Darklord Day 2017

Yeah, no. The groups regulate the crowds coming to pick up bottles. They used to do things without group slots. Suffice to say, it didn't work, so they made three group slots, then added 2 more when that became unmanageable. Without groups, bottle pickup was the never ending line from hell.

You know what really sucks? Wanting to leave the fest and waiting in a long-ass line while everyone picks up bottles and gets wristbands cut. This also (as pointed out above) leads people to just grab their bottles and go instead of hitting up guest taps, food stations, etc.

The group system solves a problem FFF had with 6+ hour lines for bottle pickup. FCFS on the variants gives incentives to pick up bottles earlier so you don't have a huge EOD rush. The best changes they made were getting rid of the cash transactions and scratch offs at point of sale. Both were major choke points.

Actual improvements to the fest:
-better crowd control on guest taps
-more food stations to prevent clogging at those lines... or walk the line for orders like they do at Portillo's drive through or something...

 

You mean a cluster of a line like this year's group A that went so unbelievably fast they started letting group B and C'ers in because they were bored of having no line?

 

If groups were not assigned and everyone was still guaranteed a BA variant, can you imagine when people would start lining up to get a vanilla variant??!

 

Actually, the the groups did very little to regulate the flow. They put in the groups because it was not manageable, then they expanded to 5 groups because it wasn't manageable, and after 2-3 years of that still being unmanageable, they figured out the groups weren't really helping either. So what did they do? They improved efficiencies to speed up the lines. Lines went very quickly this year because they staffed the lines correct and implemented smarter controls- got rid of golden ticket, everyone gets a variant, tear off and punch of cards as you get allocation, different lines for each variant, etc.

 

This is absolute worst thing they could do, would create a giant cluster fuck and makes no business sense what so ever.

 

I dont know, I was Group A and I went through pretty fast. I think the slow line was to get into the fest itself, not necessarily through the actual group line.

 

The Group A line "went so fast" because a bunch of Group A was still stuck trying to get into the fest. I would imagine that was an outlier, as these lines go.

He's saying the same.

 

Meh, lines were manageable at 5 groups. I agree, though, that removing the decision points (cash, scratch off) are probably what sped up the lines the most.

I do think the groups do a good job of presorting. Honestly, the FCFS thing really only changes the equation on variants. Those who are willing to camp out the longest (or cut their way to the front) get dibs on the choice variants. As opposed to now, where you have a semi-lottery system with choosing your group.

I get it. FCFS on bottle benefits the dedicated beer nerd, gets you thems tasty whalez, etc.. It sucks to get shut out on something due to random factors. And given the speed of the lines now, it may not be the line that never ends. I'm not convinced it'd make for a better experience for the festival as a whole. It'd certainly improve the experience of the people in it for the whalez.

 

I added an additional comment for clarification. Yes, line into fest from north side went slower versus south, which created delays for people with group A tickets entering from the north.

 

No, I get it, what I'm saying is that House was being sarcastic; you guys are both agreeing that the bottle sales lines were fast.

They certainly need to figure out entry lines this year, though.

 

Now this is something they need to fix. Unfortunately, probably the only way to fix it is with additional gates, because you can only scan/bag check so fast. And there doesn't appear to be space for more gates.

 

Ahhh, ../ yes, sarcasm doesn't come across quite as easily over a keyboard as it does in person.

The disparity in speed of the lines (north vs. south) going through into the fest was a bit confusing. Curious if it was due to personel or if the south line was instructed to move faster, knowing there should be more people lined up on that end.

 

Which part was taken for sarcasm? Wasn't my intent. FFF gets their share of the vouchers whether people spend them or not and clearing out crowds makes for a more enjoyable fest. I'd gladly take a 2nd tier variant for less lines and crowds during the fest part of the fest.

 

I think some of the entry line speed issues are people not knowing where they are supposed to be. For example, generally the north line is supposed to be for group a and the south line for groups b-e. The idea behind this was that the north line would funnel directly into the bottle sales line for group a. The problem is when people dont actually follow those rules, so you have to stop and explain to people with E group that no they cannot move directly into the group a bottle line, arguements happen because people don't want to give up their spots, etc. Some of my friends in A have consistently gotten into the festival faster in the south line.

 

Or go to 2 12oz variants instead of one 750ml. Everyone gets a 12oz vanilla and you choose your 2nd bottle from the others 2nd tier ones.

 

FCFS sounds awful. It's a giant clusterfuck of a line with people funneled towards the brewery from both entrances, people will probably get there on Thursday to try to get a Handjee, then you probably get a mass of people trying to leave the line as soon as the Vanilla is gone and fucking everything up. Result is a lot of people wasting several hours to still get their 4th choice.

Last year went fine outside of what I heard about the north entrance (I went south). Just try to clean that up and don't get cute unless you do random variants.

 

Narthax answered this below, but the issue in my opinion is that Group B-E people came to the fest before it opened, didn't know they should go through the South entrance, and weren't properly vetted by the North staff. Basically the majority of people went through the North, when they should've be made to go through the south. If they're going to start Group B bottle sales early, they have to make sure they've gotten the Group A people in beforehand (at least those who are on time).

"You mean a cluster of a line like this year's group A that went so unbelievably fast they started letting group B and C'ers in because they were bored of having no line?"

I'm assuming you meant the "cluster" part as sarcasm, since you're obviously agreeing with Eifster that the Group A line moved quickly.

Yeah, this needs to be fixed. Not in Group A, but you here before Group A sales have finished? You have to go south. Have someone at the end of the line checking tickets when people arrive. It's ridiculous that Group A people could arrive early, get in hours late, and miss out on variants because non-Group A people clogged the entry line.

 

Except that's not actually what happened.

They were shuffling everyone through because the weather was a dumpster fire and everyone (including them) wanted to go home.

 

"Everyone gets a vanilla" should really be a priority going forward. I understand that that's a little idealistic, but literally 95% of people given the option will take vanilla, so why not just make more of it, if you're already making enough BA stuff for everyone? I'm not saying make ALL vanilla (since 1) the other variants are fun and 2) there will be people who don't want vanilla), but I'd say making at least 50% vanilla would make sense. Limit one bottle per person, and you'd have the majority of the attendees pretty happy, regardless of what time they get there.

You'd also probably cut down on lines, because the entire country wouldn't get to the park at 9am, since what's the rush?

 

Exactly. They simply need to clean up the queuing. Last year would have been perfect, as far as the bottle line goes, if they had implemented it properly.

There should be a giant sign that says: GROUP A LINE ONLY. IF IN GROUP B-E, KEEP WALKING.

Such signs need to be clearly posted at entrance points both at the entrance of industrial parkway and as you get closer to FFF.

If anyone is found without a Group A ticket trying to enter in the Group A line, to the back of the B-E line with you!

The group A line gets directly into the bottle line first, like last year. Except only the group A line may get in the bottle line first, until the Group A line is empty.

People arriving late and running down the Group A line at 11AM or whatever are simply allowed to enter the fest like anyone else getting there late...and can enter the bottle line whenever like anyone else whose time slot has arrived, without any special treatment.

I'm guessing it's simply more difficult and cumbersome.

A local brewery by me made a vanilla IPA that sounded gross to some, but tasted divine. The first batch they did was fucking unbelievable. They hand cut the vanilla beans and so on and so forth--did everything very meticulously and made sure it was all fresh. In order to ramp up production, my local brewery used a "different" process (obviously less difficult and more "streamlined," to say the least). This resulted in a still tasty, but lower quality treat.

I'm guessing FFF goes through a similar painstaking process...because of the depth of flavor that comes out of MHJ. If not, oh well, then I guess they are intentionally limiting production, but at least it isn't as severe and ridiculous as the manufactured rarity of Assassin and KBBS.