Longest you've kept Saison in primary?

Nah, you're fine! 2 months is ok.

 

3724 can definitely be slow. I firmly believe that the vast majority of "stuck" reports are really just slow. Two readings a few days apart are needed to diagnose "stuck." Anyway, another week or two in primary probably isn't going to be a major problem.

But even for 3724, a gravity that high after 5 weeks is a little unusual but not unheard of. So I have to ask... you didn't recently switch to a (uncorrected) refractometer from a hydrometer, did you?

 

I personally have stopped using 3724 because of its reputation (e.g., stuck fermentation) and I personally prefer to not have my beers in the primary more than 3 weeks.

Hopefully your beer will reach it's final gravity in another week or so.

There are other yeast strains that produce flavorful Saisons and do not take 3+ weeks to complete primary fermentation. There is another ongoing/recent thread on this topic:

https://www.beeradvocate.com/community/threads/saison-yeasts.617009/

Cheers!

 

I left a saison with 3724 in the primary for 8-9 weeks once. It was pretty early on in my brewing days and first saison. It turned out fine though. Sometimes you need to be patient with that one. I think consistent temperatures help prevent stalling too, not much fluctuations.

 

I suggest that you simply wait a bit more before doing anything else besides trying to keep the beer warm and at a consistent temperature. I suspect this infamously finicky yeast will eventually reward you.

If that doesn't work, though, I recommend dosing the beer with another Saison yeast. I'd probably go for the Belle Saison yeast. It has less character than the one you started with, but likely much of that character is already developed. I recommend a Saison yeast becase one of the main characteristics of a Saison is the low finishing gravity. I'd add more yeast by pitching the yeast into starter and when at high krausen pitch into the beer.

Cheers!

 

I have kept Saisons in primary for a year or so with just S. cerevisiae. It turned out fine, I just sort of brewed it and let it sit while I worked on other beers. I don't think an extended time in primary is going to hurt you too much, if at all, unless you have some sort of delicate flavors or aromatics you are trying to preserve.

 

This is a bit off-topic, but this is a prime example of how our findings in this recent preprint ( https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/654681v1 ) can explain some of the scenarios homebrewers encounter with saison strains (a separate thread about it here: https://www.beeradvocate.com/commun...-mysteries-of-diastatic-brewing-yeast.615790/). The main finding in our study was that many saison strains (i.e. those with the STA1 gene) have a deletion in the promoter of the STA1 gene. In simple words, many strains with the STA1 gene have a mutation that decreases the amount of enzyme produced.

We haven't tested WY3724, but based on everyone's experiences with it (i.e. it easily gets stuck, doesn't superattenuate) we can assume that this is a strain with a deletion in the STA1 promoter. Another finding in the study, was that the saison strains (i.e. those that belong to the Beer2 clade) use the STA1 glucoamylase as the main mechanism for maltotriose use, and having the deletion in the promoter significantly decreases production of this glucoamylase and hence maltotriose use.

In practice, this means that when people use this strain and fermentation seems stuck, you most likely are in a situation where the yeast has consumed all the maltose and glucose from the wort and most of the maltotriose remains (this is usually around 1.018-1.024 in a 1.060 wort). The STA1 enzyme is still produced at very low levels in strains with the deletion, so with time the yeast might consume most of the maltotriose. The main factor that encourages production of the STA1 enzyme in strains with the deletion is oxygen, but that of course has a negative effect on flavour (so use at your own risk). Adding another yeast might not work, since the wort contains almost exclusively the complex malt sugars.

 

This is pretty fascinating and actually could have some cool implications for Brett addition timings. Research on Brett is pretty sparse, as far as I know, but...

[Some strains of] Brett have been researched and shown to have the capacity to ferment maltotriose and other longer chain polysaccharides. If we are assuming that stuck fermentation indicates that maltose and glucose are more/less absent from the wort and all that are the 3+ polysaccharides, then it opens a perfect window to when to pitch Brett while retaining the majority of the S. cerevisiae flavor profile.

Typically you co-pitch or wait for primary to 'finish' - but if you can pitch when the Saison strain is stuck you not only save time but it also allows you to skip secondary. This is sort of a loose brain dump, but could be interesting to try the next time I brew a Brett Saison.

(also is your lab looking for RAs? because plshireme)

 

I've let beer sit on yeast for over a year too...in bottles.

 

FWIW that is the decision I made. There are other Saison yeast strains that produce tasty Saison beers and are not fussy like 3724.

Cheers!

 

I used 3726 a couple of years ago. The positives were:

• Completed primary fermentation in a timely fashion
• It produced a nice/good beer

The negative (for me) was it produced a banana flavor and while I enjoy this flavor in Abbey/Trappist type beers I do not enjoy banana in Saisons.

Please report back what you think about your 3726 Saison beer.

Cheers!

 

I think I have gotten a little more bubblegum than banana, myself. I know that may be a turnoff for many but I like the balance of the beers I have made with this strain (actually, the Imperial variant). Always comes down to preference.

 

My favorite “rustic” farmhouse ale combo is WY3724 + WLP644 50%/50%. Dries out really nice too, 1-2 weeks from OG to FG, never have had an issue.

 

C&P'd from an older post, here are what I consider to be the keys to foolproof success with 3724:

- Make an appropriate starter, targeting at least 0.75M cells/ml/°P. Do not follow the dumbed-down, generic instructions on the pack.
- Use a nutrient blend in the boil.
- Oxygenate the wort with pure O2.
- Use fermentation temperature control. It doesn't have to be particularly warm (anything above about 68F will work), but I suspect some peoples' problems have occurred due to a drop in temp. You can increase temp to finish fermentation if you are in a hurry, but it's not really necessary.

3724 is typically (not always) slower than most other strains. But with the above process, I have had zero stuck fermentations. My recommendation: If you prefer saisons made with 3724 over the other strains, don't compromise. No other strain or combination of strains is going to make the same beer.