose term anyways and beer styles are evolving all the time and always have.

 

This doesn't sound like a kick to the curb at all.

The thing is, it's happening -- it happened in England with Real Ale. Sure, there are still good beers to be had, but look at the decline of the pub. I spent an evening in Munich drinking beer with 3 or 4 UK youngsters who needed to convince me that Real Ale was their father's or grandfather's beer -- and it was all perception, not a true perspective on whether the beer was good or bad. They were too interested in higher ABV beer that got them buzzed quicker (admittedly, as was I when I was 22).

So I see that force of youth in Germany attempting to embrace "new" as "better," when that's not necessarily solid fact -- and yeah, the same over here.

 

I don't follow the German Craft Facebook groups, but I don't know if I'd trust anyone who didn't like Augustiner. The weiss...okay, I'll give you that one, but nothing else is less than excellent.

 

Hmm, is this a Northern German vs. Southern German thing?

I am personally a fan of Augustiner beer but the dynamics of people from German region A vs. German region B is something I have limited understanding of.

Cheers!

 

When I lived in Bamberg, some students from Northern Germany tended to look down on Franconian beer as being too sweet somehow. Similarly, I had someone from Munich at our Kellerbier launch over the weekend, and he said he found the beer a little wuerzig for his tastes. Very regional preferences in Germany indeed....

EDIT - anyone who cannot appreciate Augustiner and the true craft behind it is no lover of beer IMO.

 

Agreed. I recall someone on this forum posting that they didn't, or couldn't, finish an Augustiner because it wasn't "interesting." Sorry, and no offense, but this is absurd. It's like turning down a draft hefeweizen at the Weisses Brauhaus or a fresh cask pint in the UK.

When I am in these places (or even Berlin) and can drink these beers, would I choose a german craft beer or American IPA? For my taste - no thanks.

 

Since a good friend moved too Berlin a few years ago, I try to visit regularly. Since then at least, Augustiner and to a bit lesser degree Tegernseer are as common in Spätis (the very common small shops lots of people get their beers in esp. late at night) as Schultheiss Pilsner or Sternburg Export. And also at some alternative nightclubs, you are likely to find Augustiner. But I'd say that the "love" for a proper Helles from the normal crowd was there before IPAs hit the scene. It is kind of a different market, yes,with some overlap. Meaning, you'll see IPAs in the spätis around Boxhagener Platz, you may even see them in one or two nightclubs, but don't expect every Späti to carry an IPA.

I tend to agree there. But I feel I need to add something: Every lover of beer should RESPECT Augustiner, or a well made Helles in general, for what it is and what stands behind it. But it does still not have to be to everyone's taste. I mean, I, for instance, would consider myself a wine lover as well. I respect fat, southern european or new world red wines. They are just not to my taste usually and I'd prefer something white, lighter and more accdic and more elegant, but I respect them for what they are and what stands behind them as a culture. And I feel that attitude is needed in beer culture as well- a respect for different cultures, even if they do not resemble the individual taste.

Wasn't this "someone" a certain Greg Koch, and wasn't it the Salzburg Augustiner he did not finish?

 

Glad you said it...

Nonetheless, Augustiner Salzburg is in the same league as Augustiner Munich; very good, well-brewed beer.

 

I believe he said it about *both* Augustiners (even mistakenly implying a shared ownership between the two). And I agree you don't have to be a huge fan of it to appreciate the true craft behind it. But to sum up your thoughts with anecdotes about it being uninteresting and unfinishable typifies the type of arrogance and lack of understanding that comprise the very worst aspects of the US-centric "craft" movement.

 

ok, all the time i resisted the temptation, but I CAN NOT ANY LONGER: Isn't this kind of behaviour the same as saying "THIS ALE HAST TOO MUCH FLAVOUR I CAN'T FINISH IT, IT IS DISGUSTING"..making the US-centric "craft" movement, on an abstract level, equal to BMC-drinkers, just from the other extreme and while being very proud and arrogant about it......?