Just interested in what others are valuing this at. My friend posted an ISO for Wooden Hell offering the entire 08-12 lineup. While I personally think that's a good offer, the limited number of people with bottles makes any trade for it extremely difficult. Hell, getting that person or two with an extra to see the thread is a challenge. What boggled me though, was as a backup, he offered the 2008 Perfect Storm for a Vanilla BA Dark Lord. 500 bottles highly rated release from 4 years ago for a recent release in the hundreds as well. Seems fair, no? Crickets though. I'm not the biggest fan of the 'what's my beer worth bro' threads (not that I haven't asked for similar info though), but I have to ask, has the perceived 'value' of this bottle decreased? This has been a long term white whale, and while the pub has trickled a few out recently, it's not as if this is anything short of near impossible to trade for. Have we reached a point where the long term revered beers play second fiddle to the next new shiny object?
Agreed and understood. I suppose I wasn't accounting for the limited number of people with VanillaBA Dark Lord. Oh well. I guess if anyone knows someone, help me help a friend out.
2008 is only for the completists. If it's part of a series, the value of all of them drops pretty significantly, and doubly so for a beer that can be ordered online by the case. (Not to mention the recent vintages haven't been particularly great. I hope it's not a faulty memory that makes the 2009 so much better than the 10/11)
I think that there's a few things to consider here... - Pelican has been leaking out 2008 Perfect Storm's on the rare occasion for the past couple years. If you're there at the right time then you're in luck. No real hoopla involved. This will never happen with Wooden Hell. I can't speak to the VB Dark Lord release specifically, but it sounds like getting a bottle at release is an epic saga unto itself. - As you said, the 2008 Perfect was released 4 years ago. Because there were so few bottles to begin with it's tough to be sure about the quality of said beer right now. There are very few current reviews for that particular vintage. However, stellar reviews continue to be doled out for both Wooden Hell and VB Dark Lord. - I don't really understand your last statement. Are you categorizing Perfect Storm as the "long term revered beer" and Wooden Hell/VB Dark Lord as "the next shiny object"? The former is essentially still in production while the latter two will either never be seen again (WH) or might only spring up in a lottery situation at a one-day brewery-only release (VB DL).
I can agree with a lot o this, but... The limited number of Pelican bottles released were brewery cellared, so bottle variation should largely be mitigated. Having had it recently, it's excellent. You can head to Pelican right now and try it on tap. Unless the 1/4bbl has blown already. I know the '12 went in a day. And camping over night in line on the coast in the winter to be one of the few people that got a bottle of '08 is a bit removed from just good timing. The thought that Three Floyds won't release VBA DL again... Well I don't believe it. And I certainly wasn't saying that WH isn't a revered brew. It's a legend. Much like the '08 MoaS is/was. I dunno. Not trying to dispute your opinion nor argue. Sorry for any lack of clarity on my part and I do much appreciate your input.
I haven't loved the '10 or '11 either to be honest. Its not just faulty recollection on your part. Still great beer, but missing that little something extra for my taste. Though it seems most disagree with us. The earlier iterations I still love. And though it's only my opinion, I think that the couple samplings I've had reflect a return to form for the '12.
- Regarding the quality of the PS 2008 right now.....while cellaring at the brewery is always preferred to some random dude's "cellar", that doesn't actually mean that its qualities have improved. Just look at the variation between fresh batches of Perfect Storm/MoaS. People prefer specific vintages of this beer for a reason. Not saying that it doesn't taste awesome, but we sort of have to take your word for it right now. Not everyone is as local to Pelican as they'd like to be....so rolling up to the bar for a full on vertical isn't an option for everybody. Obviously, you're biased because you're trying to trade it out and likely wouldn't want to downplay its quality....which is totally understandable. - Also, I never said that VB Dark Lord wouldn't be made again....just that the circumstances involved with getting a bottle is certainly not in everyone's favor. Imagine all of the people that show up to DL Day. I'd bet that most of them would love an opportunity at a bottle of VB DL. Curious....how deep was the line at Pelican with people trying to get a bottle of the 2008 specifically?
Think a good question would be how many people within a reasonable distance knew beforehand about the vintage bottles. I don't know. But I'm pretty sure that everyone ordering a case would want one, which may be a better comparison to the people that attend DL day as it's a brewery only beer release afaik. And if you're at the brewery already... It beats standing in the cold overnight. Well, I suppose some sitting happened. And talking up the value... Well, I'm actually trying to help a friend out here. I won't even be at the tasting where it's being opened if the trade happens. Don't have much of a dog in that fight. The bottle I had available I sent to a regular trading partner in a random box given that I was able to try it on tap. I think after talking to Darron at Pelican about the '08, that my assessment in a solid one. You could always email them and ask an opinion on how it's doing. He's a straightforward guy. In any case, I still am appreciative of the feedback. And I agree that speculation about the quality, eyes not seeing the trade post, etcetcetc all play into this scenario. I think that most of my questions have been answered. It may. Just be a new era in trading where a lot of the classic white whales are being replaced by the next comer. And I don't know that it's a bad thing. Just was somewhat surprised that this trade didn't happen, though the input here helps me understand. Again, I sent away my 'trade bottle' to a good trader unsolicited. Just so we're clear that I'm not 'hyping' this beer.
At the risk of sounding like a HF homer, Pelican isn't exactly a spot that you just drop by casually now-and-then to see what's on the shelf, at least for most Oregon BAs. Granted there are other reasons to be out on the coast, but it's a pretty long drive to make, just to see if they have some vintage bottles for sale.
Everyone knows that the drive to HF is fraught with danger while roads to other remote breweries are paved with rainbows
one thing to consider about an 08 - current perfect storm/MoaS vertical is that from the vertical there really is only 1 or 2 tough to get bottles. sure the 10 is probably tougher now than last year, but this beer is sold by the case. the newest one JUST got released and it will be announced who gets the overflow in less than a week. there are still plenty of 2011's around that could be had for whatever limited release or even locals from the right trader. 2010 a bit tougher, 2009 and 2008 obviously get tougher and tougher. so what is the motivation to give up a monster for a vertical that you could piece together with lesser monsters. also the monsters you are looking for are highly regarded and often used as trade bait for other monsters. 08 stands a chance of landing something fairly big in my opinion, but many people are just fine missing out on the oldest and enjoying a new vintage with the exception of completists. just my thoughts. most people with wooden hell and/or BVDL are looking more for the new shiny whalez like ann or BA Hunah or whatever is coming out next week that will be held for ransom. the main problem as i see it is that because moas is sold by the case only, it doesn't get the love it should get because it is pretty easy to find people who want to split a case or ended up with way more bottles than they need/want. don't get me wrong, it is a phenomenal beer...and way underrated for what it is, but when things are sold by the case, they are out there. if pelican sold it at a 2 bottle limit, you'd see it's stock rise.
I remember someone looking to trade 2 bottles of Wooden Hell for 1 '08 PS with no luck back when that beer caught fire. That was an impossible bottle to land then. I'd still love to try it but I don't think I ever will so I'll have to be content with the 2009 batch.
Yeah, and saying theyve been leaking it out on rare occasions seems a bit misleading. Stopping by on a random date will never get a vintage bottle. An allnighter or crack of dawn arrival in the winter on one day might. If they ever do it again.
Trying to trade one specific rare beer for another specific rare beer requires the stars to align perfectly. I'd offer any number of bottles for a PS08 but no I don't have a VB DL. I'd happily trade some Partridge, Isabelle, DDG level stuff and add on. I wouldn't even try for the vertical because the 2008 is the only valuable bottle.
Had to add a king Henry to my 08 perfect storm for a BAVDL. Didn't bother me that much. It's a 5 year old BA BW. It's not getting any better
