The "Fake" Expert.

Discussion in 'Beer Talk' started by fox227, Mar 14, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Page 1 of 5
  1. fox227

    fox227 Initiate (0) Nov 19, 2010 California

    One of the most annoying types is the 'know it all." However, the "fake" know it all is the worst. Often times a 'know it all' is really a passionate individual who studies his subject on a constant basis, and is a seeker of knowledge. He may get to the point that he'd find it silly to be challenged in his field of expertise. I recently talked to a "fake" expert (in everything) and I enjoyed asking him questions about subjects that I have ignorance of, such as wine and spirits. I want to learn. But when we started talking about beer, the tide started to turn.

    At some point I mentioned that Beer Advocate is an excellent resource, especially for people starting out, in considering what beers to seek out. He gave me the inane, "I'll decide for myself, and no one can be valid in telling me what to buy, for my own taste is law!" or something to that effect. We discussed Hoppy beers, and he recommended to me a beer that wasn't available in my area, and feigned surprise that I couldn't find it (it doesn't exist here) and suggested that I seek out an actual craft beer store (!).

    Getting back to the, 'I don't trust anyone's reviews' mode, he mentioned how I liked Duvel, but he thought it was awful, therefore, tastes must be completely relative to each individual. I got back on the subject of hoppy beers specifically. I stated, "let's consider a scenario: a person who is an upstart in craft beer appreciation enters a beer store, and wants to select an IPA. There could be around a hundred choices for him. Should he be completely blind in his selection? If he entered a store in Southern California, he may come across Pliny The Elder, Sculpin, Alpine Nelson, Alpine Duet, Avery Maharaja, Blind Pig, and so on. But with no frame of reference (such as Beer Advocate), he must blindly choose from the nearly one hundred other choices." "How long would it take before he found the best IPAs, and how much money wasted?"
     
    #1 fox227, Mar 14, 2012
  2. Keith238

    Keith238 Initiate (0) Jul 31, 2007 New Jersey

    Sounds more like an arrogant d-bag than a "fake" expert.
     
    #2 Keith238, Mar 14, 2012
    Lantern, Tony412, DanK4 and 1 other person like this.
  3. yamar68

    yamar68 Initiate (0) Apr 1, 2011 Minnesota

    I agree with most everything that you're saying. But, that said, remember that there was a time before BeerAdvocate and other online resources. The people that work at a good bottle shop are often the best resource.
     
    #3 yamar68, Mar 14, 2012
  4. tewaris

    tewaris Initiate (0) Jul 14, 2009 Minnesota

    I do not mean it as an offense to anyone but I would be happy ordering beer online, and would take BA any day over liquor store staff.

    Edit: OP, drink a beer and chill bro.
     
    #4 tewaris, Mar 14, 2012
    gkatsoris and BeerKangaroo like this.
  5. yamar68

    yamar68 Initiate (0) Apr 1, 2011 Minnesota

    Yeah I hear that. All I'm trying to say is that there are plenty of other resources out there - not that I am siding at all with said "d-bag," that guy sounds like a total tool box. :slight_smile:
     
    #5 yamar68, Mar 14, 2012
    BeerKangaroo likes this.
  6. fox227

    fox227 Initiate (0) Nov 19, 2010 California

    Did my post stink of poor spirit? I hope not, as that wasn't the intention. It was meant merely as a refutation of "don't trust reviews" types out there. I've had three tonight. I'm good. :slight_smile: I owe a lot of my knowledge of films, music, art, to those that bothered to study and champion them so that I wouldn't have to do as much leg work. I think that it's the same with beer. Want to find the best IPA, Stout, Quad, whatever? Follow your tastes, but listening to those far more experienced than me (or yourself) usually proves to be useful.
     
    #6 fox227, Mar 14, 2012
  7. LaneMeyer

    LaneMeyer Initiate (0) Mar 20, 2011 California

    I'm a little confused as to what makes him a "fake" expert. Is it because he doesn't subscribe to BA and chooses to make his own decisions about which beers to try and what he likes and doesn't like?
     
    #7 LaneMeyer, Mar 14, 2012
    rocdoc1 likes this.
  8. RCL

    RCL Initiate (0) Jul 23, 2008 Massachusetts

    Thinks Duvel is "awful": all credibility destroyed.
     
    #8 RCL, Mar 14, 2012
    Lantern, AnchorBaby, woosterbill and 4 others like this.
  9. ChadQuest

    ChadQuest Initiate (0) Mar 4, 2009 Illinois

    This.
     
    #9 ChadQuest, Mar 14, 2012
  10. Crazyale

    Crazyale Initiate (0) Feb 1, 2012 Virginia

    This. Even if I didn't like Duvel, anyone that knew what they were talking about would at least acknowledge its stature and not just casually write it off like that.
     
    #10 Crazyale, Mar 14, 2012
    Lantern and TongoRad like this.
  11. derkfromwi

    derkfromwi Initiate (0) Apr 29, 2011 Wisconsin


    Too long of a post this late at night (central time). :wink: Anyways... tastes are relative, lots of choices in CA and many reasons to trade with those in CA.
    Peace,
    Derk
     
    #11 derkfromwi, Mar 14, 2012
  12. stupac2

    stupac2 Pooh-Bah (2,031) Feb 22, 2011 California
    Pooh-Bah

    I'm really confused as to the point of your story. First, someone might not like Duvel, what's wrong with that? Taste IS subjective. The way you phrased that made you sound more like the "fake expert". Second, tons of people say not to trust reviews except for those from people with similar palates. I find tons of beers that are highly rated that I hate (cough DL cough).

    Maybe this conversation was more annoying for you (that makes me question why you didn't extricate yourself from it), but from this retelling it seems like you were just as obtuse as he was.
     
    #12 stupac2, Mar 14, 2012
    gkatsoris likes this.
  13. fox227

    fox227 Initiate (0) Nov 19, 2010 California

    I never said that it was "wrong" to not like Duvel. I was offering it as his "proof" that tastes differ. So I broached the subject of similar tastes: hoppy beers, to reach an agreement. Should one not consult experts in the field of hoppy beers in order to find the best ones, or go in with no knowledge and trust pure chance as the deciding factor? The context of the conversation is irrelevant (I was captive - you know how some social situations are.)
     
    #13 fox227, Mar 14, 2012
  14. stupac2

    stupac2 Pooh-Bah (2,031) Feb 22, 2011 California
    Pooh-Bah

    I have relatively little problem getting out of a conversation I don't want to be in. "Oh hey look at that, I need to take a piss."

    Regardless, if someone wants to just drink whatever they find, who cares? That's how I found hoppy beers, just randomly picking stuff that looked neat at BevMo. Maybe you'll find what you like faster without that, but I don't think it matters. For one, as you get to know a style tastes evolve (I used to love 90 Min, thought it was better than Pliny. Now I think it's an order of magnitude worse). So you'll probably go back and revisit things anyway. And even if you start with the best, you'll go and try the local stuff looking for gems anyway. So it might not save you time OR money.

    I dunno, I just don't really see why this conversation merited a post on BA. My main reaction was "cool story, bro".
     
    #14 stupac2, Mar 14, 2012
  15. fox227

    fox227 Initiate (0) Nov 19, 2010 California

    To decide with knowledge or without knowledge? How can one be an expert in any field without learning in a productive manner - namely by consulting established experts? Good luck in trying every IPA available out there and finding the best ones, and so much money wasted. He's a fake expert in precisely the fact that he's never even heard of these top beers, because he refuses to accept the *good* opinions of others.
     
    #15 fox227, Mar 14, 2012
  16. fox227

    fox227 Initiate (0) Nov 19, 2010 California

    Maybe I'll stick with posting the "what's everyone's favorite of this style," or "beer vs beer" threads. The point is fairly simple, even if you refuse to concede that.
     
    #16 fox227, Mar 14, 2012
  17. yemenmocha

    yemenmocha Grand Pooh-Bah (4,116) Jun 18, 2002 Arizona
    Pooh-Bah

    Self-styled connoisseurs are nothing new.
     
    #17 yemenmocha, Mar 14, 2012
  18. LaneMeyer

    LaneMeyer Initiate (0) Mar 20, 2011 California

    I don't think BA exactly qualifies as an "established expert." It's just a collective of beer drinkers with different tastes, opinions, ideas. There is a wealth of info here, but it's the authority over which beers to like.
     
    #18 LaneMeyer, Mar 14, 2012
  19. stupac2

    stupac2 Pooh-Bah (2,031) Feb 22, 2011 California
    Pooh-Bah

    Uhh, so in one sentence what it is?
     
    #19 stupac2, Mar 14, 2012
  20. JdoubleA

    JdoubleA Pundit (903) Apr 27, 2011 North Carolina

    -Sometimes "blind" buying can be fun, and educational. You don't have expectations or influences... it's all a mystery. "Ooooh, what's in here?" Maybe you'll get surprised, or maybe you'll end up with Depot Street Roundabout Rye or Port City Monumental IPA and in the process learn about beer disasters. It's kinda like Christmas presents from people you kinda know. "WHOA!!!!!! the new hendrix winterland box set!?" or "a jook university plushy devil??"

    -Overall though, I agree that dude sounds baggy and reviews do provide help.
     
    #20 JdoubleA, Mar 14, 2012
Page 1 of 5
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.