Darkening Beers Through Extended Boiling

This discussion is driving me a little crazy. So to be clear, here is my advice:

Measure the pH at the beginning and end of the boil. As always, cool your sample to room temperature before measuring. (As an aside, the pH should drop a little during the boil.)

If you find that there is room to increase the boil pH without elevating it to a level that will be detrimental for the beer, then do so.

If not, don't.

I am emphatically not advising increasing the pH if that would push it beyond a reasonable range.

In the future when I advise tweaking a variable, I will try to be more explicit that the variable should only be changed within reasonable limits.

 

Do you have a reference (e.g., a link) which quantifies the amount of pH drop that occurs over a 60 minute boil? Will this amount of pH drop be a constant for all occasions or will it vary based upon conditions (e.g., OG of the wort, composition of sugars of the wort, etc.)?

Cheers!

@utahbeerdude

 

I'm basing this claim solely on a description of pH in brewing written by Kai Troester. Here's the passage I was thinking of:

During boiling the pH drops by about 0.1 – 0.2 pH units from 5.3 – 5.5 pH to about 5.2 – 5.3 pH. This may be due to the addition of bitter acids from the hops, formation of acidic Maillard products, precipitation of alkaline phosphates or the reaction of polypeptides with calcium, liberating protons [Briggs, 2004].

It looks as though this is what he is citing:

Dennis E. Briggs, Chris A. Boulton, Peter A. Brookes, Roger Stevens, Brewing Science and Practice, Published by Woodhead Publishing, 2004

That's all I've got.

 

Hey y'all, I said boil, not mash. I also said to a point.

Mash low, pickling lime could raise the pH with minimal flavor impact. Acid after the boil to get pH back down. Adjust the fermented beer with acid to make it crisper if need be. Phosphoric acid works well for this.

Malliard reactions work better at higher pH.

We're homebrewers not constrained by the RHG, the OP was asking how to get his beer darker. He could just add some Sinimar if he doesn't want to fuss around.

 

Sinamar would definitely do the trick, but it would give the beer a distinct flavor that should not be there. Carabohemian would also do the trick, but even at 1% it is a strong flavor. Each way is worth a try to see how they are perceived in the final product. Of course if one is doing a Czech Pils the hops will cover the sinamar taste up when used in the small amounts that would achieve the color of Pilsner Urquell.

 

If you want to add off flavors, scorching even a little bit of grain will do that. Don't ask how I know.

Edit - I have seen decoction vessels in Germany. They have motorised arms that drag chains over the kettle bottom to prevent scorching.

 

They malt the barley to their own specs, which would drive the malt's Lovibond to whatever they want.

 

@OldBrewer have you considered contacting the brewery directly?
They might give an extremely guarded response or no response at all. But maybe you’ll luck out and they’ll suggest suitable substitution/s for your missing link/s.

 

Or perhaps he could brew a clone via the recipe that Chris Colby published in BYO:

https://byo.com/recipe/pilsner-urquell-clone/

Or maybe not since this clone recipe includes non-Pilsner malts which may cause him to have sleepless nights.

Cheers!

 

Some homebrewers state: “recipes are a dime a dozen. It is the brewer, and their brewing skills that make the beer."

I am reminded of an old vaudeville joke:

How do you get to Carnegie Hall?

Practice, practice, practice!

Cheers!

 

PU is too burnt orange/brown to just be malt. It's HSA in some form for sure. I heard a rumor they basically pull a large decoction, bring that to a boil, then keep that at a boil during all mash time, pulling some out of it to raise the main mash steps.

 

Kilning is how Vienna and Munich malts, for example, get their color. So, yes it theoretically could. (For that matter, kilning is how all malts except roasted malts get their color.)