Sierra Nevada Summerfest 2020

Yeah, bottom line is that there's enough style drift over a long enough period of time to produce significant enough differences.

I don't know if it's a common feature nowadays, but originally Bohemian Pilsners featured a triple decoction, due to the naturally soft water, which accounted for a lot of the heftier malt profile.

 

This is certainly the case still with PU, maybe with Budvar as well. I haven’t had Budvar in awhile so I may not be remembering correctly.

 

Only talking about what enters my bloodstream. ;-)

 

Pour an Urquell alongside a Summerfest and you'll find the Urquell to be a deeper shade of gold, closer to bronze.

 

Well, that is one distinguishing feature.

Perhaps the below graphic would be helpful to you:

 

Decoction brewing was necessary back in the olden days to deal with undermodified malts. When utilizing contemporary malts. which are well modified, decoction brewing is a choice.

During my tour of the Pilsner Urquell brewery they emphasized they still brewed the 'old way' and went the 'extra mile' and did triple decoctions. Other Czech breweries still conduct decoction mashing but some opt to perform double decoctions which save brewing time and saves on energy costs.

Many (most?) German breweries have gotten away from decoction mashing since it is not necessary and it is energy intensive (read: expensive). I discussed this aspect as regards Ayinger in a recent thread:

“When I visited Ayinger, I was not surprised to find the standard four-vessel arrangement typical of decoction breweries. But the mash cooker was in disuse. Immediately after installing the new brewery, Ayinger ditched decoction. My tour guide, John Forster, was dismissive. “It’s more effective now to do infusion. We say decoction is for old breweries. We can do it, but it’s not necessary.”

http://allaboutbeer.com/decoction-mashing/

Cheers!

 

Budweiser Budvar is brewed via double decoction:

“Budvar is brewed in a particularly beautiful traditional brew house with copper mashing and boiling vessels set on tiled floors. A double decoction mash is used.”

https://beerandbrewing.com/dictionary/XXBh1Z0eUk/

Cheers!

 

Thanks for the info! Yet another reason to love that beer.

Na zdravi!

 

Which is a shame really. (Not that I'm claiming to be any better.) I don't know if you're using "pedantic" in a negative way here, but these(we) "enthusiasts" are doing a terrible job of giving credit where credit is due. It seems we're content with categorizing Czech beers as Baltic porters, Vienna lagers, and Munich Dunkels. It's embarrassing. I'd happily open the door to the Czech pedants.

I know what you're getting at, but word-for-word that's exactly what it is.

I expect better from a man like you than to quote the Brewer's Association / BeerAdvocate guidelines as research. Their "commercial examples" are Firestone's "Pivo" for "German" and Mama’s Little Yella Pils for "Bohemian." No agenda there.

Regarding ABV - You're probably thinking of "high gravity beer" as in high original gravity rather than final. As @Jacobier10 was pointing out, the ABV would depend on both original and final gravity... but if the BA was commenting on ABV, then they were probably indicating the tendency for the Czech beers to have a lower ABV due to a high final gravity (I'm speculating about intent and gravity stats)... which would make sense. To use your example - as a ležák, Pilsner Urquell is actually a bit strong in its land. It's lower in ABV than a typical popular German Pils, but it's higher than a typical 4% Czech 10° "pilsner" beer (which I believe are more common than the 12°).

Absolutely.
I appreciate your approach. I consider myself to be pretty ignorant, but I think people utilize these things far too definitively.

 

I'm all for more styles, and really, the Czechs should have more to themselves rather than being thrown under the German category with one single distinct type. I guess the problem is that Czech uses additional letters in their alphabet which are not found in English with pronunciations that aren't know to English either. It's hard to spell Lezak or Tmave with the additional diacritics.

 

Not quite sure what about Summerfest is "Czech" really.

It doesn't exclusively use Saaz hops, and it even has Munich malts in the malt profile.

The IBUs seem a bit lower than a Czech pale lager might have at 28 IBUs.

And as others have stated, the color is lighter than one would expect.

I just call Summerfest "delicious". And call it a day.

@Glider if you want a good example of how different a German and Czech Pilsner/pale lager can be, try to find a fresh(ish) Jever and drink it next to a fresh(ish) Pilsner Urquell.

I think using the catch-all term "Czech Pilsner" is a disservice to the different styles based on gravity that they offer.

I believe a Desítka, Czech for "10", (or 10° OG Czech pale lager) is the most popular style in the Czech Republic, but I also believe you can find a fair amount of Dvanáctka, Czech for "12" (or 12° OG Czech pale lager) as well. See Pilsner Urquell.

The Desítka will likely fall between 4 - 4.5% ABV, while Dvanáctka will fall between 4.5 - 5% if I recall correctly.

 

Maybe it should be classified as Czerman. Whatever you want to call it, it's a nice refreshing beer for this time of year.

 

I've seen those terms, but I more frequently see:
výčepní, ležák, speciál (from weaker to stronger)
... with the above covering a degree range rather than being tied to a specific number.

And it's only once in a blue moon, but I've seen stolní and lehké on the light end of the spectrum.

BUT, I'm pretty much in the dark here compared to terms from other cultures (like Germany)... and this highlights why it's a shame that the broader culture has ignored these things (relatively speaking). It feels like there has been more deliberate emphasis on this stuff lately though. A step in the right direction.

 

Oh sure, I'm expected to better, but you get to boil a definition down to its literal source? Maybe we should call it California Uncommon?

I admitted I was taking the easy route as a point to be made, but I didn't go directly to the Brewer's Asoociation or (god forbid!) BJCP -- didn't want to get scorned again.

Maybe I'll dig out my Eckhardt Style Guide, or the Classic Beer Styles Series for the sake of real obscure research?

 

Required a separate response that wasn't sarcastic.

Agreed.

 

Lock the thread.

 

Admittedly I'm no expert, I just love Czech beers. I have yet to visit the Czech Republic myself, but I'd like to think visiting and following Notch allows you to get a little slice of what it's like.

My cousin recently visited Prague last year and said you go to the bar and order a Desítka or a Dvanáctka, and beyond that he saw many people also order a Mlíko pour, which is mostly foam.

But yeah, the styles get more specific than that as you alluded to in your post.

For example, Notch's flagship "Session Pils" is called that because the actual style name, Světlé Výčepní Pivo, wouldn't really translate to your average craft beer drinker.

Chris from Notch had a good analogy for how to think of different Czech pale lager styles: it's akin to how the English Bitter can be broken down into Bitter, Special Bitter, Extra Special Bitter.

Here's another great explanation in the link below from Ron Pattinson:

http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/2008/05/czech-beer-styles.html

Also, as you said, US craft brewers are starting to become better about this. And using some of these terms rather than lazily saying, "Czech Pilsner". Notch is one of them, also locally in NH Schilling is doing something similar.

I have a Schilling beer in my fridge right now that is specifically labeled as a "Northern-Style German Pilsner". So they're also recognizing there's a difference between Northern and Southern-Style German Pilsners.

No!

I love talking lagers, and more specifically Summerfest.

 

Well yeah, you have stock! I haven't seen a Summerfest since 2019.

 

It is strange that mine was bottled early April, yet nationwide, only 246 people have checked into it on Untappd. I know that is not the end all be all but it must be slow getting rolled out, normally that number would be much higher.

 

Somewhat ironically those terms were 'invented' by the BJCP in past style guidelines for their beer competitions. For the 2015 update they chose to use terms more reflective of how beers are described in Great Britain: Ordinary Bitter, Best Bitter, Strong Bitter. Earlier today I brewed my annual English Bitter Ale which would fall within the BJCP category of Best Bitter.

FWIW when I was in the Czech Republic last fall for two weeks I never seen in beer menus anything like Desítka or Dvanáctka. What was written on the beer menus (electronic blackboards, paper menus) was 10° or 12° and at the numerous pubs I went to the number of 12° beers greatly outnumbered the 10° beers. I would order a beer brand and I just knew it was a 12° beer. Maybe in the countryside the 10° beers are more popular?

Cheers!